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[P]
The Barrels of Snowtown

By Ta bu shi da yu in News
Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 10:47:43 AM EST
Tags: News (all tags)
News

The small hamlet of Snowtown is located in rural South Australia about 90 miles north of Adelaide. More noted for it's surrounding sheep and wheat farms, it seems like an ordinary little town.

But Snowtown is no ordinary sleepy little town. For what Detective Steve McCoy discovered in the old disused bank building on the corner of High St and Railway Terrace would shock and sicken a nation.


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Detective McCoy recalls: "The stench was unbearable. It was the stench of what I would say was rotting flesh, rotting bodies, human bodies. It was putrid. It permeated your hair, your clothing, everything you had on the stench got into. It was horrific." Detective McCoy had discovered the dismembered limbs and body parts of six people, each carefully placed into a black plastic barrel.

The story of Australia's worst serial killings revolves around John Justin Bunting, aged 37. A small, unassuming looking man who wears glasses, his exterior belies a man of revenge, determination and hatred. On Tuesday, 9th August 2003 Bunting was found guilty at the Supreme Court of South Australia of 11 murders. Along with his accomplices, Robert Joe Wagner, Mark Ray Haydon and James Vlassakis they murdered and dismembered Clinton Tezise, 22, Ray Davies, 26, Michael Gardiner, 19, Barry Lane, 42, Thomas Tevilyan, 18, Gavin Porter, 29, Troy Youde, 21, Fred Brooks, 18, Gary O'Dwyer, 29, Elizabeth Haydon, 37, and David Johnson, 24 (the jury was unable to decide whether they had murdered Suzanne Allen, 47). Each time they killed their victims - with the exception of Thomas Trevilyan and Suzanne Allen, they would cut up the bodies and place them in a barrel of hydrochloric acid, which they stored at the abandoned Snowtown State Bank, towards the centre of town.

History of Events in the Snowtown Serial Killings

Justin Bunting, himself an abused child, had a pathological hatred of homosexuals and paedophiles. Bunting had arrived in Snowtown in the early 80s intending to move on to Perth, but his car broke down and he never moved on. Soon, through his lover Suzanne Allen, Bunting was to discover the existence of a known paedophile and transvestite by the name of Barry Lane. Buntings revulsion of Lane ate away at him, and he started plotting and calculating his murder. Bunting kept a "spider wall" - a diagram with Lane in the centre and woolen string stretched out to other figures who Bunting had targetted as paedophiles.

Through Lane, Bunting became friends with Robert Wagner, a young man who had been picked up at the age of 14 by Lane. Wagner had been sexually abused while he was a young child by a family friend and had run away from home. When Lane took in Wagner he forced him into a homosexual relationship for four years as they travelled the country, eventually completing their journey in Snowtown. Bunting befriended Wagner and got him away from Lane. Under his influence Wagner became more aggressive and angry about the way he'd been treated.

Bunting's first killing started with Clinton Trezise, a young gay man who was the lover of Barry Lane. In 1992 both Robert Wagner and Justin Buntings lured him to Salisbury North and then murdered him, burying him in a shallow grave in north Adelaide.

In the meantime, Bunting was in a relationship with a woman by the name of Elizabeth Harvey.  Elizabeth had two sons, Troy Youde and James Vlassakis. Vlassakis had been abused when he was young by his half-brother and when Bunting found him he befriended him also, again mentoring him in the hatred that he had fueled in Wagner. Bunting was also lovers with a local woman, Suzanne Allen. In 1995 Allen rented a caravan to a Mr. Ray Davies who Allen's daughter alleges sexually abused her children. Justin Bunting and Elizabeth Harvey killed Ray Davies and buried him in Buntings backyard.

(Suzanne Allen disappeared in 1996. According to Bunting, she was found by himself and Wagner dead in her home. They dismembered the dead body and buried her in 11 garbage bags in the same backyard they buried Ray Davies.)

Eventually, in 1997, Bunting and Wagner decide to act on their plans to kill Lane. Along with an ex-lover of Lane's, Thomas Trevilyan, they kidnapped Lane and after torturing him strangled and killed him. Not happy with just one murder, however, Bunting and Wagner decided to kill Michael Gardiner. He was known by them through Bunting's de factos' cousin's neighbour - he was hated by them because he was known as "the biggest homo". Somehow, and it's not clear how this happened, one of Vlassakis's friends, Gavin Porter, got caught up and also got killed by the duo.

(Thomas Trevilyan moved in with Wagner and his de facto Vicki Mills. In 1997 he was told to move out and was later found hanging from a tree near Kerbrook.)

Vlassakis arrived on the scene and discovered his friend, Lane and Gardiner being stuffed into barrels. Vlassakis now felt involved and is goaded into killing his half-brother Youde.

