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Distributed Denial of Existence

By kitten in Meta
Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:02:54 AM EST
Tags: Humour (all tags)
Humour

One of the most frequent sights on kuro5hin is that of one user or group of users complaining, often loudly and viciously, about another. One need not look very hard in order to find scores upon scores of users who absolutely loathe each other. Thanks to this pre-existing community of people who hate each other passionately, I believe that we stand on a potentially lucrative and far-reaching social experiment: the Distributed Denial of Existence.


Over the years we've seen dozens of users leave K5, and dozens more "threaten" to do so, disgusted with the community in general. But more often than not, their anger is directed at a select few. Many suggestions have been offered to counter the growing numbers of troublemakers (perceived or otherwise) and the accompanying angst they cause. Some say that removing the Diary section would help; it would eliminate freeloaders and crapflooders in short order, ensuring that only those with something substantial to contribute would bother staying. Others have suggested various tweaks to the ratings system, modifications to the Scoop code, or demands that Rusty take a more active, hands-on approach to site administration.

Nevertheless, the problem continues, and users continue growing disgruntled, while others continue to snipe at each other (some more viciously than others).

In short, we have a ready-made, self-sustaining market comprised of thousands -- maybe tens of thousands -- of users who despise each other, a market that is ready to be exploited.


Contract killing

Traditionally, assassins-for-hire have been contracted on a one-on-one basis: Alice hates Bob, so she hires Carl to kill him, typically paying an outlandish fee to do so. There are of course exceptions to this rule -- sometimes it is an organization that does the hiring, for example -- but in general, a large sum of money is gathered by the client in order to hire a professional killer.

The amount of money involved in contracting a "hit" on someone is usually exorbitant -- money that the average individual does not have, or is not willing to pay for a petty vendetta.

Enter the concept of Distributed Denial of Existence.


DDoE attacks

As we have seen, kuro5hin is home to a large number of people who despise one another, and who sometimes form loose associations or factions around the target of contempt; group hatred, in other words. Yet few of these people - individually - have the means, the resources, the desire, or the ability to actually do anything about it. Even fewer have the financial wherewithal to hire an assassin on their behalf to do their bidding.

To solve this problem, I propose an organized system where users could pool their financial resources to "take care" of a troublemaker.

In essence, the system would operate like this: I will set a bounty on each K5 user's head and devise a safe, anonymous means whereby users could donate to accounts which correspond to other users whose lives they wish to terminate. Each user, though, has his or her maximum donation capped at a small fraction of the total bounty, ensuring that no one person can contract the killing - a significant number of people must want this person dead.

For example, Alice hates Bob, and the price on Bob's head is twenty thousand dollars. Alice can log into an anonymous server (more on that later), and donate any amount she likes to Bob's account, up to two hundred dollars. If enough people (at least 100, in this case) also donate to Bob's account, the bounty will be reached.

Then, I will then personally take the money and eliminate Bob.

Alone, it is doubtful Alice could ever raise the twenty thousand dollars, and it is further doubtful that her contempt for Bob is worth twenty thousand dollars to her. But it is much more plausible that her contempt is worth twenty, fifty, or a hundred dollars, and thus she makes the donation.

Much like Distributed Denial of Service attacks or distributed computing projects, in DDoE the resources of many - unimpressive on their own - are joined to attain a desired goal; a goal which would be outside the reach of any of the individuals acting alone but which, in large numbers, is easily attainable.


How DDoE Could Work

I'd like to discuss a few specifics of my proposed DDoE implementation at this time, but with a disclaimer: I am an assassin, not a programmer. The methods I will describe for the donation system are simply my general ideas; suggestions are welcome for refining it, or to propose something else entirely.

Q: What are your qualifications? What the hell do you know about killing?
A: This is not an easy one to answer. For reasons of security, I cannot reveal my exact methods; to do so would give potential victims an edge, a heads-up, and a way to prepare and defend. It will suffice to say that I have the training, the means, and the experience needed to get the job done.
I do wish I could be more specific, but due diligence must be exercised. If I went round saying "I'll kill them this way, with this weapon," I have less of a chance of a successful hit, and will have shirked my responsibility to donators to provide the service they are paying for.

Q: How will you track people down?
A: Again, for reasons of due diligence, I cannot be specific as to the methods I intend to employ. However, I am willing - if interest is strong enough - to perform one killing free of charge as a sort of "proof of concept", before actual donations are accepted. In this way you can be assured that I have the expertise and resources needed for the job.

Q: What are the legal aspects? If I donate and you're caught, won't I be subject to prosecution?
A: This is where the donation system comes in. The server will be located at HavenCo, which is in SeaLand, a sovereign Principality outside the jurisdiction of any nation's law enforcement. The money will from there be transfered to a Swiss bank account, under appropriate guises. (It is true that information regarding a Swiss account can be revealed if a "serious crime" is being committed, but it is extremely difficult to convince a Swiss judge of this, and in any case, appropriate money laundering techniques will be employed to erase the trail.)

I also intend to use top encryption methods, as well as message padding, to protect the donators. Message padding is, in essence, a means of making all data appear to be of the same length - with this combination, a law enforcement agency monitoring your upstream would be able to prove that you looked at the donation website, but would be unable to prove what you did - not even based on how much data you transferred, since all visitors will be transferring the same amount of data.

Given that there will be many times more "mere visitors" than actual donators, it will be impossible for any agency to level an accusation. A donator could simply claim they were "just looking", and there would be no way for anyone to prove otherwise.

To ensure the "one user, one donation" rule is followed, IP addresses will have to be logged - but again, employing 256-bit encrypted databases, on a machine located in an area virtually untouchable by any legal agency.

Again, I invite suggestions for refining these ideas - they are merely the general outline, and as noted I am not a programmer or cryptographer.

Q: How do I know you won't sing if you're caught?
A: The easiest answer is, I won't get caught. Again, I cannot reveal my exact methodology, but I am the best at what I do.
However, no criminal goes into crime with the intention of getting caught. For your ease of mind, I myself will have no access to the server - remote or physical. I will only get a message saying "The bounty on $user has been reached," and then pull the money and proceed with my work. Even if I were inclined to squeal, I would not be able to, for I would not know who donated - only that the donations were made.

Q: Can I make a donation to your account?
A: No. I am doing this for my own benefit as well - and killing myself would hardly allow me to reap the rewards. In addition I would find myself in a conflict of interest regarding the exercise of due diligence - if I kill myself, donations to other accounts would never be carried out, and I have a responsibility to my financial backers.

Q: What is the money being used for?
A: First and most obvious is personal profit. Let's face it - I am performing an extremely dangerous, highly illegal operation, and I deserve to be compensated for putting my life and liberty on the line.

The money is also used to cover expenses such as transportation or the purchase of weapons and other equipment. Should it become necessary, some of the money may be used to bribe politicians, manufacture misleading evidence (such as drugs), or for any other incidental expenses that may occur.

Q: I think a lot of people dislike me. How can I be safe?
A: You can't be safe from democracy in action. If the people have spoken through their pocketbooks, you are forfeit. If you are concerned about this, perhaps it is time to examine your behavior to determine why you are disliked so much, by so many.

Q: Are there any other services included?
A: One potential idea involves polling for final words that will befall the victim's ears. For example, let us suppose there is a user who whines incessantly, and at great length, about a specific topic X. The last words this person would hear could be something like, "X will never bother you again."

If this feature were implemented I would make every effort to deliver the phrase just before the victim is killed; however, circumstances may demand that I must kill before the phrase can be delivered. Until the logistics of this are fully worked out, this feature is on hold.


A Final Note

Some will object that this is an inherently fascistic scheme (aka KmherRou5hin). On the contrary - it is my belief that this system is patently concerned with liberty. At present, cabalistic enclaves of trolls, vandals and thugs run riot over all that is positive on this site, persecuting the isolated individual through weight of numbers. My proposal would even the odds; give the decent, common people of this community a fighting chance, and restore K5 to its rightful place as the most balanced and productive site around.

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Distributed Denial of Existence | 179 comments (166 topical, 13 editorial, 0 hidden)
That's It! (4.64 / 14) (#2)
by CheeseburgerBrown on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 04:49:48 PM EST

This article is the last straw: I'm leaving K5 for ever!


___
I am from a small, unknown country in the north called Ca-na-da. We are a simple, grease-loving people who enjoy le weekend de ski. Personally, I pref
What is it about the internet (3.60 / 10) (#3)
by RyoCokey on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 04:50:57 PM EST

...that brings out the retarded, whiny kid in grown men? I'd really like to know.



farmers don't break into our houses at night, steal our DVDs and piss on the floor. No
Easy: (5.00 / 4) (#4)
by CheeseburgerBrown on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 04:56:39 PM EST

Perceived lack of consequences.

It's the same engine that drives post-war looting, gang-rape and voicing vicious but popular opinions.


___
I am from a small, unknown country in the north called Ca-na-da. We are a simple, grease-loving people who enjoy le weekend de ski. Personally, I pref
[ Parent ]
So let's give them some fucking consequences (nt) (5.00 / 2) (#6)
by ubernostrum on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 04:57:46 PM EST




--
You cooin' with my bird?
[ Parent ]
Now, now (5.00 / 1) (#10)
by RyoCokey on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:12:47 PM EST

voicing vicious but popular opinions.

In my case, those are due to my distain for all forms life.



farmers don't break into our houses at night, steal our DVDs and piss on the floor. No
[
Parent ]
Why art thou asking? Thou clearly knowest [nt] (2.00 / 2) (#19)
by toulouse on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:28:25 PM EST


--
'My god...it's full of blogs.' - ktakki
--


[ Parent ]
THOU ART THOU'S WORST NEMESIS FOR THOU INSISTS ON (none / 0) (#74)
by Spencer Perceval on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:33:50 AM EST

UTILIZING ARCHAIC FORMS OF THE WRITTEN ENGLISH FORM HOPING TO PASS THOU OFF AS SMARTER THAN THE AVERAGE ENGLISH SPEAKER, THOUGH THOU FAILS MISERABLY BY ANY MEANS


All the animals come out at night - whores, skunk pussies, buggers, queens, fairies, dopers, junkies, sick, venal. Someday a real rain will come and wash all this scum off the streets.
[ Parent ]
"Thou's"? (none / 0) (#79)
by Xophmeister on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:41:10 AM EST

"Thou" is the second person singular nominative pronoun (i.e. "you"); "Thine", or "Thy" if you prefer, would be better. Also, "..pass thyself off...". I could go on ;)

[ Parent ]
please, go on (none / 0) (#80)
by Spencer Perceval on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:43:59 AM EST

(we are waiting)


All the animals come out at night - whores, skunk pussies, buggers, queens, fairies, dopers, junkies, sick, venal. Someday a real rain will come and wash all this scum off the streets.
[ Parent ]
Ah, "Ye Olde Flamewar"... (none / 0) (#81)
by Xophmeister on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:59:57 AM EST

...but no, not today.

[ Parent ]
If he won't, I will (none / 0) (#86)
by kesuari on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:42:26 AM EST

Correcting only the thous. There's other crap in there. I could go on.

THOU ART thine WORST NEMESIS FOR THOU INSISTS ON

UTILIZING ARCHAIC FORMS OF THE WRITTEN ENGLISH FORM HOPING TO PASS thyself OFF AS SMARTER THAN THE AVERAGE ENGLISH SPEAKER, THOUGH THOU FAILS MISERABLY BY ANY MEANS


[ Parent ]

Go on then ;) (none / 0) (#93)
by Xophmeister on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:02:38 PM EST

In English English (to be really pedantic), it's utilising; 'though Shakespearean/archaic/mediaeval English would have probably used some kind of elaborate, or otherwise flowery, metaphor! Furthermore, "smarter" is an Americanism (at least it is nowadays).

So forsooth, knave Spencer, thine statement previous beest only true in part. Methinks, however, that thine charlatanry knoweth not of satiety; and thou shalt forever writhe, hither and thither, in vain, as poor insect upon viscid cobweb, as thou hath thy commentry retarded.



[ Parent ]
Actually, (none / 0) (#123)
by it certainly is on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:11:35 PM EST

didn't we use Zs in old English, then send over some colonists to the Americas (who kept the Zs), then start using Ss instead of Zs, to ape the French?

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

In OE (5.00 / 1) (#126)
by kesuari on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:30:04 PM EST

In Old English there were no zeds (except in the odd Greek borrowing) :P Though I guess I'll let you off for the lc o in old. But you probably mean EMnE or something...

