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Post more articles to the front page

By Eloquence in Meta
Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:08:04 PM EST
Tags: Kuro5hin.org (all tags)
Kuro5hin.org

The article "Dawn of the GNU Cooperative" has been on the top of the front page for two days now. This is not an exception, it is the rule. Since Rusty has fixed a bug that caused articles being voted "section only" to be posted on the front page, the front page volume has decreased a lot. Apparently, this is because with most articles, the majority feels that they should be posted "section only". I think we may need to readjust the rules.


First, it's great that selected articles get a lot of focus, but two days on the front page without a change of position is clearly too much. The articles don't benefit from it either -- after a certain number of comments the discussion usually dies off. OTOH, several interesting articles have been posted section-only and received much less discussion than they, IMHO, deserved.

Now you may say: "OK, you feel this way, but the majority of K5 users obviously feels differently." But that's not the point. Most articles are only interesting to a minority, that doesn't mean they should never end up on the front page.

So my solution proposal is pretty simple: Instead of requiring a simple majority for the front page / section decision, make it a two-thirds majority. If 66 % of readers think an article should be section-only, then it probably should. But if more than a third of K5's users feel that an article should be put on the front page, that's where it should be.

That would increase frontpage volume again, and I wouldn't have to browse the sections so much for interesting articles, or the crowded "everything" section. The value could be adjusted again if the number of submisisons increases significantly.

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Poll
Too little front page activity?
o Yes, and the suggested fix should be applied 45%
o Yes, but I have a different idea, see my comment 13%
o No, and it shouldn't be changed 15%
o I demand a recount! 26%

Votes: 119
Results | Other Polls

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Post more articles to the front page | 35 comments (34 topical, 1 editorial, 0 hidden)
I agree (3.93 / 15) (#2)
by rusty on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:05:14 PM EST

While having frontpage churn somewhat low is good, IMO, I'd prefer it be more like 3 or 4 articles a day, instead of 0.3. It varies, obviously; some days there just isn't anything front-page-worthy. But, looking at the everything page, I see several articles since the GNU CO-op one that I would've voted front page for, including Weblogs and online diaries for corporate settings, The new breed of IT Manager, and Sendmail to discontinue Open Source version soon?.

The will of the voters will always rule, but it may be a good idea to reconsider your personal criteria for front-page. In fact, what are people's criteria for voting front page? I suspect I do it more than a lot of you, because I vote FP on way more stories than get posted there. Just to say, you have only your lights to guide you, but don't be afraid to vote front-page. :-)

____
Not the real rusty

Make the Front Page Volume based (4.40 / 5) (#5)
by sugarman on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:21:36 PM EST

Hey Rusty,

Brought this up on Scoop a while ago, but this seems to be the appropriate place.

Make the Front Page a volume-based queue instead of ones that get modded appropriately. The only choice is for things to get sent to the section page, and once an appropriate number of posts (eg 60) are posted to the topic, it pops to the 'Front Page'. Basically, the front page would be a big 'Hot Topics' section.

Naturally, site announcements like the recent diary addition could also go up Front, and the editors could apply their discretion as well (though I'd argue that they should be promoting stories to the front page rather than removing them.)

The thing that would need to be resolved would be how this interacts with 'Hot Topics' that don't make it out of the submission queue (the 2nd im-ur story comes to mind). I take it they should stay in the queue.

Just a thought. What do you think?
--sugarman--
[ Parent ]

I Agree! (1.75 / 4) (#8)
by Scriven on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:47:59 PM EST

Is there a method for simply agreeing with a message, without actually having to reply with another post merely saying "I Agree!"?

Since I don't know of one, I'll just do this:
I Agree!


--
This is my .sig. It isn't very big. (an oldie, but a goodie)
[ Parent ]
Yes. (3.80 / 5) (#18)
by pb on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 06:53:46 PM EST

You can moderate it up.

(if you agree with this, moderate it up; if you don't, well, moderate it down! If you want to enlighten me as to your reasoning, well, reply! :)
---
"See what the drooling, ravening, flesh-eating hordes^W^W^W^WKuro5hin.org readers have to say."
-- pwhysall
[ Parent ]
No (3.50 / 4) (#22)
by earthling on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:32:49 PM EST

I don't think that you should base your moderation on whether you happen to agree or disagree with the author.