The trio's killing spree continued as they tortured and killed those who they decided was a paedophile or whom they didn't like. They killed Fred Brooks in 1998, after horrifically torturing him, because Bunting didn't like him. In the same year they murdered Elizabeth Haydon, the sister of Jodie Elliot (who Bunting was engaged to at the time) because she expressed her love for Bunting though she was a married woman. They horrifically tortured and killed Gary O'Dwyer because Bunting told Vlassakis that he looked like his half-brother.

The last person they killed before they were caught by the police was David Johnson, Vlassakis's 21-year old step-brother. They basically killed him for his money - extracting his PIN number through beatings.

Motives Behind the Killings

So why did they do it? The primary motive was Justin Bunting overwhelming hatred of homosexuals and paedophiles. Bunting surrounded himself by weak and easily manipulated people who also shared the same hatred. He fanned their hatred and bloodlust to let them become willing partners in his murders. Yet this is not the only motive, for at the end they callously tortured Vlassakis's step-brother for his PIN and tried to get the money out of his bank account. They also tortured and recorded the voice of Gary O'dwyer and attempted to play it over the phone to give the impression that he was still alive. They attempted to cash in several of the victims welfare cheques, and of course they killed David Johnson to get his PIN and access his bank account.

In preparing this story, I was struck by the intricate set of relationships and series of events that conspired to start off the sensational chain of killings that occurred in Snowtown. All people, even the murderers, were known to each other and were emotionally or physically damaged over the course of their lives. Truly, this will be recorded in history as Australia's worst and most hideous serial killings.

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The Barrels of Snowtown | 126 comments (94 topical, 32 editorial, 0 hidden)
Every AI magazine has better horror stories... (3.38 / 13) (#2)
by megid on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 12:15:56 PM EST

By "AI" I mean Amnesty International, of course, not the intelligence stuff. And yes, while it is a nice emotional horror story that you have drawn here (credits for you), there are plenty of more horrific things on this planet. Oh wait -- they dont happen in the "civilized" world, so they are not as important... Sorry, forgot.

Anyway, nice story.

--
"think first, write second, speak third."

It's not that (4.71 / 7) (#38)
by SocratesGhost on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 07:33:03 PM EST

Since when do the murderings of serial killers merit a "oh well" sort of attitude? You know it doesn't, so don't treat it that way. Like John Donne said, "Any man's death diminishes me because I am involved in mankind."

On the other hand, there's a general feeling that there's little that we can do about some of the larger problems in the world. The UN reacts too slowly and the US too hastily. In the end, tragic horrible death occurs whether it's from a knock on a door late at night, a cruise missile, or a thug's machine gun.

But when bad things happen in the free world, we feel that it is possible for change to come from the people. The outrage exists because it's in our mandate to do things to prevent such tragedies. There's greater tragedies, sure, but let's keep perspective: it's hard enough to keep our own nations safe as this article shows, and we don't have to wait 9 months for the UN investigation to give its report.

-Soc
I drank what?


[ Parent ]
Vigilantism... (3.00 / 1) (#50)
by Canar on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 02:14:44 AM EST

I, for one, wouldn't mind seeing more murderings of serial killers. Let's rid ourselves of them all.

[ Parent ]
heh (none / 0) (#53)
by SocratesGhost on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 04:03:47 AM EST

That's why I coined a new word. "The murder of serial killers" could mean that the killers get killed. But if we're talking about what they do... murdering people... then we're talking about the serial killings themselves. Having fun with language. oh well.

-Soc
I drank what?


[ Parent ]
That's not the reason (none / 0) (#92)
by curunir on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:03:31 PM EST

But when bad things happen in the free world, we feel that it is possible for change to come from the people.

That's not at all why we focus on events in the "free world." The real reason is that events in the "free world" hit closer to home. We can more easily imagine them happening to us. Violence in 3rd world countries, however horrific, is still happening to someone else. But when someone shatters the illusion of safety that we have in the "free world," we feel that we need to understand it completely to protect ourselves from it. It's a primitive reaction to fear...to learn as much as possible about whatever you're afraid of.

Take the example of the Laci Peterson murder. While some drug addict getting shot in the street is sad, you can distance yourself from the fear that it would cause by reassuring yourself that you're not a drug addict...you could never end up in that situation. But such rationales are harder to find when the case is an expectant mother living in a respectable neighborhood who is murdered by her husband. What aspect of one's lives can one point to in order to believe that it could never happen to them?

[ Parent ]
i think we kinda agree (none / 0) (#96)
by SocratesGhost on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 06:00:16 PM EST

for me, it's about what we think we can control. We think we can control respectable neighborhoods, so Laci Peterson becomes a flashpoint. It's not just a matter of it happening close to home; serial murders in Australia is just as troublesome to me as serial murders in California, but not as troublesome as drug deals gone bad in New York City. Why? I suspect it's because the drug deal is so dissimilar to my life and I know I'd never be in danger of it that I'm protected from it. A serial killer, however, we never know when that can strike.

