Kuro5hin.org: technology and culture, from the trenches
create account | help/FAQ | contact | links | search | IRC | site news
[ Everything | Diaries | Technology | Science | Culture | Politics | Media | News | Internet | Op-Ed | Fiction | Meta | MLP ]
We need your support: buy an ad | premium membership

Immigration and the "notslashdot" period

By codemonkey_uk in Op-Ed
Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:22:31 AM EST
Tags: Kuro5hin.org (all tags)

In the dim and distant past, most of the readership of Kuro5hin came from Slashdot. But times have changed, and Kuro5hin is a community in its own right, and no longer in the shadow of slashdot. Links get passed around the net, and people find out about Kuro5hin from all sorts of different places. And that's a good thing. Diversity enriches communities.

But it got me wondering. Where are the new users coming from? Are there some new, as yet unidentified major sources of new blood? To answer that question, and maybe encourage tolerance through understanding, I ask you the following questions: "Where Did You Come From?", "Why are you here?", and "When Did You Arrive?".

Do not take offence at my questions. It cannot be doubted that immigration affects culture, both for better and worse. Look at the cuisine of the heavily settled countries, such as America, and Great Britain, and what do you see? Italian food. Indian food. Chinese food. But yet, you only have to look to areas of settlement where much (voluntary) cultural segregation takes place, such as Bradford, England, to see that a lack of understanding of immigrant culture causes conflict.

Furthermore, we can see that conflict on a smaller scale now, here.

As I have already said, Kuro5hin used to be mostly a technology site, with a splash of culture, but as the immigration of disgruntled Slashdot readers increased, so did an undercurrent of anti Slashdot feeling, epitomised by the registration of notslashdot.org.

With time, the editorial comments displayed a feeling that stories that reminded people of slashdot were not welcome. This feeling that "Kuro5hin is NotSlashdot", grew, and somehow changed from a demonstration that Kuro5hin would be better than /. to one that Kuro5hin must be different to Slashdot. This, over time, has subsided, but it has left a scar on the site.

Gone is the even mix of technology and culture, to be replaced with an overwhelming majority of political stories. At first the articles covering current events only tended to get posted when significant events occurred - culture changing events - then over time, more and more crept in, alongside the argument that politics affects culture, and culture is politics - while at the same time the "notslashdot" argument was pushing out the technology stories.

This, I feel, was really a misunderstanding. You see, the "notslashdot" was irony. It was supposed to be mocking the people who didn't understand that the anti-Slashdot feeling was about quality, not topic. The problem with Slashdot was, at the time at least, that the commentary from the users and the editorial team was of low quality, at least for those that had a problem with Slashdot. People did want to discuss the topics, but without the inflammatory rhetoric. But with time, somehow, new users perhaps misunderstood, and subconsciously subverted the "Kuro5hin is not Slashdot" argument TO used it against any story that had been covered (or might be covered) by Slashdot.

With time things changed, as they do, as is inevitable. Let's take a glance at the future, by looking at where we are now. How (and for reference, when) did you find Kuro5hin? And more importantly, why are you here? And what direction would you like the site's content to go in?

Please vote in the poll, if it covers what you want to say...


Voxel dot net
o Managed Hosting
o VoxCAST Content Delivery
o Raw Infrastructure


Where do you come from?
o /. 75%
o Other mainstream tech site 2%
o Other mainstream news/media site 2%
o Link on blog / personal website 2%
o Personal recommendation 10%
o Other 6%

Votes: 571
Results | Other Polls

Related Links
o Slashdot
o Kuro5hin
o Slashdot [2]
o Bradford, England
o notslashdo t.org
o Also by codemonkey_uk

Display: Sort:
Immigration and the "notslashdot" period | 160 comments (124 topical, 36 editorial, 0 hidden)
-1, too boring-centric. (1.72 / 29) (#6)
by Noam Chompsky on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 08:11:44 PM EST

I'm here to cause minor irritation to some people, major upset to other people, and obtain a small amount of money from everyone else. I've been here from the very begining. My other nick rhymes with a lusty.