In my opinion, comments should be moded up because they raise some interesting points, and moded down if they don't have anything relevant or new to add the discussion.

If you agree/disagree with the points made, then by all mean reply to that post to make your opinions heard.

-Earthling
"I'm sorry, I had too; the irony was just too thick."

-Earthling
"I'm sorry, I had to; the irony was just too thick."
[ Parent ]

I see your point, but... (4.50 / 6) (#27)
by pb on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 08:24:25 PM EST

If all you want to do is say "Yeah, I agree, that's what I was going to say, but you said it better!", you might just rate the comment as a +4, for instance; but that's only if you really don't have anything new to add to the discussion.

The rest of my comment was just me being silly, to see if I could get some +1 or +5 moderations. (which I usually get anyhow, instead of replies; you're right, I'd much rather get flames and praise instead of those, but that's not gonna happen...)
---
"See what the drooling, ravening, flesh-eating hordes^W^W^W^WKuro5hin.org readers have to say."
-- pwhysall
[ Parent ]
A regular flow of N new stories a day. (4.00 / 3) (#13)
by Paul Crowley on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:41:26 PM EST

Several people have raised this solution, and it clearly seems like the right one. Every, say, four hours, Scoop should pick a story from the queue and put it on the front page.

I see no reason why a story that gets posted to a section shouldn't later be promoted to the front page.

But I don't think sections should have the same rule: it makes sense for sections to be busy sometimes, quiet other times. Section selection should be decided on some individual-merit based criteria, rather than competition criteria.
--
Paul Crowley aka ciphergoth. Crypto and sex politics. Diary.
[ Parent ]
*bzzt*, too easy to attack... (4.00 / 3) (#20)
by ramses0 on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:28:52 PM EST

All I'd have to do is post a stream of crap into the story queue, and eventually one of those crap stories would make it to the front page.

And if all the stories in the queue are 11, 12, -3, 4, with ~400 votes apiece, I think it's totally appropriate that the story with score 12 doesn't get posted.

Quantity is no subsitute for quality, IMHO.

--Robert
[ rate all comments , for great justice | sell.com ]
[ Parent ]

I don't see how your attack works. (3.00 / 2) (#35)
by Paul Crowley on Fri Nov 17, 2000 at 12:26:22 PM EST

You can post all the random crap you want, but the queue would have to fall silent for a long time before any of it got posted. If the queue gains even one non-crap story for every story posted to the front page, then your crap will never make it.

I think you're right that there's a case for tweaking what I've proposed so that if nothing is above a certain threshold then nothing gets posted, but while kuro5hin still has a community of active users this condition should never be triggered.
--
Paul Crowley aka ciphergoth. Crypto and sex politics. Diary.
[ Parent ]
Wrong question? (4.25 / 4) (#15)
by analog on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 06:04:37 PM EST

what are people's criteria for voting front page?

I think I'd be more interested in hearing people's reasons for voting to section instead of front page. I had originally thought (based on the comments people made when they were asking for it) that voting to section was for stories that had limited discussion possibilities or appeal, but were good enough that you didn't want to just dump them. However, it doesn't seem to get used that way; I've seen several stories in sections only that I though were good front page material.

<soapbox>
One thing I have noticed that may be contributing to this is an increasing tendency for people to have a "that isn't what K5 is for; we're better than that" reaction to stories that hint of being just the tiniest bit mundane or mainstream. I find it interesting that people will write paragraphs about the subject matter of a story, and then vote it to section because "it's not front page material".

Kuro5hin is a neat place. You can discuss things with people you would likely never get the chance to actually meet, and be exposed to (sometimes radically) different viewpoints; thus far, you can also do it all with a minimum of BS. These are all good things, but it doesn't mean that some arbitrarily elevated standard must be applied to those conversations. A discussion about your favorite brand of hot dog is worthy if it does indeed become a discussion. Let's all just take a tiny step back and get over ourselves.

Instead of looking for reasons to not post something to the front page, how about finding reasons to post it? If you'd like to talk about something but think it doesn't have particularly broad appeal, hey, +1 to section is for you. And if I see one more "I don't care about this; -1" post I'm going to scream. If you don't care, vote "I don't care"; what the hell do you think that option is there for? Let the people who do care decide whether or not it goes forward.
</soapbox>

Okay, I feel better now...