I think if we were to set up a hierarchy of how much things bother us, it would probably be something like this:

  1. Ourselves
  2. Our families
  3. Our neighborhoods
  4. Similar (or better) neighborhoods to where we live
  5. Dissimilar neighborhoods but in a similar culture
  6. Similar neighborhood in a dissimilar culture
  7. Dissimilar neighborhoods in a dissimilar culture
There's a correlation about it being close to home, but there's also a correlation with our ability to exert control. We care about conditions similar to our own because we want to make sure it doesn't happen to us. It can happen anywhere in the world, but we're more concerned that it doesn't happen to us than we are about it happening at all; that's why we have an interest in events in circumstances similar to our own so that we can prevent it. We already know that the third world is dysfunctional; but we expect better in the free world especially since we have to live in it.

Look at it in another way, I'm sure this article holds much greater interest to homosexuals than it does to me. I'd bet that this article concerns homosexuals more than Monrovia concerns them.

-Soc
I drank what?


[ Parent ]
Mostly, it's unexpected (none / 0) (#107)
by RadiantMatrix on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 01:39:31 AM EST

While some drug addict getting shot in the street is sad, you can distance yourself from the fear that it would cause by reassuring yourself that you're not a drug addict...you could never end up in that situation. But such rationales are harder to find when the case is an expectant mother living in a respectable neighborhood who is murdered by her husband.
While I think there's some merit to that, I think it's more a case of the unexpected. Horrible tragedies in 3rd-world countries are to be expected. Murders of drug addicts and criminals are to be expected. But when an expecting mother is killed by her own husband, we're shocked -- no one can nod and say "well, that's no surprise."

I think that's why it hits so close to home.

----------
I don't like spam - Parent ]

As an advocate of the 2nd Amendment, (2.54 / 31) (#4)
by xprt on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 12:21:01 PM EST

I must comment that this proves yet again that people commit just as much violent crime with or without guns. Australia has some of the strictest gun laws in the world - you're not even allowed rifles - yet they manage to slaughter each other just as efficiently as us Americans.

Instead, we must ask what are the real causes of violence? Australia and America share one thing: violent media. Violent films, violent TV, violent news, violent video games. The way these people killed paedophiles for sport is reminiscent of video games - in fact it reminds me of "Vice City:GTA" which encourages people to kill prostitutes for fun. Talk about breeding serial killers.

Add this to the fact that most Australians are direct descendants of convicts, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

(By the way, not a big fish dude, informative article, +1FP).

You turd (1.33 / 9) (#8)
by Zombie Uday Hussein on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 01:07:33 PM EST



--
not ZOMBIE turkey. just turkey. maybe a little mayo.
[ Parent ]
um. no. (4.70 / 10) (#17)
by Run4YourLives on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 03:54:47 PM EST

yet they manage to slaughter each other just as efficiently as us Americans.

Hardly. No first world country comes close to the US's murder rate. Please check your facts before posting tripe like this.

It's slightly Japanese, but without all of that fanatical devotion to the workplace. - CheeseburgerBrown
[ Parent ]

Ummm (3.12 / 8) (#21)
by CENGEL3 on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:03:12 PM EST

You must have a very limited definition of "first world" then. Last time I checked.... Russia, The Baltic States, Mexico and Brazil all exceeded the U.S. homicide rate (sometimes by a signifigant amount). That's just off the top of my head.

Are you saying that you don't consider any of those countries "first world"?

You, sir, have the lowest I.Q. of any person in this room wearing 1 blue sock and 1 red sock.

[ Parent ]

None of those are "first world" (4.42 / 7) (#29)
by CanSpice on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:48:43 PM EST

The phrase "first world" originally meant countries that were developed, capitalist, and industrial. This included North American, western Europe, Japan, and Australia. The "second world" countries were those that were on the "other side" during the Cold War -- the USSR, China, and eastern European countries. "Third world" was everybody else.

The meanings have shifted slightly so that "first world" still means developed and industrial, but "third world" means "developing" -- countries like those in Africa. "Second world" countries would be those somewhere in between. They might be developed and rich (like, say, Saudi Arabia) but don't enjoy freedoms of those in first world countries (like, say, Canada). They might be fairly free, but infrastructure is lacking.

Under either meaning none of your examples count as first world countries. They'd all be second world countries at best.

[ Parent ]

No way (1.50 / 2) (#65)
by duffbeer703 on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 08:27:44 AM EST

You're arguing a point that is just plain wrong. Arguing that a nation like Brazil, with a GDP on par with Italy and greater than Spain, is a third-world country is a joke.