Faster, liberalists, kill kill kill!

Sorry, Kalani (3.00 / 3) (#17)
by J'raxis on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 08:33:30 PM EST

Trollsky deserves the zero-rating but that subject made me LOL literally.

— The Raxis

[ J’raxis·Com | Liberty in your lifetime ]
[ Parent ]

Me too, but ... (4.00 / 4) (#31)
by Kalani on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 09:00:19 PM EST

... I think that users like him who intentionally troll the readership of K5 ultimately diminish the quality of the content here. Since we're on the subject of slashdot, I think that it's comments like the above one by Mr. "Chompsky" that catalyze the discussion into an aimless collection of trivial "insights" and dull "humor." But if that's the kind of thing that people prefer, and they vote it up, then I won't complain about it; I'll just go somewhere else.

"Images containing sufficiently large skin-colored groups of possible limbs are reported as potentially containing naked people."
-- [ Parent ]
"users like he" might be more correct [n (none / 0) (#33)
by showboat on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 09:24:26 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I already conceded that [nt] (none / 0) (#45)
by Kalani on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 11:16:22 PM EST

"Images containing sufficiently large skin-colored groups of possible limbs are reported as potentially containing naked people."
-- [ Parent ]
But if you stay, (2.00 / 11) (#35)
by Noam Chompsky on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 09:33:00 PM EST

the tr*lls will eventually become superfluous.

Look, I am frankly tired of being lumped with the tr*lls. The invective and character assassination you employ against disembodied intellects that disagree with your politics is morally repugnant. It is so insidious that kurobot5wanans have been literally trained to discredit, out of hand, any honest comment that threatens to unravel the personality cult around Rusty Foster.

What motivates your unreasoning hatred?

Think about that question while wash the blood off your hands. Do not concern yourself for me, the stigmata will heal, eventually, and you must be tired after the exertion of your holy work.

Faster, liberalists, kill kill kill!
[ Parent ]

It's a fine line... (none / 0) (#41)
by cr8dle2grave on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 10:32:55 PM EST

...between gadfly and troll, and you regularly pop up on either side (often in the same post).

Unity of mankind means: No escape for anyone anywhere. - Milan Kundera

[ Parent ]
The Truth is not a popularity contest. (1.83 / 6) (#42)
by Noam Chompsky on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 10:35:38 PM EST


Faster, liberalists, kill kill kill!
[ Parent ]

Equal parts hemlock & ipecac. Shake and pour [ (none / 0) (#57)
by cr8dle2grave on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 04:11:30 AM EST

Unity of mankind means: No escape for anyone anywhere. - Milan Kundera

[ Parent ]
Pick-up lines, windowsills (1.50 / 16) (#10)
by medham on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 08:15:17 PM EST

"Ever fuck the windowsill?"

Try it, it's infallible.

In other news, I have long noted that the slashdot culture is different (better) than the K5 culture. Look at the rich ecology of -1 and compare it to the sadness of the hidden comments here.

I'm all for diversity, in all its form. I believe in my ancestral right to fish.

The real 'medham' has userid 6831.

"Stuff that matters" (4.44 / 9) (#23)
by chemista on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 08:45:11 PM EST

The real difference between Slashdot and Kuro5hin to me is that the first involves stuff that matters... to Hemos, CmdrTaco and Timothy. K5 is stuff that matters to a whole group of people. If informed people want a better source of technology articles (while retaining a Free Software/Open Source philosophy), you can go to The Register. K5 is where people go after they realize there is more to culture than anime (however good some anime is).

There may indeed be people on k5 who genuinely think all technology related news should stay on Slashdot, but if one peruses the history of stories here, there are still a lot that make section and FP. And depending on your point of view, there are almost as many politics stories on Slashdot -- it's just Everyone Else vs. Micro[s|$]oft, Everyone Else vs. [MP|RI]AA, *BSD vs. Linux vs. MacOS vs. ... and so on, and all but the last being significantly associated with governmental organizations as well.
Stop reminding people about the overvalued stock market! I'm depending on that overvalued stock market to retire some day! - porkchop_d_clown
Probably a common response: (3.71 / 7) (#24)
by antizeus on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 08:45:19 PM EST

I created my account right before K5 got heavily spammed and went down for a while. I think this was in the year 2000. I didn't really start paying attention until after the downtime was over. I came here because I thought Slashdot had gotten too big, and was hoping for a smaller forum with a higher average quality per post.
me too (2.00 / 1) (#53)
by slothman on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 02:14:47 AM EST

You are actually one of the first members I remember. I don't post much and didn't even before the "fall". I only came here to get more, read less biased, info.