Originally, as I understand it, Z was used in words from Greek or Latin and S was used in words from French. The same applied to -our and -or. So sometimes you'd get funninesses like colour vs colorize, because one came from French and the other from Latin. Then you set over some fools to America and some other fools to Australia, and the fools who found themselves in America generalised on -ize and the fools who found themselves in Australia generalised on -ise (because it's so much more aesthetically pleasing). But in England, you still had the -ize/-ise split. Then some English institutions generalised on -ize, and everyone accused (not publically) them of being American and so I guess everyone there things -ize is American and -ise is British, when really, -ize is American and -ise is Australian or -ize is Latin/Greek and -ise is French and both are British.

With other spellings, a similar tale can be told of -our vs -or. Except this time it's some Australian institutions (like the Age, a newspaper from Melbourne though at the time of the generalisation it was called the Argus, or the Australian Labor Party) who generalises on -or, and then their accused of being American so, though for 130 years, they've spelt color as color, in 2001 they go off and spell color as colour. (Note that the Macquarie Dictionary (an Australian one) lists colorise as a word with colorize as an alternative after the main entry, but not colourise or colourize.)

And another one is program vs programme. It was originally program, but something to do with French theatre in England and voila, people started spelling it programme. In Australia, program is the normal spelling, but some insane people insist that it's an americanism and use the ugly pretentious programme.

Of course -or and -ise are the best spellings.

[ Parent ]

Touché ;) [n/t] (none / 0) (#141)
by Xophmeister on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 08:46:37 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Also, (none / 0) (#145)
by it certainly is on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 01:51:05 PM EST

I like this page: http://www.krysstal.com/english.html

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

*locks doors, hides under bed* (4.60 / 5) (#8)
by Fero on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:09:31 PM EST

Great article, very well written. I really liked how you write this, so very straight forward and lethal. And having been to your apartment and seen the various devices of killing and such, I don't doubt you can and would go through with this.

However, I do think the person about to be killed needs some kind of warning. If they're being such as ass that everyone wants to kill them they should be given an oportunity to remove themselves; after all, they might not be aware of exactly how much they are hated. Could the server be programmed to notify the person at 15 grand? Or, in the event we could all see how much our bounties are, we could pay our bounty down?

That being said, I'm going to go hide under the bed with my flash light and some non-perishable food.
*** MidKnight2501: i wish i had a real penis so i could go to Flex and have lots of gay-man sex. jagil:whitney... you'll never have gay man sex jagil: you're not a man

Sorry, but no. (5.00 / 2) (#12)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:17:11 PM EST

I had considered a "pay 150% of the bounty and weasel out of it", but there's problems with it.

First, I'd have to announce myself to the victim in some way. It simply won't do for me to casually stroll up and say "Hi, I'm about to kill you." No, the killing must be done as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Second, it would be an unfair balance - the rich would be able to do whatever they please and get away with it, while the poor, unable to afford the 150% bounty, would die. That is not the ideal I am going for.

Third, allowing a "warning" would compromise my responsibility to execute due diligence on behalf of my financial backers. They are paying for a service and I have a responsibility to do everything I can to ensure the task is completed.

Generally speaking, someone knows when they are disliked. The constant troublemakers are well aware that they are troublemakers, and therefore, if they fear consequences, they'll have to stop being jackassses.

Those who are not troublemakers are unlikely to have their bounty reached.

However, if they do, I will have no choice but to perform the service I have been paid to perform.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
*hides even farther under bed* n/t (5.00 / 1) (#14)
by Fero on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:22:18 PM EST


*** MidKnight2501: i wish i had a real penis so i could go to Flex and have lots of gay-man sex. jagil:whitney... you'll never have gay man sex jagil: you're not a man
[ Parent ]
Obvious way to do it (none / 0) (#66)
by Julian Morrison on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:01:01 AM EST

Allow counterbids.

To kill the guy, put money in slot A [__]

To save the guy, put money in slot B [__]

And on the timeout date, 20XX-XX-XX, the highest bidder wins.

Hope you're rich.

[ Parent ]

What if (5.00 / 1) (#9)
by aphrael on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:12:15 PM EST

What if people reach the amount needed for a bounty on you?

And how will you handle the case of multiple accounts fronting the same person?

I have addressed this. (none / 0) (#13)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:21:09 PM EST

As I said, the only person immune is myself - partially due to the fact that I am doing this for personal profit as well as the benefit of the community, and also due to the fact that I have an obligation and responsibility to my financial backers - the donators - to execute the task they have paid for. If I kill myself, I cannot perform the tasks on the other bounties, and will have shirked my responsibility.

As for multiple accounts, as I said, IP addresses will be logged and matched against previous donations to the same bounty account (using, as mentioned, top encryption on the databases, on a server that is unaccessable to any law enforcement). The exact way that will work is still in the planning stages - as I mentioned I am not a programmer or cryptographer, but that is the general idea.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
I'm sure you're not the only capable assassin (5.00 / 1) (#102)
by BugCatcher on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 03:53:53 PM EST

In fact I know of someone who incessantly hugs people but who is also very good at killing.

/me prepares an order of death to be delivered to kitten.

Are you the windshield, or the bug? Come to www.amorsley.net/bugsplat Now available in minty-fresh RDF!
[ Parent ]

I would imagine . . . (none / 0) (#15)
by ubernostrum on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:24:43 PM EST

That since the transactions would be carried out over the Internet, some form of credit card or whatnot would be required. And while it is certainly easy to obtain multiple k5 accounts, I don't foresee many people going to the trouble of getting lots of extra credit cards or bank accounts just to abuse this service; it's more work than your average k5 jackass is willing to go through.


--
You cooin' with my bird?
[ Parent ]
This is a disgusting, nay, reprehensible idea! (5.00 / 3) (#11)
by Russell Dovey on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:13:14 PM EST

Don't you see what you're doing? I really don't know how you can live with yourself, you irresponsible monster!

Your little scheme will cause those trolls who currently plague us with their incessant, negative whining and their penchant for voting down my stories to go underground!

They will adopt entirely anonymous accounts, make sure not to mention anything about where they live, and view any attempts to, say, stalk them at their workplaces with hostility and fear! The current climate we enjoy at this site, of knowing exactly who the trolls are and letting their simple, human decency (the decency that every human being shares, of course) restrict their little pecadilloes, will be shattered if you get your way!

Vote this dangerously unstable lunatic down, people! Before it's too late!

"Blessed are the cracked, for they let in the light." - Spike Milligan

Sir (5.00 / 1) (#16)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:24:56 PM EST

They will adopt entirely anonymous accounts, make sure not to mention anything about where they live,

As noted before, I cannot reveal my exact methods of tracking people down, but my means do not rely on anything the user himself says. True, I may occasionally refer to his posts if he makes it clear that he lives in, say, Seattle, but only because that would help narrow it down.

However, even if he does not give any information on his location, or gives false and misleading information, my methods are reliable.

The current climate we enjoy at this site, of knowing exactly who the trolls are

Under my plan, knowing who the trolls are means that the trolls had better behave.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
+1 FP HAHAHAHAHAHA (4.20 / 10) (#18)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:26:49 PM EST

q: when do you know you're fucked?

a: when you have more enemies/ friends on kuro5hin than in real life

at that point, you would actually care about this crap

all of your examples, and this article itself, is an example of people taking kuro5hin TOO SERIOUSLY

i have a lot of fun here, i am a grand troll on this site, but my ramblings here have a limit, and my hatred/ like for people here has it's limits, simply because this site is NOT MY FUCKING LIFE

it's just loose and easy fun to shout your mouth off here while wasting time at work

if you would actually care to buy murder from this author, then

stop

think

you have just been trolled to the extreme

you lose even if you get the person killed!

why?

because they died innocent, while you are now a cold blooded murderer for what reason?

BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEEN ROYALLY TROLLED ON KURO5HIN??!!

oh my god! then you have just poured concrete into the mold that defines how pathetic you are! LOL ;-P

buy the t-shirt instead:

http://www.jinxhackwear.com/scripts/details.asp?affid=-1&productID=137

the money would be much better spent ;-)

yours truly, troll circletimessquare


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

Careful.. (5.00 / 4) (#20)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:36:09 PM EST

i am a grand troll on this site, but my ramblings here have a limit, and my hatred/ like for people here has it's limits, simply because this site is NOT MY FUCKING LIFE

If you annoy enough people, this site could be your death.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
put $1,000 in my account to kill me! (3.50 / 2) (#28)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 06:14:16 PM EST

and you are missing out on a wonderful corrollating business idea, well in line with your suckall morals:

protection money:

"put $1,000 on this account or i'll kill you for the hell of it anyways"

reprieve money:

"i have $20,000 to kill circletimessquare, unless y'all raise enough to enough to stop me, say $5,000, he'll be dead in a month"

mercy money:

"circletimessquare is in my basement, with his mouth duct taped. pay me $500 and he dies quickly, if not, it's a slow painful death by ants."

see, you're really not that original, you're just another hack wiling to sink to new lows.

with that comment, did i get $5 from you in my account!

oh goody, goody!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

[ Parent ]

My 100 hotmail accounts will kill you in a instant (none / 0) (#87)
by leukhe on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:45:46 AM EST

You should really watch yourself. I have a hunderd spare homtail acccount and in a emotional instant I might spend 100x 200 $ (or euros) to have you killed.  Al already know a contractor for this.

For reason´s of anonimty i cannot reveal his name, but it is not a dog.

[ Parent ]

dude (none / 0) (#33)
by Kragg on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 08:05:39 PM EST

it's only 20 dollars.
--
"How can one learn to know oneself? Never by introspection, rather by action. Try to do your duty, and you will know right away what you are like." -- Goethe, Willhelm Meister's Travels.
[ Parent ]
Hmm... i note despair... (none / 0) (#89)
by Vesperto on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:10:34 PM EST

...and a severe lack of humour... IT'S A BANANA STORY!

La blua plago!
[ Parent ]
help up the ante (none / 0) (#172)
by smilinggoat on Mon Aug 04, 2003 at 05:54:00 PM EST

I just added $2k to your kitty sucka. circletimessquare is gonna frrrrrryyyyyyyyyyy!

~
Pure Data, where music looks less and less like itself.
[ Parent ]
Wow. (4.00 / 10) (#21)
by zipper on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:41:28 PM EST

So you stole the idea of Assassination Politics, implemented it badly, and added a heaping dose of Vitamin Unfunny.

Nice.

---
This account has been neutered by rusty and can no longer rate or post comments. Way to go fearless leader!
Heed the word of the Lord. (2.71 / 7) (#22)
by toulouse on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:42:37 PM EST

Jesus said:

  • Forgive them father, for they know not what they do.
  • Turn the other cheek.
  • Let he who is without sin cast the first stone...

...and also:

  • Suffer the little children...

Well the little children are evidently suffering, and I believe the hour is at hand when we must ignore most of the horseshit our Lord and Saviour imparted in order to put them out of their cursed misery.

Verily, the old testament has much to teach us, and you have learned your lesson well, and imparted a holy vision which we, in our infinite blindness, cannot forsake. Take us to the mountaintop. Time to burn some more bush.

+1 - best meta ever: For this is truly 'meta', unlike those fools who squander our cognitive faculties through whimsy and flippancy. Amen, brother, amen.


--
'My god...it's full of blogs.' - ktakki
--


Because there are multiple communities... (4.00 / 4) (#26)
by CodeWright on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 05:54:09 PM EST

...encapsulated within k5, it would be necessary to be able to register funds both for and against the DDoE of any individual poster, with only the difference applying to the cap for a particular DDoE contract.

In other words, if Alice, Bob, and Charlie donate enough to reach the $1,000 cap for the Melvin DDoE, then Zeke, Yorick, and Xizhang could choose to donate $500 against the DDoE cap. In this way, the anti-Melvin group would have to raise another $500 to effectuate the Melvin DDoE.

Furthermore, because this system essentially has different communities bidding against each other for the execution (ahem) of services, it would be necessary to keep the funds in escrow until the DDoE was fulfilled, at which point funds in excess of the DDoE cap could be returned to all parties.

--
"Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
Some points.. (5.00 / 1) (#27)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 06:06:45 PM EST

In other words, if Alice, Bob, and Charlie donate enough to reach the $1,000 cap for the Melvin DDoE, then Zeke, Yorick, and Xizhang could choose to donate $500 against the DDoE cap.