[ Parent ]

Why section only? (3.42 / 7) (#3)
by Vygramul on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:16:49 PM EST

It seems that sometimes articles are voted section-only for editorial reasons rather than content. I tend to vote things to the section pages if they don't interest me much unless it's a topic I know is hot or lots of people find interesting. I admit that I tend to vote to sections articles that might be interesting but are could have been written better.

Should the QUALITY of a news item be considered for posting to the front page? Should they be rejected outright rather than voted to the section page?
If Brute Force isn't working, you're not using enough.

Who is the front page aimed at? (3.71 / 7) (#4)
by jesterzog on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:19:48 PM EST

I came here as a former slashdotter a few months ago. (Now I'm definitely hooked.) One of the things that was difficult to get my head around, being used to slashdot, was that the articles never seemed to change much.

I don't know if more articles on the front page is the right way to go or not - my usually routine these days though is to not even bother looking at the front page, jump straight to the everything page then check the submission (like I'm doing now).

I was wondering how many k5 readers actually make use of the front page. Is it aimed at experienced users, or new users?

If anything, it might be useful to have an obvious link at the top of the front page to see all new stories, just so people don't get the first time impression that k5 is extra dormant and never gets new stories. (There's the 'everything' link in the middle of the sections, top right, but it's not very obvious or descriptive for new people.)


jesterzog Fight the light


front page is seemingly aimed at new users (3.66 / 3) (#33)
by Blake on Fri Nov 17, 2000 at 02:29:10 AM EST

I am, with pride, a new user. I'm just beginning to get a feel for the site and how things work (this being perhaps my 4th visit). Your mention of the 'everything' link is the first I'd realized its existence. Thanks.

Looking at this 'everything' page, I find it much more practical. But, for my first few uses, the front page worked as a fantastic introduction to this community and did well to give me a taste of kuro5hin.

Btw, thanks for pointing out that 'everything' link.

[ Parent ]

Alternative way of doing it (4.30 / 13) (#6)
by vastor on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:30:50 PM EST

I was kind of surprised that it was done this way. While I'm sure this has been discussed before I'll suggest it anyway.

Just have a single +1 vote. Once it hits the first target (+78 votes or whatever it happens to be today) then it gets posted to a section. Then out of those in the sections you have another mechanism that decides if it makes it to the front page - either additional voting or base it on page views/comments (comments would indicate its a lively discussion while votes would get things to the front page that might be worth seeing but slower on the discussion side. Page viewings just makes it kind of popularist and would probably need a check to make it unique page viewings by logged in users or something like that - a votes/comments hybrid would probably be better).

Then when the second threshold is reached it gets posted to the front page. Every day spent on the front page could have the determining threshold reduced - so the first day if it had 110 points to get posted to the front page (and the threshold is 90) it'd be at 100%. The second day it might have 115 points but only 90% of those count. The third day 80% of 120 points. Then whenever it falls below the threshold it is off the front page again (or you just take the top 10 articles currently in the sections to be on the front page with the percentage dropoff per day as a mechanism to get more sharing the space).

Those values could all be fine tuned, but hopefully it makes it understandable what I'm suggesting.

So if its a slow news period you'd still be getting good articles on the front page but you'd still have some of the best from a previous faster period (the weekend?) hanging about and as soon as some really popular ones arrived they'd quickly displace the ones that only made it because it was a slow period.

This should make for a steady stream of fresh stuff for the front page and on slow days you'll get more minority stuff showing up (which is good for diversity) and on busier days you'll get mostly just the majority stuff.

Disappearing from the front page shouldn't affect an articles position in a section (so if things were really weird it could even put in a re-appearance on the front page a day after dropping off it, but I couldn't see that happening often). Maybe there would need to be a 24hr minimum stint on the front page too (just to stop lots of chopping and changing).



A simplified alternative (4.00 / 4) (#14)
by vastor on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:48:32 PM EST

Which would involve basing it on the ratio of +1, 0 and -1 votes.

The more 0 or -1 votes there are by the time it takes to reach the approval threshold the less likely it is to be appropriate to the front page.