[ Parent ]
for your next trick (5.00 / 1) (#86)
by Battle Troll on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 01:54:41 PM EST

Compare the per capita GDPs.
--
Skarphedinn was carrying the axe with which he had killed Thrainn Sigfusson and which he called 'Battle Troll.'
Njal's Saga, ca 1280 AD
[ Parent ]
Brazil != third world (1.00 / 1) (#89)
by CanSpice on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 03:10:00 PM EST

I never said Brazil was a third world country. I said it would be a second world country at best. Brazil's a good example of a second world country.

But thanks for trying to put words into my mouth. Next time try reading what I actually said.

[ Parent ]

Worlds (4.00 / 2) (#104)
by dn on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:56:24 PM EST

Brazil's a good example of a second world country.
The "worlds" are Cold War terminology. The first world is the prosperous, democratic US-allied countries*. The second world was the authoritarian Soviet-allied countries. The third world was everybody else.</pedantic>

*Does France still count as first world?

    I ♥
TOXIC
WASTE

[ Parent ]

Get a clue, Part 2 (1.00 / 1) (#106)
by duffbeer703 on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 12:35:49 AM EST

Why don't you go get an encyclopedia and figure out what "Second World" means.

Brazil was never under the Soviet sphere of influence.

[ Parent ]

Learn to read, part 2 (5.00 / 1) (#113)
by CanSpice on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 03:39:44 PM EST

Try not glossing over the second part of my post where I said:
The meanings have shifted slightly so that "first world" still means developed and industrial, but "third world" means "developing" -- countries like those in Africa. "Second world" countries would be those somewhere in between. They might be developed and rich (like, say, Saudi Arabia) but don't enjoy freedoms of those in first world countries (like, say, Canada). They might be fairly free, but infrastructure is lacking.
Comprendez-vous?

[ Parent ]
Oh yeah? (4.60 / 5) (#19)
by Tatarigami on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 04:15:57 PM EST

Add this to the fact that most Australians are direct descendants of convicts,

Nice to see you've done your research. Wouldn't want to make any unjustified claims without knowing what we're talking about and slander an entire nation, would we?

[ Parent ]

They shipped convicts to America first (4.50 / 8) (#26)
by Stick on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:41:13 PM EST

Click


---
Stick, thine posts bring light to mine eyes, tingles to my loins. Yea, each moment I sit, my monitor before me, waiting, yearning, needing your prose to make the moment complete. - Joh3n
[ Parent ]
Firearms and Convicts (4.28 / 7) (#33)
by cam on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:18:53 PM EST

Australia State firearm laws are no worse then Marylands or DC's. You can own a rifle or pistol in Australia.

As to convicts, Georgia was upset when US independance happened and they lost their source of cheap labor. Incidentally when the US revolted from British rule was in 1776. In 1770 Cook was mapping Australia, by 1788 the first fleet was dumping convicts on Australian shores. The British needing a new place to dump their convicts is very definately related to their losing the US as a dumping ground.

I agree totally with the comment on violent media, in particular a news media and politicians that promote a culture of fear and intolerance.

cam
Freedom, Liberty, Equity and an Australian Republic
[ Parent ]

Slaggin' someone else's country (5.00 / 5) (#43)
by QuantumG on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 10:08:02 PM EST

Add this to the fact that most Australians are direct descendants of convicts, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

You never hear us Australians saying "well ya know, they did have a civil war over the right to own slaves" do ya?

Gun fire is the sound of freedom.
[ Parent ]

Civil War (none / 0) (#108)
by RadiantMatrix on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 01:49:38 AM EST

The American Civil War had almost nothing to do with slavery. The Union President Lincoln made a slavery issue by emancipating slaves in Confederate territory. Thus, it became in the slaves' own best interests to fight against their masters.

Quite a stroke of tactical genius on the part of Lincoln, but it hardly makes the Civil War about slavery.

Rather, it was a war over states' rights (and some other issues), but ultimately over a State's right to leave the Union.

----------
I don't like spam - Parent ]

Bullshit (none / 0) (#114)
by dasunt on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 07:35:26 PM EST

Repeat after me: The Civil War was not about state's right.

"As early as December, 1862, Pres. Jefferson Davis denounced states' rights as destructive to the Confederacy."[1]

"By February 1864 President Davis despaired: 'Public meetings of treasonable character, in the name of state sovereignty, are being held."[2]

Sounds like the CSA (Confederate States of America) sure supported states' rights.

[1] Lies My Teacher Told Me, James W. Loewen, pg 190. The source seems to be listed as either Mississippi: Conflict and Change by James W. Loewen (again) and Charles Sallis or War Within a War by Reid Mitchell.
[2] Lies My Teacher Told Me, James W. Loewen, pg 191. No source given and I can't find this quotation on google.



[ Parent ]
Tactical Genius? (none / 0) (#126)
by error 404 on Tue Nov 25, 2003 at 10:55:33 AM EST

Slave rebellion was not a significant factor in the outcome of the Civil War. The black Union units helped, but I don't know how big a factor the slavery issue was in their recruitment. The Union military didn't think they were worth much. Certainly not enough to call emancipation a stroke of tactical genius.