I think you're misunderstanding the proposed cap. Each individual can only donate a certain amount to the bounty of another user: Alice can only donate 200 to the DDoE of Melvin, but Bob and Chuck can also donate 200 each. David, Edgar, Fred, and George can also donate up to 200, until the total contributions of all the donators has reached the bounty of twenty thousand, at which point I am notified via secure channels "The bounty on Melvin has been reached."

Meanwhile, Melvin has no idea what the current donation total is. To give him that would give him a warning of when to go underground, hide, barricade himself in a concrete bunker, or whatever. I don't want to deal with that, and it's an unnecessary waste of my time. It's also a waste of the donator's money, and I have obligations to fulfill.

Sorry, but Melvin has no way of playing down his current running total, nor do Melvin's buddies. Even I will not know what the donations are - I will only know when and if the total bounty is reached. This is to protect the liability of donators.

The escrow idea is a good one, though. However, I'll need money for things other than my own profit - remember that some of the money (perhaps a large part) goes to weapons, transportation, bribes, manufacturing false evidence, etc. I cannot keep the money in escrow and have the required funds to carry out my duties.

I suppose I could take 50% up front, for expenses, and then upon completion, take the other 50%.

What say you?
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
That might be possible... (none / 0) (#29)
by CodeWright on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 06:42:33 PM EST

But I still have five points:

  1. First, I did not mean to suggest that people would actually be aware of the totals accumulated against any given user before making decisions to counter-register funds. Rather, if a given clique felt as though a particular member of their clique invoked the ire of other cliques to a disproportionate degree, they could pre-emptively choose to counter-commit funds which would be placed in opposition to those potential funds committed for the DDoE of that outspoken clique member.
  2. Specifically, my previous point addresses one which I do not believe you have adequately described -- namely, how are the caps for an individual's DDoE determined? I submit that there should be a certain universal minimum (say $20k) which should be sufficient to cover the costs of the process itself. However, any funds submitted towards an individual for the purposes of countermanding any funds committed towards the individual's DDoE should actually raise the cap (as described above). In essence, the clique in support of Melvin could pre-emptively decide to commit funds to change his cap from $20k to $25k in hopes of deferring his inevitable eventual demise.
  3. The above suggestion leads into this point which is a modification of one of my suggestions made in the previous post -- namely that funds should be remanded in excess of the cap. Because I have just described a mechanism whereby the cap may be set and adjusted by fund commitments, it is more reasonable to assume that both the funds committed towards the individual's DDoE and those committed towards increasing the cap of an individual should pass to the executor of the contract (particularly since any individual receiving pre-emptive elevation of his cap is most likely going to recognize the precariousness of his situation and take steps accordingly -- which would probably raise your costs above the normal minimum in any case).
  4. In the interests of sound business practice, I would suggest that a smaller percentage than 50% be remitted in advance of success.
  5. Finally, I think that it is against the egalitarian and democratic principles of this site and your own proposal to exclude any individual from this process, so I do not think it is appropriate for you to be immune to its effects. This translates to a necessity for multiple contractee options... I propose that this be resolved by allowing a user preference to be selected that would permit individual users to specify the minimum "DDoE cap" amount of money for which they would be willing to complete a DDoE contract. These "DDoE cap minimums" would actually be the thresholds that any "DDoE cap" would have to cross before being awarded by lottery to any eligible users. For that reason it becomes doubly important not to remit as much as 50% before the job is done, because a user may, in the interests of "gaming" the system, register an arbitrarily low number for which they would be willing to remit a DDoE contract -- at which point they would collect the upfront fee with no intent to complete. Hence, it would be necessary to have a period of performance for the completion of the contract where, if the DDoE contract winner did not fulfill their responsibilities, would immediately have the amount of upfront monies provided to them by winning the contract subtracted from their own DDoE cap. In this way, any "repeat offender" in the DDoE contract auction/lottery would eventually have an arbitrarily low DDoE cap, inevitably falling within the normal signal-to-noise ratio of fund commitment. This suggestion preserves the egalitarian and democratic ideals of k5 while still permitting exercise of the services you propose.


--
"Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
[ Parent ]
The problem is.. (none / 0) (#37)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 09:14:48 PM EST

I do not think it is appropriate for you to be immune to its effects. This translates to a necessity for multiple contractee options...

I understand where you're coming from on this, but I have to disagree.

If your suggestion were implemented, we'd basically have a few highly trained killers, and people would stop paying to have each other eliminated, instead preferring to pit the assassins against each other. Essentially the entire thing would be reduced to a gladiator ring, and while that might be an amusing Romanesque diversion, it would do nothing for the removal of troublemakers per se, which is the entire goal of the system.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
You misunderstand (none / 0) (#39)
by CodeWright on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 09:40:59 PM EST

The identity of the contractee executors would not be revealed -- no way to know who wins any individual contract.

--
"Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
[ Parent ]
Ah, I see. (none / 0) (#41)
by kitten on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 09:51:57 PM EST

Well, I'll take it into consideration but for now I'm deferring it to the next point release.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
I suspect (none / 0) (#47)
by CodeWright on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 11:08:04 PM EST

There may be something other than a diligent observance of quality assurance technique in your motivation.

--
"Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
[ Parent ]
Your misuse of words shakes my confidence... (5.00 / 2) (#78)
by Attackist on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:25:43 AM EST

Romanesque is a very specific word that refers to a very specific style of European architecture, popular from the 8th to 12th centuries A.D. and and characterized by massive walls, round arches, and relatively simple ornamentation.

Though your literal transgression is a relatively simple mistake, it gives me pause in that you may suffer similar misapprehension of definition regarding words such as 'encryption', 'anonymous' or (especially)'due diligence'. These concerns shake my faith in you competence in matters more serious than comment posting.

Like eager Icarus, you have undermined your own sales pitch by trying too hard, an overcompensation which betrays, among other things, a weak grasp of the basics and a propensity for error, neither of which are good qualities for an assasin.

"See, I will let you have cow's dung instead of human dung, on which you may prepare your bread." -- God Almighty

(/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\)
[ Parent ]

Sick, but Hilarious (2.00 / 1) (#31)
by localroger on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 07:12:56 PM EST

Really, wouldn't adding killfile capability to Scoop be a bit cheaper than setting up our own in-house Murder InKor5orated?

(Also you might want to remember the fate of Murder, Incorporated. Cool idea yes, pretty ending no.)

What will people of the future think of us? Will they say, as Roger Williams said of some of the Massachusetts Indians, that we were wolves with the min

Interesting, but... (3.66 / 3) (#32)
by SocratesGhost on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 07:15:55 PM EST

An offense doesn't exist only with the trolls, but also with those that make the trolls possible.

In light of that, I've got $200 with Rusty's name on it.

-Soc
I drank what?


I hate to tell you this... (5.00 / 1) (#56)
by martingale on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:39:49 AM EST

But your two $100 dollar bills are fakes. You need to have Ben Franklin's name on them.

[ Parent ]
+1 FP (2.00 / 4) (#34)
by Dinner Is Served on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 08:20:15 PM EST

Granted, I only read the first couple of paragraphs, but today is just one of those days. Hopefully this +1FP will reciprocate some light into my day.

So, the cable guy finally came to the new place today. Considering the fact that I didn't get any damn ethernet cable, it's really absurd that I got charged $50.00 for an installation fee. All the guy really did was flick a few switches around the back of the apartment complex. I did all the wiring and configuration because I don't want some technocrat messing with my shit.

I'm just glad the the download and upload speeds are decent. Though, they really should be scolded for reporting "Download speeds up to 1 Megabyte per second" on their website. Little bastards. Has anyone ever achieved anything over 200 KiB/s using cable? Uncapped, I mean.

So, I probably be heading to Spain this summer. I've got a few bucks saved up, but I'm not too worried about the money. If worse comes to worse, I could certainly do some hard labor while I am there.

Poll: Favorite type of ethernet medium?

Thick Coax
Thin Coax
Twisted Pair
Optical
Fibre
--
While I appreciate being able to defend against would-be rapists who might suddenly drop in from the sky, I don't appreciate not being able to see the Northern Lights. -- mfk
Yep (4.00 / 1) (#36)
by Bill Melater on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 08:42:22 PM EST

I'll probably get killed for going off-topic here [rimshot] but are you sure they don't mean megabits instead of megabytes? 1 MByte/s is about what you'd get thru 10 Base-T.

My last cable modem before this one I used to get fabulous speeds, peak was a little above 3 Mbits/s, average was probably around half that.

[ Parent ]

Nope, megabytes. (none / 0) (#50)
by Dinner Is Served on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 11:53:31 PM EST

That's a really nice speed. Do you mind sharing who it was with?
--
While I appreciate being able to defend against would-be rapists who might suddenly drop in from the sky, I don't appreciate not being able to see the Northern Lights. -- mfk
[ Parent ]
Ummm (5.00 / 1) (#65)
by Bill Melater on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 06:17:57 AM EST

The brain cells that had the company name have been, err, repurposed. It was in San Leandro, CA. I suspect that I just lived in the right neighborhood. The cable service was not really all that reliable ... used to go down mysteriously for days at a time with no explanation. Went to Road Runner when we moved. It's ... adequate.

When they say a "up to a megabytes/sec", they're blowing smoke up yer ass. Enjoy :)



[ Parent ]

Post it in your diary <nt> (none / 0) (#90)
by Vesperto on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:20:14 PM EST



La blua plago!
[ Parent ]
It was a dark and stormy night ... (4.23 / 13) (#38)
by pyramid termite on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 09:31:02 PM EST

In the shadows lurked the killer Kitten waiting for his assigned victim to come home. A car came down the road and pulled into the driveway of the house. Kitten coolly verified the identity of the driver and readied himself. It was his target. All he had to do was wait until the mark came up to the door.

As the man was fumbling with his keys, Kitten sprang out of the bushes with a maniacal laugh and threw something out of his pocket onto the doormat. Dice. 18 sided dice. Three of them.

"A 7 and a 14 and a 5 make 26 and my Mojo is 4 TO 1 OVER YOURS AND YOU'RE DEAD MOTHERFUCKER!!"

The man laughed. And laughed. And laughed. And laughed until he spit up his lungs laughing and died with the world's biggest smile on his face.

Kitten picked up his dice and threw a card on to the body. "Do Not Pass Go. Do Not Collect 200 Dollars. Your Diary Is Closed and Your Mojo is Gone.

"Signed,
Your Obsessed Enemies At K5."


On the Internet, anyone can accuse you of being a dog.
I thought 'twas like this. (5.00 / 9) (#59)
by Soviet Russian on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:58:33 AM EST

You hit the floating eye. You are frozen to the floor! The kitten bites! The kitten bites! The kitten bites! The kitten bites! The kitten bites! You die.. Do you want your posessions identified?

[ Parent ]
In fact... (5.00 / 4) (#43)
by fae on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 10:06:51 PM EST

People are perfectly able to contribute money to kitten's account, indirectly. All they have to do is to construct a new account for themselves, put in $20K, and trap kitten as he predictably hunts after them.

-- fae: but an atom in the great mass of humanity
Ok, sounds good (2.50 / 2) (#45)
by Kasreyn on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 10:29:32 PM EST

I am willing - if interest is strong enough - to perform one killing free of charge as a sort of "proof of concept", before actual donations are accepted. In this way you can be assured that I have the expertise and resources needed for the job.

I'd like to take you up on that. I nominate streetlawyer. Now show us your stuff. (Make sure you post pics of the corpse, thanks!)


-Kasreyn


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
Is your nick like a defense mechanism? (none / 0) (#48)
by sdem on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 11:09:31 PM EST

It's so effete. Who would hurt a woman?

That has to be the thought process behind that one. I hope.

"the troll band is a cross between mr. rogers neighorhood and riker's island" - tacomacide
[ Parent ]

No, actually (none / 0) (#51)
by Kasreyn on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:01:06 AM EST

I just live for your perpetual amusement, sdem.

You're welcome.


-Kasreyn


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
you're still worked up over that? (none / 0) (#83)
by makaera on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:15:31 AM EST

It's been over a year since the last streetlawyer post (unfortunately) which might make it a little hard to track him down and kill him unless you're willing to make his new account explicit.