So maybe add the 0 and -1 votes to see what they are relative to the +1 votes. This front page one approved article had like 70 +1 votes and probably only 10 to 15 0s and -1s combined when I had a look so was clearly suited to the front page (where it ended up).

Others however might have 100 or more 0s and 1s combined (like one which is finally nearly approved now) and thus is much more suited to be section only.

This if you add the 0s and 1s voted on an article together for all the articles in sections you'll get a weighted index where the lowest combined scores should be posted to the front page. Then maybe just add +2 votes to the combined score for every day old the article is and it'll eventually end up beyond the front page level (the figure could be fine tuned to find what works - it'd be a direct adjuster to the speed of front page turnover so maybe an occassional front page poll would ask if to increase/decrease/keep it the same for fine tuning - for that matter, it could become a user preference too).

So something approved with only 10 "opposing" votes (0s and 1s) might spend another two days on the front page compared to one with 14 "opposing" votes. The day value might end up at +5 or +10 rather than +2, it was just a number I pulled out of the air (as I often do).

If the two +1 options were kept, they could perhaps be adjusted to become +1.1 for front page calculations only and +0.9 for front page calculations only (or something along those lines so votes are still weighted to see who ends up on the front page - "opposing" votes would then have to be adjusted in ratio too since the voting stops as soon as the approval-to-a-section voting is completed).

The only problem with this system is that it doesn't reflect highly relevant postings to a section that may not be relevant to the front page but I think the +0 votes would probably balance that out (and if it doesn't, the few misapproved posts would be useful in diversity since they'd be considered the best of their section still).

But this is a simpler mechanism than in the post I'm replying to (and hopefully it'd be a bit easier for people to understand when voting etc than the other alternative I suggested).



[ Parent ]
damn bugfixes (2.66 / 12) (#7)
by mikpos on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 04:47:16 PM EST

The easiest solution would be to get Rusty to put that bug back in.

Well-Discussed Topic (4.00 / 12) (#9)
by interiot on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:12:44 PM EST

This is a relatively consistent theme for stories throughout K5's history:

Either the K5 community is polarized wrt. front page activity, or the activity itself keeps swinging back and forth for various reasons (not least of which could be these stories).

So, before people argue over it too much, perhaps the old arguments should be revisited so we don't have to rehash them. By now, we have a good set of pros/cons as to why stories should be posted on the front page or should be put in a section. Perhaps they should be abstracted/articulated/summarized now. What criteria should be used for deciding speed-of-front-page or front-page-voting-threshold?

Suggestion (3.33 / 3) (#11)
by interiot on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:21:32 PM EST

Here's an idea: the thing that seems to bug people either way is that stories aren't staying on the front page long enough. Either they don't stay on long enoug, or the same old stuff stays there forever.

So, the proposed solution would be to have a knob that Rusty could set that would determine how long stories stay on the front page (eg. 48 hours). If the front page starts getting a little long, then the front-page-threshold goes up a bit. And if it gets a little short, the threshold goes down.

Then people could start commenting that the quality of the front page sucks, but that'd be their own fault for not posting enough good stories. :)

[ Parent ]

Y (3.66 / 3) (#19)
by titus-g on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:02:44 PM EST

Although it might be better to have the knob (ooerr missis) linked to popularity rather than just time, some FP articles do remain relevant and still attract discussion after a 48 hour period, others (such as the one I posted, which has probably just dropped off) arouse a lot of initial interest but not very much discussion, because there isn't much to say.

It's very much a damned if I do, damned if I don't kind of thing. Mainly because it's not just code but also a lot of other stuff (pychology, sociology, advertising, media, frog).

I guess you could let people continue voting on FP stories and drop them back to the section when either they get voted there, or the votes die off.

Then again that's all a bit complicated, forget I said it.

--"Essentially madness is like charity, it begins at home" --
[ Parent ]

Bugs were driving issue in past (3.00 / 1) (#30)
by kmself on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 10:19:15 PM EST

There were some well-known bugs which were generating front-page churn for a time. After this bug was fixed, there was apparently some gun-shyness about voting stories to the front page. This is starting to slack a bit, but only just.

I tend to agree with the viewpoints that:

  • This should be a semi-auto tunable parameter that the site admin (Rusty) can set.
  • That story positioning should be determined by a number of factors, including vote, but also activity, comment posts, rating of these comments, etc.