The States Rights issue gets a little complicated. Most Northerners were semi-content to let the South be, until the federal govornment forced them to hunt escaped slaves.

The question of what a war is about is always complicated. The Civil War was closer to being about slavery than the current Iraq is to being about freedom for the Iraqi people.


..................................
Electrical banana is bound to be the very next phase
- Donovan

[ Parent ]

Oh, go fuck off. (none / 0) (#49)
by kesuari on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 02:06:50 AM EST

Add this to the fact that most Australians are direct descendants of convicts, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

Big whoop. With that logic, the decendents of all criminals should be locked up. I'm pretty sure everyone will have a criminal in their family tree...

[ Parent ]

Hate to burst your bubble (none / 0) (#56)
by monkeymind on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:24:51 AM EST

but South Australia, where this happened, is the one place in Oz where there were never any convicts sent. In fact they pride themselves on it, but SA is known as the serial killer capital of Australia.

Go figure.

I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people and assume the deserve it.
[ Parent ]

Ah Adelaide... (none / 0) (#79)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:13:03 AM EST

... the city of churches and serial killers. A fine place to live :P

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

churches and serial killers (none / 0) (#122)
by monkeymind on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 05:46:49 AM EST

So would that be correlation or causation?

I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people and assume the deserve it.
[ Parent ]

lol! (none / 0) (#123)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Sat Sep 13, 2003 at 03:40:06 AM EST

Neither... as with correlation it'd mean that churches and serial killers need each other, and with causation it would mean that either serial killers caused churches (??) or churches caused serial killers.

I ain't gonna go there! :P

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

Well, they also share religion. (2.66 / 3) (#73)
by hmspgh on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 10:05:10 AM EST

You don't hear of many atheistic serial killers, do you? That's because Jeebus makes people kill! Just look at all the death and destruction that's in the bible. And then realize that people are willingly exposing their children to this every Sunday, possibly other days, too! Do you want your daughters reading about how Lot's daughters got him drunk and raped him (Genesis 19:34)? Or how Judah's first born, Er, was killed because he was wicked (Genesis 38:7)?

Surely we must unite to stop spreading this horrible story. Let's join together and Ban The Bible!
---
"Aldous Huxley's 1983 has arrived." - Arthur Spada, CT Public Safety Commis.
[ Parent ]
Atheistic serial killers? (none / 0) (#93)
by Neolith on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:14:16 PM EST

You don't hear of many atheistic serial killers, do you?

Not really.  Except for Mao and Stalin. There are lots of funny stories about them too.

Humans can be violent and kill people.  Religion is often a convenient excuse, but that's all it is.

[ Parent ]

Nice. (none / 0) (#80)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:17:05 AM EST

Great reaction - have a 5! You're pretty effective at what you do, xprt. I can only look on in awe!

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú


---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

gun control (none / 0) (#110)
by towerssotall on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 02:06:04 AM EST

gun control meant it was only 10 dead, over many years.

Australia was settled because the american colonies were no longer available to accept them after the revolution.

so that would apply as much to you then sunshine.

"the fate of Charles the First, hath only made kings more subtle
- not more just."

- - Thomas Paine
[ Parent ]

attention whore (none / 0) (#116)
by auraslip on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 02:15:13 AM EST


___-___
[ Parent ]
blaming the media... (none / 0) (#118)
by rebelcan on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 03:55:22 AM EST

...for violence in society is like blaming the auto industry for all the car accidents.


=============================
God is dead -- Nietzsche
Nietzsche is dead -- God
but Zombie Nietzsche lives! -- Zombie Nietzsche
[ Parent ]
I don't know about you (2.09 / 11) (#5)
by tzanger on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 12:22:16 PM EST

But I don't see anything all that wrong about a pathological hatred against paedophiles.  There are some diseases you just can't cure.

I'm only half joking.

Hating them pathologically is fine. (3.00 / 1) (#32)
by craigd on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:17:36 PM EST

Heck, I certainly do. Though homophobia, not homosexuality, is the disease with the other case, and nothing justifies murder.


A man who says little is a man who speaks two syllables.
[ Parent ]
Yup. (none / 0) (#68)
by tzanger on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 09:54:54 AM EST

Totally agree...  Not sure why I deserved a couple of those zereoes and ones, but hey, it's my opinion and I can have it.

[ Parent ]
You advocate trial by a single psychopath? [nt] (none / 0) (#64)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:27:39 AM EST


---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

Hey now (none / 0) (#69)
by tzanger on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 09:56:07 AM EST

I didn't say murdering them was right, I just said that I could definitely see the guy's pathological hatred for paedophiles.  

What is it, wrong to hate?  I never said I condoned his murders.