"Ninety rounds in there," Joel Andrews said. "If you can't take it down with 90 rounds, you better turn in your badge!" -- from Parent ]

Hmm (3.80 / 5) (#49)
by ShooterNeo on Thu Jul 31, 2003 at 11:10:29 PM EST

I'm aware that there is some degree of anonymity on the internet, but still...could the author of the above message be arrested for saying this?  It's one thing to talk about a murder hypothetically, another to lay out a specific plan for doing so.  If the author had described a similar scheme for killing federal leaders (same bounty contribution, ect) I suspect he would definitely be arrested (if the appropriate government agents noticed the article and were able to actually uncover his identity)

I know of a couple of cases where this has actually happened : A kid gave vague threats that the president should 'watch it' and was arrested, a man posted on newsgroups how mad he was at a particular federal judge and implied he was mad enough to resort to firearms.  I know the man actually served time in prison.

Anyway, an obvious hole : whatever methods the author of this article used to maintain anonymity once the actually donating and killing started could be used by trolls to remain free from harm.  Public computer access, at libraries, coffee shops, ect is one way or using airsnort is another that is almost completely anonymous.

 And, if the above 'killer' DID have a way to track down someone randomly using open wireless networks to get online then the appropriate authorites with a hundred times the resources almost certainly could as well, to track down the killer.

Sure, the average cop may not know much about computers (or much of anything : police academy is 6 months) but the authorities can pay experts and simply have more manpower to follow EVERY tiny trail if necessary. (though, admittedly, they might only actually get around to really looking after several people had died)

Oh (5.00 / 2) (#58)
by ShooterNeo on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:11:13 AM EST

An obvious problem for the hitman : IP addresses are logged by Scoop (at least I assume they are), but they are NOT listed with comments.  You'd have to hack kuro5hin (ok, since the code is open source probably a possible task) or trojan Rusty or somehow get his passwords.  

In a similar manner, if someone gives a hotmail email address someone could subpoena hotmail for the account's actual IP address, but it might be difficult for the killer to get this information.  Finally, the killer would need to somehow find out from the target's isp what user account (my ISP for instance has over a million of them) was associated with that dynamic IP at that time.  Two different entities to get the information from, and if either of them have erased the logs then the task is impossible even for law enforcement.  

And of course someone concerned with privacy could add even more layers : use proxy servers and connect to the internet from a public connection.  Even using this I wouldn't be surprised if serious law enforcement agencies (secret service) could (usually) find the actual individual.  So don't go around hacking important computers or making death threats against federal employees.  Nevertheless, you probably couldn't be hunted down and killed by a psycopath who disagreed with the comments you made.

[ Parent ]

subpoena (none / 0) (#101)
by lonemarauder on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:57:43 PM EST

I'm guessing that the reason you didn't suggest subpoena is because K5 isn't hosted in the U.S.?

Even if it isn't, this isn't copyright infringement or slander. This is soliticitation for murder for hire, with specific instructions for participating and no hint of a disclaimer. This is a serious pound-me-in-the-ass felony conviction that carries something like 20 years in prison. Just about any extradition treaty we have with any nation would call for a subpoena to be honored for this.



[ Parent ]
"No hint"? (none / 0) (#116)
by kitten on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 06:52:42 PM EST

This is soliticitation for murder for hire, with specific instructions for participating and no hint of a disclaimer.

No hint? D'ya see that big banana icon at the top, there?

Maybe you don't. I myself have icons turned off. But even so, it's clearly in the "humour" section. You don't need icons to see that.

Convicting someone for something like this always involves intent.

Come off it, man.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
re: hint (none / 0) (#177)
by lonemarauder on Tue Aug 05, 2003 at 02:40:49 PM EST

Yes, I saw the banana, but that would likely be considered either vague or added after the fact by the site's editorial staff. Nothing in the text of the article suggests that you are joking.

As mentioned in another post, I'm not trying to piss in your corn flakes. I deal with people every day whose lives have been ruined because the cops applied extreme and ridiculous laws to their lives and turned up an indictment. Our legal system actually is that fucked up, and thought you should be aware of it.



[ Parent ]
Well (none / 0) (#131)
by ShooterNeo on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 12:23:33 AM EST

Well...while the case might actually be prosecutable as it is if the right prosecutor had 'kitten' in his gunsights, I'd think it wouldn't get serious unless he actually set up the site in Sealand as described above.  The author of assassination politics 'stalked' some IRS agents, which in conjunction with the 'essay' has landed him in jail for a few years.

(actually : if you make virtually any prosecutor mad, it doesn't matter if you've done anything.  You're probably going to prison.  Prosecutors can and have bought eyewitness 'evidence' simply by bribing a felon facing prison with a lesser sentence.  So keep that in mind next time you do anything that might attract their attention, and if at all possible try to become rich or get a career where they aren't quite so nasty)

[ Parent ]

It has happened with politicans targeted (3.00 / 1) (#99)
by 0x29a on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:23:01 PM EST

and they creators were arrested. Look for some info on "assasination politics"

Actually this looks like an exact ripoff of assasination politics with the one exception of the author is offering services for the actual killing, where as assination politics just provided an annonymous way to donate money to an assination fund.

[ Parent ]
Uh, well, actually (none / 0) (#100)
by lonemarauder on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:51:54 PM EST

Soliciting murder for hire is a bit more serious than drawing a picture of someone shooting a president. In Illinois, (he) just committed a felony that carries a 20-40 year prison sentence. (not that he's from Illinois, that's just the first legal reference Google turned up on the issue)

I am an expert technology witness and see firsthand the nature and extent of law enforcement investigations into technology related issues. Kitten is probably in very deep shit.



[ Parent ]
Keyword: Intent. (none / 0) (#115)
by kitten on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 06:49:04 PM EST

I mean, come on.

That's all I have to say.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
Address his point. Personally, I'm of a mood to (none / 0) (#143)
by Pinkerton Floyd on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 11:30:12 AM EST

forward this to the local police and the district atty.

Remember when you were young? You shone like the sun.
[ Parent ]

Are you at all familiar with "satire"? (none / 0) (#148)
by kitten on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 07:22:42 PM EST

See the big banana icon there? What section is this in?

The point has been addressed and it looks like most people understood what the point of the article was. Sadly, some people take things way too seriously.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
It's not me, chief! (none / 0) (#176)
by lonemarauder on Tue Aug 05, 2003 at 02:36:39 PM EST

I knew it was satire and in no way was personally offended by it. I fight for the good guys, remember?

My point is that there are law enforcement agencies in this country who could drag your ass to jail for writing what you did. I agree that it is extreme, but that doesn't remove the reality of the situation.



[ Parent ]
Considering (2.50 / 4) (#52)
by iasius on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:44:20 AM EST

how many people still frequent this site, it can't be that bad. OTOH I'm quite drunk, so don't mind me.


the internet troll is the pinnacle of human evolution - circletimessquare
Darn, I can't 1-rate my own comments. (4.00 / 1) (#122)
by iasius on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 08:33:19 PM EST




the internet troll is the pinnacle of human evolution - circletimessquare
[ Parent ]
Guerilla ontology (4.25 / 4) (#53)
by Pseudonym on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:45:51 AM EST

Any discussion of Denial of Existence is not complete without a discussion of the existential negation campaign brought to you by the fine folks at the Flat Earth Society.



sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f(q{sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f});
As amusing as this is... (4.00 / 2) (#54)
by gr3y on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:50:16 AM EST

I cannot, in good conscience, vote it up.

It belongs in your diary.

I am a disruptive technology.

the derivatives market (4.75 / 8) (#55)
by martingale on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:25:46 AM EST

We at Long Term Killer Management understand the inherent risks associated with investments in upstart companies such as kitten's.

No matter what the assurances of the CEO, it simply makes sense to hedge your risk. Do you want to spend your retirement days flaming your k5 nemesis, because kitten had a sudden change of heart, took the money and ran? No matter if you track down his email address eventually, he could be sipping Champagne on Tuvalu, enjoying the high tide and letting the death threats pile up in his inbox.

At LTKM, we have the expertise of 43 PhDs, including two Nobel Prize winners, and sufficient capital to offer a wide variety of over-the-counter derivative products. We cater to both risk-averse and risk seeking, and have just opened a brand new exotics division for two month old nouveaux oil magnates.

Moreover, by diversifying through us, you will have the satisfaction of knowing that your money contributed not only to the death of assorted k5 denizens, but indirectly helped prop up shady governments world-wide, without prejudice.

Our exact scientific methods are trade secrets, but rest assured that your contracts will be backed up by the finest murdering organizations in the world, including the CIA, Mossad, and Fred Galang Galang Dulim Bouti Ltd.

If you contact us before 9:34 GMT today, we will also throw in a set of steak knives valued at 49.95, with every American put option you purchase from us.

LTKM, rock stability at an unbeatable price.

kitten, can you not exist on K5? (2.00 / 2) (#57)
by United Fools on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 02:10:40 AM EST

Can we deny your existence here? You can help by reducing the number of 0's.
We are united, we are fools, and we are America!
-1 rusty would never allow it (2.75 / 3) (#60)
by President Saddam on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:22:15 AM EST

This would be an extension on K5 that somebody else suggested and doesn't conform to rusty's perfect vision of what K5 should be.  You see, rusty wants to have his cake and eat it too.

He thinks he can act like a bogus amateur and ignore the problems in K5, even when people are offering to pay for them to be fixed. Now, perhaps that offer by Lockwood wasn't sincere, perhaps it was a troll. I don't really know. But I do know that rejecting suggestions, known to fix the problem, for no apparent reason except that "rusty says" is not a good idea.

That's fine with me, it's his site, I should go and start my own site, but I'm just amused that he expects people to pay money for K5. Why? You can get killfiles (with the friends/foes system) for free on Slashdot, not to mention journals. The only thing that Kuro5hin offers are it's people and the stories, both of which depend on the goodwill around here, which is being seriously eroded every day thanks to crapflooders.

Maybe killfiles are unnecessary. Maybe they'll fix 80% of the problem. Nobody knows, and few people seem to want to know. Just slavishly follow whatever the leaders around say is 'right'.

Perhaps rusty doesn't like this site anymore. That's fine. Shut it down over the summer then, obviously you only care about people in the Northern hemisphere. Keep it shut down, for all I care. I don't give two shits but obviously you people do since you're voting this thinly concealed complaint up.

---
Allah Akbar

Way to run the server (4.40 / 5) (#61)
by Quila on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:28:41 AM EST

I've always thought of setting up an anonymous remailer with replay ability, but thought of the need to keep peoples' identities private. It could be useful for anything where you don't want the data seen and want deniability.

How about this: A Linux box running off a 1GB flash card. Set it up, remove monitor, keyboard, etc., but program it to detect a keyboard being plugged in. If one is plugged in, it still displays a blank screen, but it expects a password to be typed within, say, 30 seconds, beginning with an odd key.

If any wrong key is pushed, the data area of the flash card is erased, memory cleared, and this protective code deleted, after which the intruders get a nice normal prompt. It should all take less than a second and those looking at the machine will see a remailer running normally with no data.

Think this could work?

Well (5.00 / 1) (#75)
by WetherMan on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:06:21 AM EST

I assume this is to protect against law enforcement?

You'll have to be aware of a few things, such as govt monitoring of your upstream connection.  Also, this system assumes that the govt agency would immediately attempt to logon to the system, which is not necessarily true -- maybe standard procedure is to NOT touch the machine and take it straight to forensics, where the card can be dissected at their leisure, precisely to protect against the so-called "red button" occurance.

[ Parent ]

Pah. (5.00 / 2) (#84)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:24:37 AM EST

Just set it up to wipe itself immediately after the power is disconnected. Sure you might lose some data if power fails, but you're bound to lose data in such an occurrence anyway.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

I still (none / 0) (#103)
by WetherMan on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 03:56:00 PM EST

can't quite figure out whether you're an idiot or a troll.

calling someone a troll has become so fashionable, it's almost lost its meaning.. its such a nebulous term.

[ Parent ]

Then you're asking yourself the wrong question. (none / 0) (#137)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 04:09:35 AM EST

The two aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

High praise indeed.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

Good considerations (none / 0) (#85)
by Quila on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:33:46 AM EST

It's for abusive law enforcement and corporations looking for whistleblowers. I would like to do things like limit attachments, etc., so it doesn't become a child porn conduit.

When they come to the house with a search warrant, just shut your mouth and lead them directly to the computer as ordered. They can take it from there.

It would be a good idea to get their access procedures. This is why I asked for ideas.