--
Karsten M. Self
SCO -- backgrounder on Caldera/SCO vs IBM
Support the EFF!!
There is no K5 cabal.
[ Parent ]

disagree (2.80 / 10) (#10)
by enterfornone on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:14:24 PM EST

The purpose of the front page is to leave articles there so they can be discussed in depth. The sort of artices that should be voted to the front page are the ones that are able to remain there without getting old.

Kuro5hin isn't a news site, it's a discussion site.

--
efn 26/m/syd
Will sponsor new accounts for porn.
backwards (3.00 / 3) (#21)
by dsilverman on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:29:06 PM EST

Actually, that seems more like what a topic page would be for, while the front page would hilight all of the new discussions of merit in the various topics, allowing you to check out topic pages later to check back on older, more in-depth discussion. Wouldn't that make sense, or should it for some reason be the opposite?

----
"Speak softly, and carry a big stick."
[ Parent ]
My k5 routine (3.00 / 2) (#26)
by enterfornone on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 08:19:49 PM EST

I actually have a routine. First I check the front page. See if anythings new and take note of how many comments are on the front page articles. If there is something new I read it. If an old discussion has a lot of new comments I read that too.

Then I check everything. Read through any new stories that have appeared. After that, if there is anything in the mod queue I take a look at that.

Then I will take a look at my comments and stories to see if anyone has replied to anything I have written.

Lately, after all that, I have then been checking the diaries.

But I never touch the individual sections. So yeah, your theory does seem backwards.

--
efn 26/m/syd
Will sponsor new accounts for porn.
[ Parent ]

Funny (2.00 / 11) (#12)
by AgentGray on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 05:39:29 PM EST

I just find it ironic that this story got posted to the front page!



Where does this frustration stem from? (3.75 / 4) (#16)
by sl4ck0ff on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 06:14:38 PM EST

I think that things are going fine the way they are now. This is a community, people obvoiusly read the queue, and vote properly. You tested it yourself by writing the message. The community is now aware of the issue on the frontpage; because you are getting your point across, I don't think this is an issue. I think our mind as a community knows which articles are important, and creating new limitations concerning the frontpage could put our kuro5hin in jeporady.
/me has returned to slacking
Is it always, or is it now? (3.60 / 5) (#17)
by HypoLuxa on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 06:48:59 PM EST

One previous poster pointed out that this seems to be a topic that comes up pretty every few months. What I am wondering is whether or not the slowness of the front page recycles, thus the complaints about the slowness, come and go due to the articles that are being generated currently.

I only mention this because of the number of articles regarding the US presidential election that I have seen in the moderation queue over the past week or so. I have read most of them, but I have almost gotten to the knee jerk point of voting down anything having to do with it due to the overexposure. From reading the editorial comments posted, there are a lot of others who feel the same way, and a lot of articles are being voted down due to "topc saturation."

So what's happening right now is that a lot of articles are being generated and not posted to the front page. People are spending time writing more articles on the same topic, and they are getting voted down specifically because of that. In my mind, this has created a dearth of new and interesting stuff lately.

Is the system not working correctly, or is the system not working correctly right now? I would think that the possibilities of "slow news days" and topic staturation might have something to do with it.

--
I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons.
- Leonard Cohen

another tack (1.50 / 2) (#25)
by titus-g on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 08:12:56 PM EST

Might be to keep the articles that are dropped from the queue in an 'other' topic, that is dropped after time, or articles promoted if they draw interest.

But then that's getting kinda complex.

you've gotta wonder how rusty & Inoshiro keep up....

I suspect alien involvement...

K52 I tells ya

--"Essentially madness is like charity, it begins at home" --
[ Parent ]

Yet another suggestion... (3.00 / 3) (#23)
by winter on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:42:23 PM EST

Drop the "+1 Front Page" option and instead, after the story gets voted in, compare the final number of "yea" votes to "don't care" votes. If it exceeds some ratio (maybe 1:1; it'll likely need fine tuning), it gets sent to the front page. Maybe have a minimum requirement for total number of votes cast as well. If a story is supposedly worthy of a place on the front page, wouldn't we want to get it there as soon as possible? Seems like a good way to judge interest without waiting for a 2nd round of voting to decide. Workable?

counting "don't care" votes (3.00 / 2) (#28)
by janra on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 08:47:03 PM EST

compare the final number of "yea" votes to "don't care" votes

I like this. Not only does it not require extra layers of voting, it's a simple concept. If lots of people don't really care about the story, then it doesn't get front page (even if it does get posted to section).