[ Parent ]
k5 trends and statistics (4.50 / 12) (#34)
by martingale on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 09:31:39 PM EST

There have been several stories lately dealing with the type of story content appearing on k5, and this is another one. With the exception of this thread, these discussions all suffer from a lack of tangible statistics, which ensures that arguments reduce to clashes of personal degrees of belief.

While I'm all for clashes of various types, I think stories such as this one would be better served (and much more relevant) with some concrete numbers. For example, I went through the sections and found the following dates in august for accepted stories:

23 21 media
29 17 15 2 news
26 20 8 4 internet
27 27 23 20 12 8 3 meta
21 17 17 13 10 3 technology
28 22 14 11 11 6 6 2 1 columns
29 24 22 14 12 12 9 1 freedom politics
30 29 29 29 27 26 23 22 21 20 18 18 16 15 15 13 11 10 8 6 5 4 op-ed
30 29 27 26 21 20 20 19 19 18 17 14 13 11 6 6 6 5 4 2 1 1 1 culture
29 29 28 26 25 24 24 24 24 23 22 22 22 22 21 21 21 21 20 20 19 19 13 13 10 10 9 9 9 9 9 8 8 7 5 4 2 2 1 mlp

Without going into arguments of exactly what kind of stories each section actually contains, it seems clear that technology is underrepresented (so codemonkey_uk has a valid point), but more importantly, news is clearly misclassified, probably to the advantage of mlp.

I don't have the time or inclination to go back over the last year and compare story numbers, but this is something easily programmed in SQL, and would probably prove very enlightening to this discussion.

SQL would be nice, wouldn't it? (2.75 / 4) (#50)
by Pac on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:42:08 AM EST

As easily programmable as this kind of data extraction may be, no Query Language, Structured or otherwise, will save you when you don't have a working database system...

I don't understand. I have never been plagued by such horror stories. I have been using MySQL professionally for years, and it has never failed to deliver what was required. It really shouldn't be so difficult to keep a database up.

Evolution doesn't take prisoners

[ Parent ]
Since (2.11 / 9) (#38)
by medham on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 10:12:33 PM EST

The author of this piece feels fit to quote Bertrand Russell in his sig, I feel as if I should point out what Lord Russell's opinion of the slashdot/k5 culture debate: he wouldn't have one, because he'd be spending his time on number theory, epistemology, and radical dissent.

Thank you.

The real 'medham' has userid 6831.

I guess I'm a relative old-timer. (4.60 / 5) (#44)
by jabber on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 10:59:15 PM EST

Goodness, I've been bitching and whining here since before the first big outage, back when K5 was young. In fact, I suppose I'm partly to blame for that outage, the one that was remedied by the guys who host /. hosting K5 for a while. What happened was that I wrote a really scathing post on /. bitching about how that site was going to shit, and how much better K5 was, and the next day POOF, k5 went down and stayed down for what?? 2 weeks? I was crushed.

I remember the old logo, and the old layout. I remember when all the best slashdot trolls used to come here to regroup and strategize. I remember when there weren't "diaries" and when MLP was worth something. I was there at the dawn of the third age of man-kind. Anyway, having seen the crap Rusty's been through over the years, my hat is off to him.

As for the quality of the stories on k5 these days, all I can say is "I remember the good old days fondly."

[TINK5C] |"Is K5 my kapusta intellectual teddy bear?"| "Yes"

History (5.00 / 1) (#72)
by snakey on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:10:00 AM EST

Please forgive me if this has already been done, but it would be nice to see an article on the history of Kuro5hin. Perhaps some of you old-timers could put one together, with links to some classic articles?