If they want to unplug it and take it to the lab, then I guess we have to put a clean OS image on a bootable flash and keep data in a RAM disk. It'll look totally innocent when plugged in or when accessed. Not turning it on, but dissecting the flash, will just show a booting OS.

Can you run Linux from a RAM disk?

[ Parent ]

Didn't the LRP do this? (none / 0) (#138)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 04:22:06 AM EST

Pity it's no longer being developed (as far as I can see).

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

Whoa. (4.92 / 13) (#62)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:40:49 AM EST

I don't think this is what people mean when they ask for killfiles to be implemented on Kuro5hin.

Well, most people.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה

My personal favorite K5 contributor... (4.16 / 6) (#63)
by MichaelCrawford on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 05:07:28 AM EST

... is a controversial figure who is likely to be a popular object of the proposed bidding:

See for example The utter hypocrisy of the military industrial complex.

When I find a turmeric story in the queue, I always vote to send it to the front page. My bitterest disappointment comes when the other moderators dump a new turmeric article while I'm reading it, so I do not get to vote.

One reason I like to moderate is so that I get to read the many wonderful articles that are destined to be voted into oblivion. Our turmeric has submitted dozens, perhaps hundreds of articles, yet according to the link above, only eighteen have actually been published.


--

Live your fucking life. Sue someone on the Internet. Write a fucking music player. Like the great man Michael David Crawford has shown us all: Hard work, a strong will to stalk, and a few fries short of a happy meal goes a long way. -- bride of spidy


Obscurity (4.25 / 8) (#64)
by Scrymarch on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 06:16:32 AM EST

For reasons of security, I cannot reveal my exact methods; to do so would give potential victims an edge, a heads-up, and a way to prepare and defend. It will suffice to say that I have the training, the means, and the experience needed to get the job done.
I do wish I could be more specific, but due diligence must be exercised. If I went round saying "I'll kill them this way, with this weapon," I have less of a chance of a successful hit, and will have shirked my responsibility to donators to provide the service they are paying for.

Or in other words, Security Through Obscurity.  If your assassination techniques aren't good enough to stand up to rigorous Peer Review, how can we trust them?  YOU'RE MURDERING IN THE CATHEDRAL, KITTEN!

Who will rid me of this meddlesome troll? (nt) (none / 0) (#127)
by djotto on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:06:23 PM EST



[ Parent ]
That's seriously a great idea! (5.00 / 3) (#67)
by tlhf on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:43:44 AM EST

If the site even ever remotely works; criminal investigators place bounty, Kitten follows bait, Kitten caught.

...

Find something better to do with your time, dorkus (2.60 / 5) (#68)
by Kax on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:10:47 AM EST

malorkus. Seriously.

ive got a better idea (4.66 / 9) (#69)
by turmeric on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:11:04 AM EST

how about instead of paying to have people offed, you pay people to write stories?

the fact that paying people to 'kill' each other is seen as 'interesting' and 'reasonable' while the idea that paying someone to write a story is 'silly' or 'wrongheaded' kind of shows what type of place we are running here and what kind of people inhabit it.

Don't quit your day job... (5.00 / 2) (#72)
by skyknight on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:22:46 AM EST

I'm pretty sure that a large segment of our populace views K5 as interactive Jerry Springer, and they are seldom disappointed.



It's not much fun at the top. I envy the common people, their hearty meals and Bruce Springsteen and voting. --SIGNOR SPAGHETTI
[ Parent ]
That reminds me (5.00 / 4) (#91)
by ucblockhead on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:40:01 PM EST

Did you ever get that $20 for not posting in June?
-----------------------
This is k5. We're all tools - duxup
[ Parent ]
no (none / 0) (#113)
by turmeric on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 05:45:08 PM EST

no

[ Parent ]
You should contact Rusty, then (none / 0) (#118)
by ucblockhead on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:13:27 PM EST

Let me know if he refuses to give it to you.
-----------------------
This is k5. We're all tools - duxup
[ Parent ]
$25 on turmeric... (none / 0) (#147)
by adiffer on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 07:04:19 PM EST

8)
--BE The Alien!
[ Parent ]
I almost commented on this. (4.00 / 5) (#70)
by toganet on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:18:28 AM EST

Then I realized that this story is perhaps the ultimate troll!

It sucks you in with its militant anti-troll premise, and then leads you down a withered garden path to utter, irrelevant, trolldom.

I've left K5 twice before, did anyone notice?  Do I give a shit?  I'm still half convinced that you are all Rusty.

Johnson's law: Systems resemble the organizations that create them.


Good to see you again (5.00 / 1) (#82)
by DaveT on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:12:16 AM EST

I was wondering when you were going to pop back in.
When I read the headline on the article I thought this was going to be a proposal for some way for users to set up sub-enclaves inside the site. Allow those you like in, deny the existence those you dislike. Sort of like the ultimate high school social circle (would most of us get invited into any group?). I was slightly disappointed when I read the article. Definitely trolldom.

"Satan's my pen pal, but he doesn't write back because... well... he's evil
[ Parent ]

Wha's up, man? (none / 0) (#111)
by toganet on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 05:07:08 PM EST

I though the article was going to be about some new cult where they just concentrate real hard and make people disappear.  No such luck.

Johnson's law: Systems resemble the organizations that create them.


[ Parent ]
An idea to bolt on top of this plan... (3.66 / 3) (#71)
by skyknight on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:18:32 AM EST

Free markets! We can't have just you running this whole operation. I mean, you'd be as bad as big pharma! We have to open this wonderful idea up to competition. I propose reverse auctions.



Process:
  • Form a bitter, intense hatred for some K5er
  • find others who share your sentiment
  • raise as much money as you can into a common pool, keeping the total amount raised a secret
  • transfer this money to an escrow agent
  • commence solicitation of bids from contract assassins
  • award contract to lowest bidder (if all bidders are above the pool, auction fails and money is returned by escrow agent to individuals)
  • winning assassin attempts to carry out job; if successful, escrow agent pays assassin contract fee, and returns remainder of money to pool members, proportional to their contribution; if failure, escrow agent returns all money to pool members

Note: the escrow agent is a key component to this infrastructure. Were it not used, would be financiers could exploitatively test the market by submitting phony bids that they did not intend to carry though. Also, when dealing with shifty, assassin-like characters, you just can't be too safe.



It's not much fun at the top. I envy the common people, their hearty meals and Bruce Springsteen and voting. --SIGNOR SPAGHETTI
Nice fucking rip-off, kitten (4.23 / 13) (#73)
by Hymen Restoration Surgery on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:27:06 AM EST

Not only is this a blatant ripoff of Assassination Politics, your renaming sucks. DDoE? That's fucking stupid.

Plagiarist. Fucking give Jim Bell his due, this article should never have been posted. Kitten, I expect more out of you than this lame tripe.



--
H.R.S.
Fascinating (none / 0) (#104)
by LilDebbie on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:16:05 PM EST

I like how people put in bets to "predict" when the mark is going to die. I must say that's a very creative way of avoiding the whole "hiring someone to kill this person" problem.

Of course, how much would it suck if you took pains to ensure your "prediction" was correct, only to have someone who happened to guess a better time than you win?

My name is LilDebbie and I have a garden.
- hugin -

[ Parent ]
Nice fucking assumption, dumbass (3.00 / 2) (#107)
by ubernostrum on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:23:32 PM EST

You're about the fifteenth person to point that out. Interestingly, I was present on IRC when this story was hatched and can vouch for the fact that it had nothing to do with the article it allegedly "ripped off." Thanks for playing, though.


--
You cooin' with my bird?
[ Parent ]
I assume you know how to read. (4.00 / 4) (#108)
by Mohammed Niyal Sayeed on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:32:21 PM EST

Read this:

"A few months ago, I had a truly and quite literally "revolutionary" idea, and I jokingly called it "Assassination Politics": I speculated on the question of whether an organization could be set up to legally announce that it would be awarding a cash prize to somebody who correctly "predicted" the death of one of a list of violators of rights, usually either government employees, officeholders, or appointees. It could ask for anonymous contributions from the public, and individuals would be able send those contributions using digital cash. "

Look familiar?

I mean, come on.

You'd have to be an idiot not to see the resemblance, if that's a strong enough word for it.


--
"You need to get your own point, then we can have an elaborate dance fight." - jmzero

[ Parent ]
Oh, I can read. (3.33 / 3) (#112)
by ubernostrum on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 05:23:42 PM EST

I just wondered where people get the arrogance to assume that the same idea can't ever occur independently to two different people. No, mention something that's similar to some obscure article they read and it's all "OMG YOU TOTALLY RIPPED THAT OFF!"


--
You cooin' with my bird?
[ Parent ]
Ummm (3.00 / 2) (#119)
by Mohammed Niyal Sayeed on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:25:10 PM EST

You'll notice not only is the basic premise the same, inclusive of the general concept and closer details like anonymity being key, and encrypted "digital cash" being used to avoid traceability of the contributors, but even the phraseology is the same. I site the use of the term "prediction" with regards death time of the targets as proof positive that the similarities between this article and AP are not merely coincidental, but rather than this article is derivative of Bell's AP work, if not copied almost outright.

What someone may or may not have typed live in IRC as their own notion or series of notions is obviously garnered directly from what you call "some obscure article." I would argue that James Bell's Assassination Politics is not only not that obscure (as anyone who subscribes to Declan McCulloch's Politechbot list would know, or anyone who frequents Cryptome.org, an excellent site that archived a lot of the pertinent AP information as a public service, would know, as would any number of cryptography-in-politics mailing list recipients), but actually fairly well known. Well known enough, in fact, that the Federal Bureau of Investigations is already familiar with it, as are certain IRS employees and Federal Circuit Court judges.

That said, I think "OMG YOU TOTALLY RIPPED THAT OFF" is a pretty fair assessment of what happened here. To think that one could pass this off as coincidence is pretty naive, don't you think? I mean, this isn't Slashdot; a good number of us can, and do, read things from other places.

In its original form, it's an interesting idea. Deprived of it's original elegance, and injected with K5-centric "humor", it sort of falls flat. I really don't care, one way or another; I read it, and wouldn't unread it if that were even possible, but please be intellectually honest enough to note that it's completely derivative, for fuck's sake.


--
"You need to get your own point, then we can have an elaborate dance fight." - jmzero

[ Parent ]
I see. (1.00 / 2) (#120)
by ubernostrum on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:31:28 PM EST

So . . . you didn't read this article, then.


--
You cooin' with my bird?
[ Parent ]
Good comeback. (5.00 / 4) (#121)
by Mohammed Niyal Sayeed on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:42:31 PM EST

I definitely feel like wasting more of my time discussing it with you.


--
"You need to get your own point, then we can have an elaborate dance fight." - jmzero

[ Parent ]
ideas exist outside of time (5.00 / 1) (#139)
by Fen on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 04:25:42 AM EST

Nobody creates an idea. Calculus was "invented" independently. What I'm saying may have been said many times, but it doesn't matter. Nobody is original, ever. Ideas exist outside of time.
--Self.
[ Parent ]
How the idea started... (1.00 / 1) (#109)
by kitten on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:39:10 PM EST

Names have been changed, except for mine, to protect the guilty.  But you whiners going "ASSASSINATION POLITICS RIP OFF" can shut up already.