It doesn't seem like the "don't care" votes do anything other than take the story off of the 'n new submissions' link in your user box.

On the other hand, there's been some stories (like just about anything MLP) that I like, and want to see posted, but don't want to see on the front page. Right now, I vote them to section if they're nifty links, but if we take it back to just yes/no/don't care and use the don't cares to determine whether it goes to front page or section, that could do bad things to the MLP section. Special sections that never hit front page? yuck. Some way of combining the +1 [section|front page] and "don't care" votes to determine section or front page? could be done, but I don't know how hard it would be (being as I'm very much a beginner to programming)
--
Discuss the art and craft of writing
That's the problem with world domination... Nobody is willing to wait for it anymore, work slowly towards it, drink more and enjoy the ride more.
[ Parent ]

I don't think any rules need to be adjusted (2.83 / 6) (#24)
by KindBud on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 07:47:49 PM EST

I think we may need to readjust the rules.

The readership has already spoken: fewer articles on the front page is not only what we want, it's what we've done. Why does there need to be a code or policy change?

I think a better idea is to allow each user to choose which section they would like to be their "Front Page" and let it go at that.

--
just roll a fatty

I hacked my own solution (4.00 / 5) (#29)
by Tim Locke on Thu Nov 16, 2000 at 09:18:53 PM EST

I prefer to see *every* story on the "Front Page", so I just bookmarked the "Everything" category.

Problem solved. If the "Front Page" ever turns into something interesting, maybe I'll bookmark it instead.

--- On the Internet, no one knows you're using a VIC-20.
Less Radical Solution (4.50 / 4) (#31)
by AEtherean on Fri Nov 17, 2000 at 12:03:52 AM EST

Personally, I like the current system. Sure, we have slow news days, but IMO that's better than the glut of stories you find on the front page of some other weblogs. There may be an argument for not having an entire day go by with no new headlines, but rather than some of the more complex changes proposed here, how about this: If an entire day goes by with no story making it to the front page, Scoop FPs the "published" story with the least 0's and -1's from the previous day. That would keep the current, people's choice, system in place, but prevent an entirely dry news day.

Let me know what you think.

Good idea (3.00 / 2) (#34)
by codemonkey_uk on Fri Nov 17, 2000 at 04:51:04 AM EST

If an entire day goes by with no story making it to the front page, Scoop FPs the "published" story with the least 0's and -1's from the previous day.
I'd been thinking recently that this, or something like it, would be a good idea.

K5 is not a breaking news site. This, I think, is clear. Recently I've been thinking that something is neaded to control the flow of stories, so that there is a queue of pending stories, and the best one(s) get(s) posted every X hours, (12, 24, a function of the active discussion - I've not thought it out in detail), but AEtherean's post describes a nice simple fix that could solve the "problem" without changing to much.


---
Thad
"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there is no good evidence either way." - Bertrand Russell
[ Parent ]

A threshhold solution. (3.00 / 2) (#32)
by carlfish on Fri Nov 17, 2000 at 12:21:51 AM EST

Keeping the front page 'ticking over' is a good idea, IMHO. kuro5hin isn't a news site - you don't need a new headline every hour, but it'd be nice to see a little more variety, a little more turnover. The paucity of stories makes kuro5hin look a lot less active than it really is.

The problem is that scoop is too binary, and can not see shades of grey. When you edit a magazine, there are good articles and bad articles, that's the easy part. On the other hand, there are "almost good enough" articles that aren't brilliant, but you keep around for next month just in case you don't get enough great ones.

Have a sliding scale to see what ends up on the front page. Over a certain number/proportion of votes, a story always ends up there. Under a certain threshhold, a story will always end up limited to its section. Between the two values, scoop is free to promote the highest ranked stories to the front page, if it finds that it is below some desired "front-page turnover rate". (say two posts per day.)

Another possibility is for scoop to promote stories from their sections to the front page, if the sectioned story gathers a certain density of discussion.

Charles Miller
The more I learn about the Internet, the more amazed I am that it works at all.
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