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Finally watch DVD's on Linux (for a price, that is)

By Commienst in News
Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 08:30:01 AM EST
Tags: Software (all tags)
Software

According to this wired story, Intervideo is releasing a software dvd decoder/player for $29.95. This is perfectly legal since they have a CSS license. According to what Intervideo says they will be opening as much of the product as possible.

Redhat could use it's IPO billions to make this program freeware (Hint, Hint) so linux could overcome the DVD hurdle.


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Finally watch DVD's on Linux (for a price, that is) | 20 comments (20 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)
This isn't all that new. Aside fro... (none / 0) (#6)
by neonman on Thu Apr 20, 2000 at 11:31:49 PM EST

neonman voted 0 on this story.

This isn't all that new. Aside from that, I feel what we really need a legal, yet fully open method by which we can watch dvds on Linux. Still, I may use this in the interim. I could also find a Creative dxr2 board for the new machine I am building. I'm sort of turned off about hardware decoding, though. It reminds me of the early days of the cdrom drives, where all drives used proprietary interface cards.
_________________________
Aaron Grogan
aaron@stufflikethat.org
http://stufflikethat.org/

Well, I'd prefer a free(speech) ver... (none / 0) (#9)
by Notromda on Thu Apr 20, 2000 at 11:42:02 PM EST

Notromda voted 1 on this story.

Well, I'd prefer a free(speech) version, but this is still a Good Thing(tm). I haven't yet played with DVD's, so I don't know a whole lot... I 'd like to hear some opinions on whether this is is better/worse than getting a hardware card. Are hardware cards supported in Linux?

And...... (none / 0) (#5)
by FlinkDelDinky on Thu Apr 20, 2000 at 11:42:18 PM EST

FlinkDelDinky voted -1 on this story.

And...

Redhat could use it's IPO billions ... (4.80 / 6) (#2)
by techt on Thu Apr 20, 2000 at 11:52:55 PM EST

techt voted 1 on this story.

Redhat could use it's IPO billions to make this program freeware (Hint, Hint) so linux could overcome the DVD hurdle.
 
This program isn't the cure, it's a band-aid. Unfortunately, a rather poor one at that.
 
The whole Linux and DVD issue is only on the surface about being able to play video on our machines and OS. Truly, it goes far deeper than that. What is at stake here is freedom and ownership. It is a clash of two cultures who have very different opinions on who owns information and what one can do with information once one has purchased it.
 
It is clear from the multiple responses by the MPAA and DVDCCA and those companies and organizations writing in on their behalf to the US Copyright Office on the DMCA that they have a very different opinion on what the consumer's rights are in regard to purchased property than your average consumer's opinion. For example, comment #45 which was from Time/Warner states:

Many of the baseless assertations in the comments flow from the false premise that the purchase of a DVD or other copy of a copyrighted work entitles the purchaser to exercise many, if not all, of the rights granted to the copyright owner by Section 106 of the Copyright Law. It should be common ground that the only right relinquished by the copyright owner to the purchaser (as set forth in section 109) is '...to sell or otherwise dispose of the posession of that copy...'.
In other words, as a consumer the only rights one has are to resell or destroy what you've legally bought with your money. All other uses are granted or taken away at the whim of the copyright holder -- including the viewing of the material!
 
The InterVideo program may actually turn out to hurt us. It appears the DVDCCA and the MPAA are already pointing at this program in order to say there is no need for an open source DVD player even though the InterVideo player is at the time of this posting still vapour.
 
No. This is not good news. Not at all.
--
Proud member of the Electronic Frontier Foundation!
Are You? http://www.eff.org/support/joineff.html
Stupid MPAA... I wish I was still m... (none / 0) (#8)
by pulsar on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 01:01:09 AM EST

pulsar voted 1 on this story.

Stupid MPAA... I wish I was still mirroring DeCSS! I can't wait until we have wide screen home TV's. Then I can watch all the cools movies out there in their 'unedited' format. I guess I never liked the fact I was watching something that "...has been edited to fit this screen"

Re: Stupid MPAA... I wish I was still m... (none / 0) (#16)
by fluffy grue on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 02:30:19 PM EST

You can still mirror DeCSS, and they don't even have to know about it. (BTW, I don't intend for people to mirror that image directly - I provide the steganographication source for a REASON :)
--
"Is not a quine" is not a quine.
I have a master's degree in science!