469811 <JohnDoe> Allow me to summarize the diary section of kuro5hin.org at the moment:
 469826 <JohnDoe> <livebearer> OMG SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD SCOTT LOCKWOOD
 469848 <JohnDoe> Thus ends my summary.
 469872 <kitten> You left out the part about Scott Lockwood.
 469880 <JohnDoe> Oh, right.
 469886 <JohnDoe> Thanks for reminding me.
 469918 <JohnDoe> In a way, I hope this keeps up just because I yearn for some Old Testament Wrath of Rusty.
 469925 <kitten> I must note my opinion, once again, that kuro5hin would probably improve vastly and virtually overnight with the simple gesture of removing the diary section.
 469935 <JohnDoe> Maybe.
 469944 <JohnDoe> Sadly, the rest of the site hasn't been that great in a while, either.
 469953 <kitten> Yes, but don't you see?
 469959 [JohnDoe!~james@cloaked.charterwv.net] ACTION hurries even more to finish the series of articles he's writing
 469967 <kitten> Where did all the morons suddenly come from?  What attracted them?
 469972 <kitten> Answer:  The diary.  
 469979 <kitten> Then they slowly migrated over to the "real" part of the site.
 469989 <JohnDoe> Hm.
 470002 <kitten> Without the diary ghetto for them to play in, they wouldn't last long in the rest of the site, and they'd find something else to do.
 470003 <JohnDoe> You may have a point there.
 470029 <JohnDoe> Admittedly, though, I'd miss some of the diary regulars.
 470038 <kitten> In the diaries, they can whine and snipe all they want - and so they do.  In between, they blow snot wads on the rest of the site.
 470054 <JohnDoe> They'd need to get LiveJournals or whatever so I could keep up with them.  To hell with the rest.
 470064 <kitten> Take away the diary section, and take away 75% of the idiots.
 470076 <JohnDoe> Hm.
 470107 <JohnDoe> I need to look sometime for Scoop sites that don't allow diaries.
 470170 <JuliusCaesar_away> Maybe just limiting it to 3 a week would help - or would people get accounts to compensate, d'you think?
 470176 <JohnDoe> They'd compensate.
 470208 <JuliusCaesar> They should just put me in charge - and I'd arbitrarily delete the shit
 470220 <JohnDoe> Sounds good.  JuliusCaesar FOR GUBERNATOR.
 470253 <kitten> JuliusCaesar:  I suggested that as an alternative.
 470254 <JuliusCaesar> I know rusry's got his principles - but some old-school dictatorship wouldn't go amiss at the moment
 470267 <kitten> Or.
 470270 <kitten> Even better.
 470304 <kitten> A user should have to post x number of contents, with an average rating of y or above, before he gets to make diaries.   And if the rating drops below y, he doesn't get to post diaries.
 470320 <kitten> This way, you'd have to prove that you're, you know, actually contributing to the site, before you get to reap the site's benefits.
 470334 <JohnDoe> I think if it's going to go that way, it'd be better just to eliminate the diaries anyway.
 470335 <JuliusCaesar> I completely agree - I suggested that myself a while back
 470338 <kitten> y wouldn't have to be big, either.
 470352 <kitten> Just enough to make sure you couldn't get away with being a *complete* fuck.
 470360 <Vladimir> I'd miss the worthwhile diaries if they were removed.
 470363 <JuliusCaesar> x would have to be fairly hefty I think
 470368 <JohnDoe> kitten, it'd never work.  For the same reason that rmg got trusted user status.
 470369 <kitten> In addition, ratings on comments made to diaries shouldn't be counted.  Period.
 470377 <kitten> JohnDoe:  See above.  :)
 470391 <JohnDoe> So they'd start rating up meaningless comments attached to stories.  Same thing.
 470404 <JohnDoe> There's always going to be a little circle-jerk of assholes ratign each other up all the time.
 470410 <kitten> Potentially, but I think people do rate a bit more rationally on stories than diaries.
 470422 <JohnDoe> Depends on who the author of the story is :)
 470433 <kitten> Mm.. I didn't say it was the Final Solution.
 470440 <kitten> But it would cuit back the problem quite a bit.
 470446 <Vladimir> kitten - Now there's an idea.
 470456 <kitten> Vladimir:  I've proposed this idea as well.
 470459 <kitten> Need I rehash it?
 470470 <Vladimir> I meant the Final Solution.
 470473 <JohnDoe> The more I think about it, though, the more I think you're right about getting rid of the diaries altogether.  You can either be the kind of "collaborative media" thing ruty seems to envision in his grandiose moments, or you can be a diary site.  Trying to do both doesn't work in the long run.
 470479 <kitten> Yes, well, my idea is this.
 470484 <Vladimir> Diary losers who ruin the main part of the site get worked half to death then roasted in ovens.
 470492 <JohnDoe> Hear, hear.
 470496 [JohnDoe!~james@cloaked.charterwv.net] ACTION applauds and whistles
 470498 <kitten> I'll set up a system whereby users can donate a sum of money to a specific account.
 470513 <kitten> Say you want rmg killed, for example.
 470517 <kitten> You can donate to the rmg account.
 470543 <Vladimir> Until there's enough to put out a contract on his life?
 470562 <kitten> The price would be fairly high, and each user can only contribute a small percentage, thus ensuring that a *lot* of people want the guy dead.  But if enough people contribute, and the total pool on that account gets to the specified amount, I take the money.
 470581 <kitten> Then I personally use the money to secure plane tickets, train tickets, or whatever else is needed (plus profit, of course), and kill him.
 470590 <Vladimir> Ah.
 470605 <JuliusCaesar> Rusty should convene a panel, say, us lot - and we take over deciding what stays and goes from the diaries - that way he can say "#I'm# all for democracy, but it's out of my hands boys, the diary jury are annoyed with the crapflood at the moment, and it's up to them:post better diaries?"
 470627 <Vladimir> kitten - Would you torture him first for a bonus?
 470638 <kitten> I'm afraid that isn't my style.
 470641 <JohnDoe> Would it be possible to set up a poll to choose the last things said to him?  Say, for example, the last thing rmg hears is "Not only will this help the signal-to-noise ration, it'll also alleviate youre mouse-wheel problem."
 470645 <kitten> I reserve torture for personal vendettas.
 470658 <kitten> For contract killings I operate by stealth, surprise, and work as quickly as possible.
 470663 <JohnDoe> Or possibly he could hear a properly spelled version of that.
 470673 <JohnDoe> Ah.  So that's a "no", then.
 470676 <kitten> Well, sure, I don't see why not..
 470706 <kitten> However, I cannot *guarantee* the messege will get delivered.
 470709 <JohnDoe> It would be almost poetic to have them die by their own words.
 470727 <kitten> The stipulation is tha tI will try to give him the final words, but if the situation demands it, I'll have to off him before I can say anything.
 470735 <JohnDoe> Livebearer's death could be ushered in with the comforting though that he'll never have to worry about Vlad, ever again.
 470753 <Anastasia> unless their own words are purposefully repeating stupid things for the ad-absurdum effect. in which case repeating their words is playing their game.
 470758 <kitten> I'll set the bounty at 10 thousand and the maximum donation per user at 200 dollars.
 470768 <kitten> Thus, fifty people (at the very least) must want him dead.
 470781 <kitten> That's assuming all fifty contribute the maximum they can.
 470781 <Anastasia> you realize $10,000 is more money than kuro5hin has ever made, right?
 470781 <JohnDoe> ATTN: all FBI agents in k5.  kitten is the professional killer.
 470782 <Anastasia> ehll
 470785 <Anastasia> that's the best idea ever
 470793 <JohnDoe> Anastasia, were you around for the fundraiser?
 470798 <JuliusCaesar> ...would raise money for K5 too - 2 birds - half a stone...
 470808 <kitten> I should write a meta about this.
 470811 <Anastasia> if rusty set up pools whereby you could donate money in an escrow account that if it reaches a certain amount, a user is banned
 470819 <JohnDoe> Bans don't work.
 470834 <kitten> Bans are too hard to implement.
 470836 <JohnDoe> Only physically locating and eliminating the user in the real world would suffice.
 470837 <Anastasia> he could make enough money from that that he would be able to actually run the site
 470849 <kitten> Dynamic IPs, multiple ISPs (like, work and home, etc), makes it impossible.
 470853 <Anastasia> ok, if a certain amount is reached, rusty posts all that user's IP addresses ever used
 470867 <kitten> Heh.
 470869 <kitten> That'd be something.
 470871 <Anastasia> along with all the passwords and e-mail addresses ever used
 470873 <kitten> I like my idea better.
 470874 <JuliusCaesar> What's to stop them just getting new accounts? Unless we combine it with the x times y suggestion I guess...
 470883 <Anastasia> since it is rare e-mail/k5/slashdot passwords differ
 470885 <Vladimir> I prefer kitten's scheme. Much more satisfying.
 470897 <JohnDoe> What we really need are the sort of trust-based systems that people are just now starting to develop.
 470900 <Vladimir> A part of me wishes it was real. :<
 470907 <kitten> If I hammer up a proposal on this and submit it, you'll vote it up?
 470918 <JohnDoe> If it's well-written and coherent, probably.
 470920 <JuliusCaesar> I think so
 470922 <Vladimir> Yeah.
 470931 <Anastasia> if it promotes violence against rmg, sure, why not, i'll toss you an SP at least
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]

even simpler (none / 0) (#117)
by Wah on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 07:05:06 PM EST

diaries are a paid feature.  Didn't you notice?

Rusty, seriously, he's got some good points here. But hey, I don't even read the diaries and still they scroll by so fast, it's not worth it to put a decent one together.  

BTW, this really does seem like a resume for IRL assassination.  Which, if you just went crazy and shared it with the rest of us, well, uh...have a nice day.  Otherwise, it could use some editing.  

Or deleting.
--
KSDatafeedv1.0
[ Parent ]

Whatever, dude. (none / 0) (#167)
by Mohammed Niyal Sayeed on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 08:11:25 PM EST

I came up with this fabulous idea, that I call The Constitution. Here's proof that it's really mine, and not just something I read then coopted to grind an axe against the diary section of k5.

[20:05] <mns> We the People of the K5, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Kuro5hin of America.
[20:05] <mns> Article. I.
[20:05] <mns> Section 1.
[20:05] <JuliusCaesar> What's to stop them just getting new accounts? Unless we combine it with the x times y suggestion I guess...
[20:05] <mns> All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the Kuro5hin, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.
[20:05] <mns> Section. 2.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 1: The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second Year by the People of the several States, and the Electors in each State shall have the Qualifications requisite for Electors of the most numerous Branch of the State Legislature.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 2: No Person shall be a Representative who shall not have attained to the Age of twenty five Years, and been seven Years a Citizen of the Kuro5hin, and who shall not, when elected, be an Inhabitant of that State in which he shall be chosen.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 3: Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons. (See Note 2) The actual Enumeration shall be made within three Years
[20:05] <mns> after the first Meeting of the Congress of the Kuro5hin, and within every subsequent Term of ten Years, in such Manner as they shall by Law direct. The Number of Representatives shall not exceed one for every thirty Thousand, but each State shall have at Least one Representative; and until such enumeration shall be made, the State of New Hampshire shall be entitled to chuse three, Massachusetts eight, Rhode-Island and Provide
[20:05] <mns> nce Plantations one, Connecticut five, New-York six, New Jersey four, Pennsylvania eight, Delaware one, Maryland six, Virginia ten, North Carolina five, South Carolina five, and Georgia three.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 4: When vacancies happen in the Representation from any State, the Executive Authority thereof shall issue Writs of Election to fill such Vacancies.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 5: The House of Representatives shall chuse their Speaker and other Officers; and shall have the sole Power of Impeachment.
[20:05] <Anastasia> ok, if a certain amount is reached, rusty posts all that user's IP addresses ever
[20:05] <mns> Section. 3.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 1: The Senate of the Kuro5hin shall be composed of two Senators from each State, chosen by the Legislature thereof, (See Note 3) for six Years; and each Senator shall have one Vote.
[20:05] <mns> Clause 2: Immediately after they shall be assembled in Consequence of the first Election, they shall be divided as equally as may be into three Classes. The Seats of the Senators of the first Class shall be vacated at the Expiration of the second Year, of the second Class at the Expiration of the fourth Year, and of the third Class at the Expiration of the sixth Year, so that one third may be chosen every second Year; and if Vaca
[20:05] <kitten>That'd be something.

Why not just admit where you stole the idea from, kitten? It's not original. Then again, nothing ever really is. IRC logs don't prove shit, except that no one else in that channel had read AP before.


--
"You need to get your own point, then we can have an elaborate dance fight." - jmzero

[ Parent ]
I can't believe you spent time on that. (none / 0) (#178)
by kitten on Thu Aug 07, 2003 at 12:41:59 AM EST

Why not just admit where you stole the idea from, kitten? It's not original. ... IRC logs don't prove shit, except that no one else in that channel had read AP before.


How could I have "stolen" the idea from AP, yet never have read AP before?

Just grow the fuck up and admit that ideas can occur to more than one person.

Besides, my idea isn't exactly like AP. There's similarities, but that's it. Why don't you go accuse Mozart of "stealing ideas" from Beethoven while you're at it.

You have the logs right in front of your face that show the original problem and the natural progression of the discussion that lead to the idea:

  • People griping about a problem
  • Various solutions being offered
  • One smart-ass solution being offered
  • People running with that solution and fleshing it out a bit

    Yet you want to clamp your hands over your eyes and ears and go "NUH UH YOU STOLE IT", instead.