[ Parent ]

OK, fair enough [nt] (none / 0) (#83)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:43:12 AM EST


---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

What Do You Mean? (4.00 / 3) (#85)
by freestylefiend on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 12:50:02 PM EST

What do you mean by 'paedophiles'? I understand three different meanings: people who abuse children, people who have sex with young adults and people who are tempted to abuse children but restrain themselves. The second groups is alright and the third group is heroic. If you hate paedophiles of the first kind, then I understand but disagree.

[ Parent ]
I just fucked a 17 year old (none / 0) (#117)
by auraslip on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 02:16:18 AM EST

please don't burn me on a cross
___-___
[ Parent ]
As a father of four... (1.38 / 50) (#11)
by Real World Stuff on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 02:03:56 PM EST

The elimination of homosexuals and child molestors by any means required has my full endorsement.

2 B 1 ask 1
Even if it eliminated (5.00 / 4) (#40)
by richarj on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 09:20:05 PM EST

Your own children. Because they where somebodies children.

"if you are uncool, don't worry, K5 is still the place for you!" -- rusty
[ Parent ]
0, for advocating murder (3.00 / 2) (#62)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:24:10 AM EST

And being a dickhead.

---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

It'd be funny if one of your kids turned out gay (4.66 / 6) (#63)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:25:43 AM EST

nt

---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

While I can't condone their actions... (3.00 / 1) (#77)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 10:53:54 AM EST

... each one of the murderers was abused as children. Please chew on this for a while.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

As a troll-loather, (none / 0) (#100)
by Canar on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 08:34:22 PM EST

Nice copy of xprt's style. boggles

[ Parent ]
Vote it up! (4.00 / 5) (#14)
by RobotSlave on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 03:01:04 PM EST

Sure, it's the kind of story you'd expect from Inside Edition, but since the good ship Kuro5hin is lost at sea, becalmed in the summer doldrums with slack sails and dwindling stores, I think a shift in tone on these thirsty decks to something resembling lurid tabloid journalism would be a considerable improvement.

Lurid? (2.00 / 1) (#25)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:40:59 PM EST

All I can say it that this story is not half as sensational as I could have made it.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

This is why homosexuality is wrong [nt] (1.25 / 40) (#23)
by Stick on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:35:26 PM EST




---
Stick, thine posts bring light to mine eyes, tingles to my loins. Yea, each moment I sit, my monitor before me, waiting, yearning, needing your prose to make the moment complete. - Joh3n
Why, because you'd be in danger of getting killed? (3.00 / 1) (#24)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:38:50 PM EST

Still, I feel honoured that Stick thought enough of the story to troll in it!

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

No (3.50 / 2) (#27)
by Stick on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:43:16 PM EST

Because I'm going to have clean up all their bodies after their victims kill them all.


---
Stick, thine posts bring light to mine eyes, tingles to my loins. Yea, each moment I sit, my monitor before me, waiting, yearning, needing your prose to make the moment complete. - Joh3n
[ Parent ]
How so? (2.00 / 2) (#30)
by foofish on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:54:59 PM EST

How exactly do you figure? You realize that the people doing the killing were straight.
-
Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
[ Parent ]
Yes... (2.25 / 4) (#36)
by Stick on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:27:06 PM EST

And the fact that they were killed was caused by homosexuals engaged in homosexual behaviours.


---
Stick, thine posts bring light to mine eyes, tingles to my loins. Yea, each moment I sit, my monitor before me, waiting, yearning, needing your prose to make the moment complete. - Joh3n
[ Parent ]
No it isn't (4.66 / 3) (#47)
by livus on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 01:04:00 AM EST

raping little boys isnt "homosexual behaviour", any more than raping little girls is "heterosexual behaviour".

Theyre both pedo behaviour.

---
HIREZ substitute.
be concrete asshole, or shut up. - CTS
I guess I skipped school or something to drink on the internet? - lonelyhobo
I'd like to hope that any impression you got about us from internet forums was incorrect. - debillitatus
I consider myself trolled more or less just by visiting the site. HollyHopDrive

[ Parent ]

There's no difference (1.00 / 4) (#48)
by Stick on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 01:20:33 AM EST

Same disorder, different age groups, same result.


---
Stick, thine posts bring light to mine eyes, tingles to my loins. Yea, each moment I sit, my monitor before me, waiting, yearning, needing your prose to make the moment complete. - Joh3n
[ Parent ]
they're both (none / 0) (#90)
by fae on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 04:23:15 PM EST

Now shut up.

-- fae: but an atom in the great mass of humanity
[ Parent ]
why would this post get a zero? (2.33 / 15) (#31)
by ninja rmg on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:06:38 PM EST

honestly people, this site is about dicussion. if you aren't willing to have your values questioned, maybe you should take your business elsewhere. it's this sort of groupthink mentality that is pulling kuro5hin down the slippery slope of mediocrity.



[ Parent ]
Not that (2.28 / 7) (#34)
by Eater on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:20:14 PM EST

I would rate it 0 because it's a post with no text on the main story page. Too bad I lost my trusted user status.