[ Hug Your Trikuare ]
[ Parent ]

With all the hoo-raw, it's unclear ... (none / 0) (#1)
by rusty on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 01:04:48 AM EST

rusty voted 1 on this story.

With all the hoo-raw, it's unclear to me why none of the other DVD software companies have come out and built one for linux yet. I suppose this is a good thing, but the whole DVD licensing scheme still seems rather twisted and devious to me.

____
Not the real rusty

Acctually, they couldn't. I'm prett... (3.50 / 2) (#4)
by henrik on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 01:38:03 AM EST

henrik voted 1 on this story.

Acctually, they couldn't. I'm pretty sure the license for CSS includes a non disclosure agreement. They could make it gratis (as free beer), but not free.

Akademiska Intresseklubben antecknar!

It's worth talking about...... (none / 0) (#11)
by ishbak on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 01:52:04 AM EST

ishbak voted 1 on this story.

It's worth talking about...

I use (and *love*) debian, so I don... (none / 0) (#3)
by ramses0 on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 02:49:00 AM EST

ramses0 voted 1 on this story.

I use (and *love*) debian, so I don't care too much about redhat, but it would be a good move for them to add value to their distro... "buy our distro, get the only DVD player for linux". Hook it up somehow to XMMS (since that's the obvious place to add in this feature), and maybe make the actual DVD decoding propietary (but all the UI, the framework, etc. could be gpl'd).

Problem solved, XMMS gets a video player framework, RedHat adds value to their distro, penguin-heads with nice hardware get to watch DVD's.

--Robert
[ rate all comments , for great justice | sell.com ]

Old News... (none / 0) (#12)
by JumpSuit Boy on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 02:54:46 AM EST

JumpSuit Boy voted 0 on this story.

Old News
The Director disavows any knowledge of the preceding comment.

"Redhat could use it's IPO billions... (none / 0) (#7)
by evro on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 03:02:40 AM EST

evro voted -1 on this story.

"Redhat could use it's IPO billions to make this program freeware (Hint, Hint) so linux could overcome the DVD hurdle. " Huh? Why would RedHat do something as asinine as that? Shell out all that money so that the entire world can have a license for this program? I think RedHat's money would be better spent in R&D for their own DVD player.
---
"Asking me who to follow -- don't ask me, I don't know!"

Re: "Redhat could use it's IPO billions... (none / 0) (#14)
by Commienst on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 12:35:48 PM EST

The commercial linux distributions are nicer than you may think. Mandrake has developers working on Enlightenment full time and the whole world can enjoy that. Mandrake also bought Bochs and committed LGPL'd it. RedHat also has tons of developers working on various projects and the whole community reaps those benefits. SUSE is doing hard work trying to write drivers as many unsupported video cards as they can under XFree86.

[ Parent ]
Mandrake (none / 0) (#18)
by Inoshiro on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 05:52:34 PM EST

"Mandrake has developers working on Enlightenment full time and the whole world can enjoy that."

There's a reason I left Windows.. It has to do with watching feature creep in action.. The whole world can enjoy the choice to something that is not Enlightenment ;-)



--
[ イノシロ ]
[ Parent ]
Is this Good(tm) or Bad(tm) for our... (3.00 / 1) (#13)
by Camelot on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 04:48:22 AM EST

Camelot voted 1 on this story.

Is this Good(tm) or Bad(tm) for our Cause(tm) ? Because software to play DVDs in Linux will be available, DeCSS might be seen to have no legitimate use. "You can already view DVDs - the only reason for DeCSS is piracy".