    Real mature.
    mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
    [ Parent ]
  • Admiral Poindexter.. (4.75 / 4) (#76)
    by bearclaw on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:09:28 AM EST

    ..is salivating over this idea.
    -- bearclaw
    Some comments (3.33 / 3) (#77)
    by joto on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:25:33 AM EST

    The main problem with this suggestion is the same as with any community funding. Say I hate somedude because of a comment he made. It would make sense for me to donate $50 to have him killed. But if somedude is generally well liked, my part of the bounty will just live in the system forever, since the total amount will never reach the bounty. Who will end up with all that money?

    What is needed is either a way for each individual to get those funds back, once you are bored waiting for a hit, or to transfer them towards another individual you hate more. It would also be more fair towards individuals who improves their personal relations towards others. If, for example, in a year, I decide I like somedude again, I would feel bad if I was part of the contributions who eventually made him go away.

    Secondly, I would prefer a more open system, where there was bidding on both sides. Different hitmen should be able to bid on the same person, and the lowest bidder would get the price. If there are additional funds, these can either be transferred to the hitman in question (that seems most fair to me), or they can be returned to the original bidders, either as actual money, or in the form of a pool that can be used to bid for other persons as explained above.

    A minor concern is how the funds deposited should be managed. It is obvious that we should prepare for a rather large amount of money to be deposited, and potentially never reach the threshold needed for a hit. These funds could be invested, but as the funds could get quite large, there exists the possibility that killings would not be encouraged, as it would be more economically sound to just keep investing the money. A successful scheme of this type needs to have guarantees that any profits gained by investing the money should be pooled back and divided fairly (proportionally) among the accounts for the different people. This will benefit everyone, both the hitmen, and the people paying for the hits.

    Lastly, I see no reason to limit this to kuro5hin alone. There are plenty of people I would like to see dead that have never posted to kuro5hin. I realize your claim of being able to track down all kuro5hin users put you in a special situation, but this could also be a great way to get rid of politicians, bad actors, other celebrities, and whatever else exists of well-known people you would like to have killed. Anyway, I guess kuro5hin is a great start, maybe the system could grow later.

    you might want a BIG disclaimer on this article (3.40 / 5) (#88)
    by modmans2ndcoming on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:53:38 AM EST

    as I think an FBI agent reading this might think you mean to really kill people. :-)

    Why, oh why... (4.00 / 10) (#92)
    by CodeWright on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 12:56:33 PM EST

    ...did this retarded piece of trash get voted to the front page?

    --
    "Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
    Because (4.33 / 3) (#96)
    by La Camiseta on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:21:49 PM EST

    eveybody's scared shitless of a user with the name kitten who claims to be a killer. (ahem, FBI, do you have any unsolved murder cases which look like an assination?)

    Oh yeah, and real smart to advertise that you kill people on K5. This server like almost every website in the world has logs, including your IP address, and if they want it badly enough, the FBI will hunt your ass down. Hey, a bunch of thick headed recording industry execs can do it, why not the nation's top law enforcement agency? Especially since it's had it's leash all but removed after Sept. 11.
    ־‮־

    [ Parent ]

    You can't be serious (4.00 / 1) (#97)
    by CodeWright on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:25:40 PM EST

    I interpreted this lame story queue submission as a farce.

    Not having read kitten's other posts, I have to take your word -- so is it your assertion that this fantasy is one that he consistently maintains?

    --
    "Jumpin Jesus H. Christ riding a segway with a little fruity 1 pint bucket of Ben and Jerry's rainbow fairy-berry crunch in his hand." --
    [ Parent ]
    Nice ripoff of Assassination Politics (4.14 / 7) (#94)
    by Blah Blah on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:07:08 PM EST

    As explained here by Jim Bell, six years ago.

    [
    Nice job of not reading the comments (nt) (3.00 / 2) (#106)
    by ubernostrum on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:21:54 PM EST




    --
    You cooin' with my bird?
    [ Parent ]
    You're right (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by Blah Blah on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 06:37:12 PM EST

    I shot my mouth off before reading the rest of the comments. Sorry!

    [ Parent ]
    You better hope no one on K5 is murdered (3.62 / 8) (#95)
    by CoolName on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:10:08 PM EST

    You would be a suspect. FBI agents I believe basically lack a sense of humor on this subject.

    "What does your conscience say? -- 'You shall become the person you are.'" Friedrich Nietzsche


    The next step... (4.00 / 5) (#98)
    by jabber on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 01:27:46 PM EST

    Instead of taking all the responsibility for the termination of Bob, making you a bottleneck in this scheme, as well as a "single point of failure" should the authorities become involved, I humbly suggest an improvement.

    Hold a pledge drive. Collect the donations under the auspices of establishing a non-profit organization dedicated to eliminating individuals loathed by the community. Call it, the Collaborative Murder Foundation, or something of that sort. See, you want to isolate yourself from accountability here, in case the law gets involved, or in case the mark escapes.

    If enough people contribute quickly, you can offer them perks in proportion to their level of support. Some will get you to spell-check their future RFC's (Requests For Cancellation). Others could get "Bob got killed by a faceless, non-existent cabal, and all I got was this lousy t-shirt" t-shirts. It can't fail!

    The CMF would only be a layer of misdirection if you're still the one doing all the work. So, I suggest that you open the floor to community participation. Just as anyone can pay in to getting Bob killed, anyone can claim the mark, and through an encrypted, double-blind proxy, claim their reward upon Bob's confirmed demise. The organization would of course need by-laws and such, but you can worry about that after you have cash in hand.

    Of course only one person could take up the challenge at a time, and would not get paid until Bob is either dead, or the "kill token" has been returned - at which point someone better equipped could pursue Bob.

    Better still, to truly make it a community effort, everyone who attempts to kill Bob would only be allowed to do so with a box cutter, and only for one cut. This way, all anyone would be guilty of is a single cut at best. Upon Bob's death, all those who dealt him a successful cut would get a fair and equal cut of the prize money.

    We'd need some sort of verification system, to make sure that the number of cuts on Bob's corpse matches the number of ways the pot is to be divided, but this is a technical detail I leave as an exercise to the reader.

    Excellent idea. I'm looking forward to seeing it implemented.

    [TINK5C] |"Is K5 my kapusta intellectual teddy bear?"| "Yes"

    Yoiks! (3.00 / 4) (#105)
    by ucblockhead on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:21:52 PM EST

    I hope you have a good lawyer. The feds are famous for not being able to see bananas.
    -----------------------
    This is k5. We're all tools - duxup
    this is a rip-off of some article (4.16 / 6) (#110)
    by DJ Glock on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 04:47:29 PM EST

    you better hope the fbi doesn't read this site.

    i don't know how this made it to the front page.

    ......

    i wasn't being hostile towards janra, by the way. i was simply pointing out janra's ridiculous hipocrisy in a satirical fashion. you understand satire, don't you?

    *** ANONYMIZED ***

    FBI? (none / 0) (#125)
    by slur on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 10:19:42 PM EST

    Ha, I think they're too busy going after Jonathan Swift to bother with this author.

    |
    | slur was here
    |

    [ Parent ]
    Interesting (none / 0) (#159)
    by The Central Committee on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 04:16:30 AM EST

    hasn't kitten already had a run in with the secret service

    You personaly are the reason I cannot believe in a compassionate god, a creature of ineffable itelligence would surely know better than to let someone like you exist. - dorc
    [ Parent ]

    this is either (3.00 / 1) (#124)
    by tweetsygalore on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 09:54:51 PM EST


    a very, very interesting trap or you're not aware that law enforcers ARE and have been very closely monitoring K5.

    as to these so-called hostilities that you mentioned AND alluded to, a lot of them are caused by bullies, i think, which i would consider equivalent of psychological terrorists.

    thankfully, there are a few "psychological counter-terrorists" around who think that these bullies are untrained and total amateurs.  personally, i wouldn't dream of taking on anybody in any way if i don't think i'm fit enough --- psychologically or otherwise.  it would be foolish at best and suicidal and self-destructive at worst.

    all the best
    C
    After each perceived security crisis ended, the United States has remorsefully realised that the abrogation of civil liberties was unnecessary. But it has proven unable to prevent itself from repeating the error when the next crisis comes along. --- Justice William Brennan

    Good Nigerian Letter! (3.20 / 5) (#128)
    by The Devil on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:29:39 PM EST

    This scheme is likely a Nigerian Letter scam, gone horribly wrong.

    Nigerian Letter Scam Transcript (tweaked for k5)

    Dr. Bakare Tunde Nigerian National Petroleum Corporation Central Business District, Herbert Macaulay Way Abuja, Nigeria.

    Dear Marco,

    REQUEST FOR ASSISTANCE-STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL;

    I am Dr. Bakare Tunde a top management staff in the Nigerian National Petroleum Corporation (NNPC) and I head a seven-man tender's board in charge of Contract Awards and Payments Approvals. I came to know of you in my search for a reliable and reputable person to handle a very confidential transaction that involves the transfer of a huge sum of money to a foreign account, in exchange for the execution of some nasty K5 users. There were series of contracts executed by a consortium Multinationals in the oil industry in favour of NNPC among which were:

    * The Supply of Y2K Compliant Personal Computers and Accessories to the Warri, Port Harcourt and Kaduna Refineries.
    * Supply of Drugs and Relief materials to the victims of the Niger/ Delta crises.
    * The construction of Schools, Hospitals and Housing Units in the Niger/Delta Region.

    The original value of these contracts were deliberately over invoiced in the sum of USD FORTY ONE MILLION, FIVE HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS (41.5M) which has now been approved and is now ready to be transferred being that the Companies that actually executed these contracts have been paid and the projects officially commissioned. The only problem is that the K5 users who are getting in the way need to be terminated, and we can do that for you for a small fee.

    Consequently, my colleagues and I are willing to transfer the total amount to your account for subsequent disbursement, since we as civil servants are prohibited by the Code of Conduct Bureau (Civil Service Laws) from opening and/ or operating foreign accounts in our names.

    Needless to say, the trust reposed on you at this juncture is enormous. In return, we have agreed to offer you 20% of the transferred sum, while 10% shall be set aside for incidental expenses (internal and external) between the parties in the course of the transaction. You will be mandated to remit the balance 70% to other accounts in due course. You must however NOTE that this transaction is subject to the following terms and conditions:

    * Our conviction of your transparent honesty and diligence.
    * That you would treat this transaction with utmost secrecy and confidentiality.
    * That as a foreign partner, you will follow our instructions to the letter. Provide the account required, and competent to assist us on profitable investment areas in your Country in an advisory capacity.
    * Fufilment of termination of certain K5 users who bug us.

    Furthermore, Modalities have been worked out at the highest levels of the Ministry of Finance and the Central Bank of Nigeria for the immediate transfer of the funds within 10 working days subject to your satisfaction of the above stated terms. Our assurance is that your role is risk free.

    To accord this transaction the legality it deserves and for mutual security of the fund, the whole approval procedures will be officially and legally processed with your name of any Company you may nominate as the Bonafide beneficiary.

    Once more, I want you to understand that having put in over 26 years in the service of my country, I am averse to having my image and career dented. This matter should therefore be treated with utmost secrecy and urgency.

    Kindly expedite action as we are behind schedule to enable us include this transfer in the third batch of this financial quarter payment.

    Please acknowledge the receipt of this message via my direct fax number 234- 1-759 1648 only.

    Yours Sincerely, Dr.Bakare Tunde



    Interesting idea (5.00 / 1) (#129)
    by mayo on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:36:13 PM EST

    Perhaps you could incorporate it via the rating system, supplementing 0-5 with "die!" Conversely it might be a good idea to include "save that member" or something as a way for the more mentally stable and cash flushed members to combat homicidal internet dwellers who actually wish death upon anonymous strangers. As an economic plus, having both side pay off against each other with you reaping the proceeds would net you even more cash for possibly even less work. Of course to prevent the proliferation of unstable rich bastards dupe accounting people to death it might be a good idea to restrict the privelege, maybe to Trusted Users? It could make the status actually useful for something. Overall I wholeheartedly endorse this scheme with one proposed proviso: you secretly submit the list of people who donated cash to international crime enforcement agencies. Frankly I'd like to see anybody who is pushed to kill (or conspire to kill) by a mere website watched closely and possibly hooked up with the therapy they need.