[ Parent ]
There's a history of K5... (5.00 / 3) (#77)
by TheophileEscargot on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:33:00 AM EST

...on K4 here.
Support the nascent Mad Open Science movement... when we talk about "hundreds of eyeballs," we really mean it. Lagged2Death
[ Parent ]
You know what would be cool? (4.00 / 1) (#93)
by jabber on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:55:15 AM EST

User stats pages. When the user joined, their "First Post", number of posts.

Then again, maybe that's not such a good idea. My boss knows about K5 after all..

[TINK5C] |"Is K5 my kapusta intellectual teddy bear?"| "Yes"
[ Parent ]

K5 History (none / 0) (#146)
by snakey on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 04:33:33 AM EST

Ah, thanks for that link. :)

[ Parent ]
Slashdot (4.00 / 9) (#46)
by DM on Thu Aug 29, 2002 at 11:42:33 PM EST

I had heard about K5 on Slashdot for a little while.  At first, with it's pseudo-l33t name, I didn't figure it would be anything that would interest me.  But, I followed someone's sig or homepage link to K5 one day and found that it had the small-website feel that Slashdot did not, so I set up an account with a stupid name and that was that.  I think that was around Summer 2000 or so.

As far as K5 and the non-Slashdot attitude, I find it interesting that at first, K5's culture seemed to be people who defined what K5 was by what it strived to be.  Now, there are a lot of people who define K5 by what it is not.  In the end, I think it's more productive to have a goal defined by positive motivations than negative ones.
Silence all the songbirds, stilled by the killing frost...

I am getting old (4.50 / 6) (#47)
by Pac on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:18:50 AM EST

This article prompted me to dig my very first comment to a Kuro5hin article. It was written more than two years and 879 comments ago. It also made me realise how old I am getting.

Long before K5 existed I was already a high karma Slashdot user, the owner of a bellow 10K id.

Remembering Roy Batty, I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack trolls on fire off the shoulder of Signal11. I watched Mod-beams glitter in the dark near the Katz stories. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to die.

Evolution doesn't take prisoners

*sniff* (3.00 / 1) (#49)
by regeya on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:37:35 AM EST

/me has a below-2k Slashdot UID... . . . two, in fact, if you count the one that I've forgotten the password to (and no longer have a current email address that it's associated with.) I'm sure other users remember me when I ranted 'n raved under the name simmons75; somewhere, lost in Slashdot data-heaven, is another simmons75 that just happens to be (you guessed it) me. It's in a deeper Slashdot data-heaven than I feared; there's no info anymore on that user. Damn. I guess I'm just stuck with *shudder* Enahs.

[ yokelpunk | kuro5hin diary ]
[ Parent ]

And what a time it was (3.50 / 2) (#51)
by Pac on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:48:38 AM EST

As me, then, you saw Slashdot before Katz, Slashdot before moderation, Slashdot way before OSDN even existed. Slashdot when it was just the bastard brain-child of two very young geeks writing basically for people who cared about the same subjects they did (which happened to be mostly the news about the on-going Free/Open Software revolution and the whole Internet boom viewed from inside out).

Nice times. I believe I lost a near 3k id too. Imagine the value of such thing in eBay one or two years ago... :)

Evolution doesn't take prisoners

[ Parent ]
UID (5.00 / 1) (#62)
by rusty on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:45:27 AM EST

I remember when they introduced user accounts. "Why would I want an account?" I thought. "I never post anyway." It's always vaguely annoyed me that I could have had a like sub-500 UID. Ah well. :-)

Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]
I improved /. code...(kinda) (4.00 / 1) (#132)
by chewie on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 11:08:34 AM EST

...because my account name is "^chewie". What kind of sick sadist would include a carrot in their name?! Do you know how many special perl regexes I killed with that one? ;-) Me either, but I can only imagine the /. crew cursing about that f'n jerk named ^chewie.

[ Parent ]
the ^ character (none / 0) (#136)
by guyjin on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 03:31:09 PM EST

the ^ character is called a 'carat'. Not like the long orange vegetable that is a favorite of cartoon rabbits.