Re: Is this Good(tm) or Bad(tm) for our... (none / 0) (#15)
by fluffy grue on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 02:12:01 PM EST

The MPAA was already saying that there were commercial Linux DVD players when this product was only being worked on and hadn't even been announced yet. This only gives them more of an excuse. My response then, and still now, was that since it's binary-only, that means that the platform independence of it will be necessarily limited. What happens when libc7 is the standard? What if I'm still running a libc5-based system? What if I'm running an IA-64 or SPARC or some experimental, unannounced CPU architecture which has Linux running on an early prototype? Will this company instantly support all those packages? What if they do fullscreen video in a braindead way (or any way not using XFree86 DGA, for that matter) and require me to run as root? I'm certainly not going to run a proprietary binary as root on my system, even if that IS modus operandi for Win9x.

Furthermore, I refuse to believe that such an asininely stupid encryption mechanism can be considered a "trade secret." Protection of trade secrets is all well and good, but triple-XOR isn't exactly a secret mechanism they came up with on their own (well, actually, they probably DID, without knowing anything about cryptography, hence why it sucks so bad).
--
"Is not a quine" is not a quine.
I have a master's degree in science!

[ Hug Your Trikuare ]
[ Parent ]

Excellent, it's about time. ... (none / 0) (#10)
by dlc on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 08:30:01 AM EST

dlc voted 1 on this story.

Excellent, it's about time.

(darren)

Grrrr. (4.30 / 3) (#17)
by fluffy grue on Fri Apr 21, 2000 at 02:40:26 PM EST

This comment just exceedingly pisses me off:
LinDVD will be available late spring and will be priced at $29.95. If "someone writes a multichannel audio driver for their Linux sound card," Monastiero said, "the multichannel version would be $49.95 and would support full 5.1 output."
Yup, they're a proprietary software company all right. For what basically amounts to flipping a bit (since they've already got the 5.1 decoding coded, right? not that it matters, since AFAIK the 5.1 audio tracks on the DVD are stored in the raw S/PDIF format already *anyway*), they feel justified in charging an extra $20.

And what's with that cheery marketroid-type quote from Linus Torvalds?

Actually, even the very first line in the article is annoying as all hell.

I feel like free software's being eroded away just like how the Microsoft Halloween Document said it could be. It's just that it didn't come from Microsoft, and so it caught all of us completely off-guard. :/
--
"Is not a quine" is not a quine.
I have a master's degree in science!

[ Hug Your Trikuare ]

Re: Grrrr. (none / 0) (#19)
by Pseudonymous Coward on Sat Apr 22, 2000 at 11:25:33 AM EST

AFAIK the 5.1 audio tracks on the DVD are stored in the raw S/PDIF format already *anyway*

DVD 5.1 audio is most commonly stored in Dolby AC-3, which is a perceptual-encoding compressed multichannel bitstream. There are exceptions -- DTS being the largest -- but, it turns out that no, you can't just pipe the multichannel out an S/PDIF port and get anything coherent unless you've got outboard AC-3 decoding. Of course, you can buy that, but not for $20.

Also, as far as I know, a license from Dolby Labs is needed to get the codecs necessary to uncompress the AC-3 stream into raw audio. Obviously, they've got this license since their other products do have this feature, but I'm sure there is a per-sale cost associated with it. Of course, I doubt that cost justifies anywhere near another $20 retail value.

FWIW, I agree with your other sentiments, but they are justified in deciding how to price their software. It's simply unfortunate that a libre (contrast: gratis) alternative will be run roughshod from the market were it to appear.

[ Parent ]

Linus Quote (none / 0) (#20)
by rusty on Sat Apr 22, 2000 at 03:07:46 PM EST

That is kind of eerie.
"This is another exciting day for the Linux community," said Linus Torvalds, creator of the Linux operating system. "[Linux] continues to attract industry-leading software companies like InterVideo. Their digital video and audio products will greatly enhance the Linux multimedia experience."
He used the phrases "Linux community", "industry-leading", "greatly enhance", and "multimedia experience". That's almost a winning buzzword-bingo card right there, if you were lucky. What are they putting in the water over there at Transmeta these days? Or did the Wired reporter just catch him off guard, and he had to say something?

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]
Finally watch DVD's on Linux (for a price, that is) | 20 comments (20 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
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