Eater.

[ Parent ]
yes it is. /nt (2.33 / 9) (#35)
by ninja rmg on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 06:21:00 PM EST





[ Parent ]
I had my values questioned (2.33 / 3) (#37)
by inerte on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 07:16:14 PM EST

What made you think I didn't?

--
Bodily exercise, when compulsory, does no harm to the body; but knowledge which is acquired under compulsion obtains no hold on the mind.
[ Parent ]

who do you think you are, partykidd? <n/t> (2.50 / 4) (#39)
by kjb on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 08:14:21 PM EST


--
Now watch this drive.
[ Parent ]

Exactly how is that comment a discussion? (4.75 / 4) (#59)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 06:02:48 AM EST

"This is why homosexuality is wrong" is discrimantory and inflammatory without providing a reason or any backing. It implies that homosexuals are serial killers, something I find to be an insult rather than a comment. Furthermore it is a blatant troll just out to attract flame. So 0 it gets.


---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

Actually (5.00 / 2) (#60)
by kesuari on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:20:07 AM EST

Actually, it implies that homosexuals are serial killees. The homosexuals were the victims in this case. The implication is that homosexuals turn 'normal' people to murtherers.

[ Parent ]
Ahh (4.50 / 2) (#61)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:21:47 AM EST

Forgive me if the rather strange logic wasn't immediately apparent.

---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

I'll tell you why. (2.33 / 3) (#98)
by tkatchev on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:05:05 PM EST

The fags take it personally.

   -- Signed, Lev Andropoff, cosmonaut.
[ Parent ]

What do you mean? (none / 0) (#101)
by Big Sexxy Joe on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 08:59:18 PM EST

Do you mean the existence of websites such kuro5hin.org is why homosexuality is wrong?

I'm like Jesus, only better.
Democracy Now! - your daily, uncensored, corporate-free grassroots news hour
[ Parent ]
+1, Facinating (3.62 / 8) (#28)
by egg troll on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 05:47:27 PM EST

Not only that but I bet within the hour we'll see this on 20271 with the name "Justin Bunting" replaced with that of "Scott Lockwood".

He's a bondage fan, a gastronome, a sensualist
Unparalleled for sinister lasciviousness.

Why bet (5.00 / 1) (#91)
by it certainly is on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:03:12 PM EST

with someone who can easily control the outcome of the bet?

Anyway, 20721 is a cesspool of Vlad and Vlad haters (probably all Vlad sockpuppets). Why isn't there anything interesting there?

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

What does a cesspool of Vlad look like? (nt) (none / 0) (#120)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 04:36:12 AM EST



---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]
I was in the UK when this hit the news (4.00 / 6) (#44)
by QuantumG on Tue Sep 09, 2003 at 10:12:24 PM EST

I came back to Australia and someone made a joke about hydrochloric acid and barrels (as is the standard Australian way of dealing with tragedy) and I didn't get it. When they explained it to me I was like "what the fuck?"

Gun fire is the sound of freedom.
The irony of it all... (5.00 / 2) (#54)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:22:40 AM EST

... is that the case was suppressed - but only in South Australia! The rest of Australia, and indeed the world, was able to hear the full details of the case.

What were they thinking???

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

What were they thinking? (none / 0) (#109)
by towerssotall on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 02:01:11 AM EST

they were thinking the jury was living in South Australia of course.

"the fate of Charles the First, hath only made kings more subtle
- not more just."

- - Thomas Paine
[ Parent ]

Ah, yes. The printed press shows its limitations. (none / 0) (#124)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Mon Sep 15, 2003 at 05:09:23 AM EST

I'm fairly certain they didn't censor the Internet. Even if the government has tried this already...

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

who cares (3.28 / 7) (#81)
by turmeric on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:20:56 AM EST

6000 iraqis died under the US 'liberation'. why is that not a serial murder?

yes, yes (4.00 / 1) (#82)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 11:27:55 AM EST

but how does this change the fact that Sadaam Hussein gassed him own people?

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú


---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

But why read about Iraq and nothing else? [nt] (4.33 / 2) (#84)
by nebbish on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 12:06:39 PM EST


---------
Kicking someone in the head is like punching them in the foot - Bruce Lee
[ Parent ]

Why no serial? (3.66 / 3) (#88)
by DGolden on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 01:59:26 PM EST

Because some of the killings happened in parallel, of course.
Don't eat yellow snow
[ Parent ]
the long lost son is back [nt] (4.00 / 1) (#94)
by tetsuwan on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:33:32 PM EST


Njal's Saga: Just like Romeo & Juliet without the romance
[ Parent ]

troll food (4.00 / 1) (#95)
by anaesthetica on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 05:39:20 PM EST

6000 is a statistic, not a tragedy.