    Oh for crap's sake (more readable version here) (none / 1) (#130)
    by mayo on Fri Aug 01, 2003 at 11:40:13 PM EST

    I accidentally hit submit, not preview. 1 me now (or donate to kitten), you know you want to...

    Perhaps you could incorporate it via the rating system, supplementing 0-5 with "die!" Conversely it might be a good idea to include "save that member" or something as a way for the more mentally stable and cash flushed members to combat homicidal internet dwellers who actually wish death upon anonymous strangers. As an economic plus, having both side pay off against each other with you reaping the proceeds would net you even more cash possibly for even less work.

    Of course to prevent the proliferation of unstable rich bastards dupe accounting people to death it might be a good idea to restrict the privelege, maybe to Trusted Users? It could make the status actually useful for something.

    Overall I wholeheartedly endorse this scheme with one proposed proviso: you secretly submit the list of people who donated cash to international crime enforcement agencies. Frankly I'd like to see anybody who is pushed to kill (or conspire to kill) by a mere website watched closely and possibly hooked up with the therapy they need.

    [ Parent ]
    Timing (4.00 / 1) (#132)
    by Philosofique on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 01:39:59 AM EST

    I'd say that it's reasonable to assume that if you could pull this arrangement off, George Carlin's plan for one free murder per month is also feasible. If you could time it right, you wouldn't have to worry about the law at all. For that matter, neither would Alice or Bob or anyone else. Carlin lists all sorts of possible targets, not limited to just the annoying, but also family or even neighbors. Basically, as long as you have a good reason, which he exemplifies with "The guy is just a real asshole," murder is just fine. I think we all know a few "real assholes" worthy of the fate.

    Plagiarism (4.16 / 6) (#133)
    by limekiller on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 01:41:22 AM EST

    Cripes.  Can you say "plagiarism?"  From the link, in part:

    -----
    Assassination Politics
    by Jim Bell

    "A few months ago, I had a truly and quite literally "revolutionary" idea, and I jokingly called it "Assassination Politics": I speculated on the question of whether an organization could be set up to legally announce that it would be awarding a cash prize to somebody who correctly "predicted" the death of one of a list of violators of rights, usually either government employees, officeholders, or appointees. It could ask for anonymous contributions from the public, and individuals would be able send those contributions using digital cash.
    -----

    For plenty more reference, hit Google.  Look, it's a great article and a wonderful topic for discussion, but trying to pass it off as your own is dishonest.  Give credit where credit is due.

    Regards,
    Lime

    Cripes. (3.00 / 4) (#135)
    by ubernostrum on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 03:27:39 AM EST

    Can you say READ THE FUCKING COMMENTS YOU IGNORANT TWAT?

    Oh wait, I forgot. "I read something like this once a long time ago" == "This must be a complete and total rip-off, no need to check it out or anything."


    --
    You cooin' with my bird?
    [ Parent ]

    tontine (4.60 / 5) (#134)
    by melior on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 02:10:52 AM EST

    TONTINE

    A system of annuities in which the benefits pass to the surviving subscribers until only one is left.

    The tontine is named after Lorenzo Tonti, a Neapolitan banker who started such a scheme in France in 1653, though it has been said that they were known in Italy earlier. Each subscriber paid a sum into the fund, and in return received dividends from the capital invested; as each person died his share was divided among all the others until only one was left, reaping all the benefits. In the original scheme, the capital reverted to the state when the last subscriber died, so it was really a kind of national lottery. The idea was taken up enthusiastically in France and later in Britain and the USA; it was used to fund buildings and other public works. (There are still several hotels and other buildings in Britain and the USA with the word in their names.) Later there were private schemes in which the last survivor got the capital as well.

    Tontines were eventually banned in Britain and the USA, because there was too much incentive for subscribers to bump each other off to increase their share of the fund, or to become the last survivor and so claim the capital. For that reason, it's a wonderful plot device for detective story writers, who can use it as a motive for serial murder; it was the theme of The Wrong Box by Robert Louis Stevenson and his stepson Lloyd Osbourne in 1889 (made into a film in 1966). The concept survives in a limited way in France.

    -Melior

    - That's OK, I wasn't really using all of my Constitutional rights anyway...

    screw $20,000, I'll do it for beer (nt) (2.50 / 2) (#136)
    by wrinkledshirt on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 03:46:25 AM EST



    you oughtta be kidding (2.00 / 1) (#140)
    by dimaq on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 05:41:13 AM EST

    if you consider comment ramblings discussion.

    henceforth, your observation of ddoe, is in fact an effect of someone's good attention-grabbing technique :)

    or something.

    Why just k5 users? (4.00 / 1) (#142)
    by bkeeler on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 11:12:14 AM EST

    Can't we take out a hit on, say, spammers?

    ...until the word "Maudling" is almost completely obscured.

    So let me get this straight... (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by Lethyos on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 12:41:09 PM EST

    Someone could come along with a perfectly valid viewpoint that is not accepted or someone offensive to a larger group of people. Ergo, they should be removed because they are a “troublemaker”? I don't understand your opposition to minority view. You love oppression, don't you?



    earth, my body; water, my blood; air, my breath; fire, my spirit
    WTF (4.00 / 1) (#146)
    by rodoke3 on Sat Aug 02, 2003 at 03:46:56 PM EST

    are diary "freeloaders"?

    Some say that removing the Diary section would help; it would eliminate freeloaders and crapflooders in short order...


    I take umbrage with such statments and am induced to pull out archaic and over pompous words to refute such insipid vitriol. -- kerinsky


    Hot shit are you? (2.50 / 4) (#149)
    by Nigga on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 01:40:54 AM EST

    kitten you think you're such hot shit right now because you have a story on the front page

    whatever

    if you validate your identity based on what voters on a glamorized blog site think then you need to reexamine yourself.

    --------
    The fuck happened to Nigga?

    What the fuck are you talking about? (none / 0) (#160)
    by kitten on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 04:32:43 AM EST


    mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
    [ Parent ]
    I'm comment 150... feels all nice and round nt (1.22 / 9) (#150)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:18:05 AM EST


    nt means no text
    and i'm comment 151 i feel so un-noteworthy nt (1.16 / 6) (#151)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:19:52 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    noway dude 151 is noteworthy: ie bacardi 151 nt (1.16 / 6) (#152)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:20:42 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    thankyou mr 152 yeah almost like being #420 nt (1.16 / 6) (#153)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:21:59 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    haha wouldn't that be so cool lets try to get ther (1.16 / 6) (#154)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:22:45 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    ok after this one there's just 265 posts to go! (1.16 / 6) (#155)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:23:41 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    too bad this article isn't more popular nt (1.16 / 6) (#156)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:24:25 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    right then we wouldn't have to do get to 420 solo (1.16 / 6) (#157)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:24:52 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    exactly nt (1.16 / 6) (#158)
    by Mister nt on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 03:25:05 AM EST


    nt means no text
    [ Parent ]
    Adequacy Style Troll (4.00 / 1) (#161)
    by thasmudyan on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 06:44:49 AM EST

    Hey guys, this is just a successful attempt to move ASTs to the front page!

    Although its length makes for a rather agonizing read, it is quite clear that the author tries to induce both flaming reactions and more troll posts. Wake up and realize that even talking about this is a complete waste of time, there is no content here!

    I have no idea how this ever got through as a story, some people must be on troll feeding duty today...

    More personal note: this is disgusting. I HATED adequacy.org, it would be sad to see kuro5hin slipping down THAT road.

    Nice idea for the Gibson-like cyberpunk fiction. (5.00 / 1) (#162)
    by slon! on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 12:34:03 PM EST

    Fortunately it won't work in our world. I think you've mistaken The Jackal movie with the real life. Hiring an assassin is much more personal and creates strong binding. There're good reasons why assassins aren't hired anonymously. It's highly dangerous act for both (actually three) parties. In almost all legal systems everyone involved will be heavily prosecuted if caught and convicted.

    Also it's not that simple to pass the guilt by being one of the many anonymous submitters. You can't escape moral (and legal) accountability this way.

    By the way it's not possible to create secure virtual place that cannot be traced (and consequently shut down) to the physical world we living in. SeaLand exists because they didn't managed to piss UK goverment yet. If they do RAF will flatten them on the spot. We're talking about people with split tongues here. They've attacked soverign and recognized country few months ago lying about reasons!


    --
    It is right to believe in the need to be free.

    Patent violation... (5.00 / 1) (#163)
    by loucura on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 12:58:49 PM EST

    I'm sorry, but this plan of yours infringes upon my   business method patent (US784344), my lawyers will be contacting you shortly regarding compulsary licensing of my patent, or (if you refuse) the subsequent display of my company's methods on your company.

    Thanks, and have a nice day. :)

    What bullshit :u) (none / 0) (#164)
    by Alienated Buddha on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 04:31:38 PM EST

    Try the patent search function once in a while

    [ Parent ]
    We need a 12 Days of Christmas Special... (2.00 / 1) (#165)
    by Sesquipundalian on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 05:29:56 PM EST

    On each of the twelve Days of Christmas, you do a randomly chosen member of the top 12 candidates (the twelve candidates that are closest to hitting threshold). After each hit the list is re-calculated, so that candidates as low as rank 24 will still incurr some looseness of the bowels over the Christmas Season.

    You throw in a Twelve Days of Christmas Whackin' Special here and I think I can speak for the group and say we'd have a deal.

    Take us up on this deal quickly though, the closer we get to Christmas, the tougher it'll be to make a profit this year.


    Did you know that gullible is not actually an english word?
    So someone accused you of making bomb threats (5.00 / 3) (#166)
    by CoolName on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 07:37:47 PM EST

    You claimed you were unable to get a job with IBM because of being falsely accused of being a terrorist. Now you are claiming to be an assassin. The employment situation is becoming increasinly problematic with these posts to K5. I think you best form your own company and come up with a killer app.

    "What does your conscience say? -- 'You shall become the person you are.'" Friedrich Nietzsche


    As far as I am aware.. (none / 0) (#168)
    by kitten on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 10:11:08 PM EST

    ..employment background checks do not usually involve "Has the prospective employee written any satirical articles for kuro5hin?"
    mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
    [ Parent ]
    PROBLEM SOLVED (2.50 / 3) (#169)
    by ZIGGY RHODES on Sun Aug 03, 2003 at 11:11:18 PM EST

    I HAVE SOLVED THE PROBLEM OF WHO TO LIKE AND WHO TO HATE....I JUST HATE EVERYONE AND FEEL NO GUILT...............POST AWAY IT WONT BOTHER ME WHAT YOU HAVE OR HAVE NOT TO SAY.........
    ..................................ThE wOrLd HaS gOnE tO hElL aNd I gOt lEfT aT tHe BuS sToP.....................................
    You have it wrong (4.00 / 1) (#170)
    by SwampGas on Mon Aug 04, 2003 at 04:49:17 AM EST

    This article isn't an example of this distributed assassin nonsense.  It's an example of distributed "tell your friends about the article to get it on the front page".

    How many fake accounts and friends did you have to obtain to get that on the front page?

    lameness extraordinaire (2.50 / 2) (#171)
    by gr00vey on Mon Aug 04, 2003 at 06:03:02 AM EST

    I am not usually one to bitch about stories here, as I am a "freeloader" as it were, but this story is just so lame, I had to whine a bit about it. Way to much effort trying to be clever, and no real cleverness. Or maybe I am just jaded as it is monday morning.. nah.

    I think you're on to something. (4.00 / 1) (#173)
    by Motekye on Mon Aug 04, 2003 at 11:41:42 PM EST

    Perhaps nothing as drastic as contract killings, but just account/IP bannings.

    I'm also pretty disgusted by the lack of humor most of the others have taken to the situation — It's funny! And the principle would work well. I think it should at least be attempted before it's dismissed. Even a "ban of the week" could clean this place up.


    Grrr....
    carboard tube samurai (none / 0) (#174)
    by nr1 on Tue Aug 05, 2003 at 05:03:10 AM EST

    who says cardboard tubes are harmless?

    Carboard and Steel
    1 2 3 4 5 6

    stupid me (none / 0) (#175)
    by nr1 on Tue Aug 05, 2003 at 08:16:41 AM EST

    ...put this on the wrong story

    [ Parent ]
    I thought this one was going to be interesting.... (4.00 / 1) (#179)
    by Niha on Wed Aug 13, 2003 at 01:52:04 PM EST

      I´m a bit deceived...  

    Distributed Denial of Existence | 179 comments (166 topical, 13 editorial, 0 hidden)
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