—I'm the little engine that didn't.
k5: our trolls go to eleven
[A]S FAR AS A PERSON'S ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, IT IS NOT TRUE THAT NOTHING BUT GOOD COMES FROM GOOD AND NOTHING BUT EVIL COMES FROM EVIL, BUT RATHER QUITE FREQUENTLY THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT REALIZE THIS IS IN FACT A MERE CHILD IN POLITICAL MATTERS. max weber, politics as a vocation


[ Parent ]
You are insane. (4.00 / 1) (#97)
by tkatchev on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:04:31 PM EST

Saddam gassed his own people.


   -- Signed, Lev Andropoff, cosmonaut.
[ Parent ]

ˇWe sold him the gas! (none / 0) (#103)
by Walabio on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 09:52:20 PM EST

The war is about oil -- not helping the Iraqis. We have not tried to help the Iraqis draft a new constitution of held a single election. We have no intention of ever letting the Iraqis breath free. The Iraqis feel like the Eastern Europeans in 1945:

We are liberated from Hitler -- by Stalin.

The Iraqis do have hope now:

Saddam Hussein had nowhither to go. The Iraqis knew they had him until death. The Americans can go back to their own country -- if they feel that Iraq is too much trouble. If the Iraqis kill enough American soldiers and employees of the Vice President, the US might withdraw. Afterwards, the Iraqi people might be able to form a democracy -- assuming an Iraqi warlord does not seize power.


--

ˇSign For Bodily Integrity, With Nobel Laureate Biologists And The Rest Of Us!

ˇImpeach Dubya!
[ Parent ]

Democracy. (5.00 / 1) (#111)
by tkatchev on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 05:51:58 AM EST

There is no such thing as "democracy" when you're talking about the MidEast.

"Democracy" is the ancient tribal custom of indo-european cultures, not a universal human right.

   -- Signed, Lev Andropoff, cosmonaut.
[ Parent ]

Re: Democracy. (none / 0) (#125)
by Theranthrope on Tue Sep 23, 2003 at 08:32:56 PM EST

There is no such thing as "democracy" when you're talking about the MidEast. "Democracy" is the ancient tribal custom of indo-european cultures, not a universal human right.

Correction: Democracy is a perceived ideal that has yet to be achieved anywhere, much less in the indo-european cultures.

(becides the fact that "true" democracy, like "true" communism is a bad idea for a way to design a governmental/economic system anyway, simply because humans are dumb)


"Turmeric applied as a suppository will increase intelligence." -- HidingMyName
[
Parent ]

attention whore (none / 0) (#115)
by auraslip on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 02:13:36 AM EST


___-___
[ Parent ]
That's a shame (4.50 / 2) (#87)
by Big Sexxy Joe on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 01:58:14 PM EST

From what I understand most people who hate homsexuals were sexually abused as children. It's interesting how it progressed from killing child molestors to people that looked like child molestors to killing innocent people for profit. I guess they decided that killing was fun after it got started.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
Democracy Now! - your daily, uncensored, corporate-free grassroots news hour
Sort of like... (none / 0) (#102)
by vyruss on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 09:05:32 PM EST

... Death Wish and its sequels. Bronson progressively killed for ever sillier reasons and with more glee with each sequel. :)

  • PRINT CHR$(147)

[ Parent ]
Where do you get your facts from? (none / 0) (#105)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 12:24:59 AM EST

Isn't it funny that the reverse logic is often used against homosexuality? i.e. most men become homosexuals because they were abused as children. This is probably wide of the mark - my cousin is gay and he wasn't sexually abused as a child!

But you're right about the killers. Once they started killing they couldn't stop. It's amazing it took so long for the police to catch them!

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú


---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

I've a relative who killed nine (5.00 / 1) (#99)
by Gord ca on Wed Sep 10, 2003 at 07:58:10 PM EST

I'm so proud of my family!

So yeah, I'm related to the sole perpitrator of the worst mass killing in Canada's history, the Shell Lake Massacre. The guy was psycho, not evil. It happened back in 1967, so I doubt it would make good story material.

If I'm attacking your idea, it's probably because I like it

Country Oz (none / 0) (#112)
by Cackmobile on Thu Sep 11, 2003 at 10:05:46 AM EST

THey are a strange bunch out there. Nothing to do but root sheep and kill people. Glad I am from the city.

Yeah, strange mob (none / 0) (#119)
by Ta bu shi da yu on Fri Sep 12, 2003 at 04:33:40 AM EST

I mean, who wouldn't want to live where you have a good chance of getting robbed, raped, beaten-up, murdered or where you generally kill your lungs from breathing in the terrible pollution?

C'mon mate, they aren't that strange.

Yours humbly,
Ta bù shì dà yú

---
AdTIה"the think tank that didn't".
ה
[ Parent ]

The Barrels of Snowtown | 126 comments (94 topical, 32 editorial, 0 hidden)
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