Odd thing:
-- 散弾銃でおうがいして ください
[ Parent ]

that's right (4.00 / 2) (#139)
by martingale on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 09:51:55 PM EST

and diamonds are measured in carets. Or is it the other way around?

[ Parent ]
Heh. (4.00 / 1) (#134)
by regeya on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 12:40:53 PM EST

It was funny reading Rob's comments about typing a story in class, and that'd be most of the "story." The nice thing is that most people back then "got" that Slashdot really wasn't a newssite. The wording of the banner should clue the most clueless among us into the fact that it's not, but some people *cough* Signal 11 *cough are obviously too thick-headed to get it.


Nah, a pre-3k UID wouldn't have mattered. Remember the FascDotKiledMyPr fiasco? When the UID went on sale, Rob started slowly nuking its karma into oblivion. He thought it was tremendously funny, apparently. That boy's gotta stop hittin' the bottle.

[ yokelpunk | kuro5hin diary ]
[ Parent ]

Stupid Slashdot bashing (none / 0) (#154)
by ajf on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 12:55:27 PM EST

Remember the FascDotKiledMyPr fiasco? When the UID went on sale, Rob started slowly nuking its karma into oblivion. He thought it was tremendously funny, apparently.

Well, why shouldn't he? The Slashdot moderation system is far from perfect, but karma is supposed to represent a level of trust of a registered user. So I reckon they've got damn good reason to wipe out any karma associated with an account that has been traded to another person. And paying money for a Slashdot account *is* funny.

"I have no idea if it is true or not, but given what you read on the Web, it seems to be a valid concern." -jjayson
[ Parent ]

I remember /. when... (2.00 / 1) (#143)
by static on Sun Sep 01, 2002 at 11:21:40 PM EST

... Rob was hand-tuning the table code to accomodate Netscape 1.2 and Opera 2.x! :-)

I'm UID 1229 on SlashDot and 301 here on K5.


[ Parent ]

Slashdot UID 43288 (none / 0) (#89)
by wiredog on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:21:43 AM EST

Which is before the andover.net buyout. Around 4 years ago. Back when stories like Hemos's house burning down were posted there.

Can't sleep. The clowns will get me.
[ Parent ]
I can never resist... (none / 0) (#98)
by uXses on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:35:39 AM EST

mentioning my account number on slashdot, which is 335 or something. :-)


[ Parent ]

Ah slashdot UID compare-fest... (none / 0) (#107)
by joeyo on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 11:19:40 AM EST

...Unzips trowsers to reveal UID...

I'm slashdot user #173.  While I don't go back as far as the Chips'n'Dips days, I do remember quite fondly the days before user accounts.  I seem to recall that the slashdot effect existed, in some embryonic state, even then.  It'd be interesting to see when exactly the term was coined.

Sure, Dubya has the brainpower of a muppet, but this fuss over terms is rediculous. -- Parent ]

progress (2.33 / 3) (#48)
by ebatsky on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:35:59 AM EST

Something Awful -> Fark -> Slashdot -> kuro5hin.

Still read all of them though.

Another relatively longtime lurker.. (2.00 / 3) (#52)
by kb5 on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 01:24:44 AM EST

As almost everybody else, Slashdot led me here. Initially the site looked forbidding to people like me, with its "Registered users only can post/rate" policy. The discussions always looked a bit too orderly, placid and not much fun.

However the site has been constantly changing. I'd like to believe the newcomers have added that bit of spice, with an accent on humor[trolling?]. But the stories on politics and other oft repeated topics(gun control etc..) are really starting to suck more and more.

How I came here (3.00 / 3) (#54)
by epepke on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 02:19:06 AM EST

I was sick of sites like TechRepublic with all the idiots. I posted something on Joel's site trying to find intelligent people. Kuro5hin was recommended to me.

The truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head.--Terry Pratchett

I came from slashdot (4.66 / 6) (#55)
by Cloaked User on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 03:38:54 AM EST

A friend of mine introduced me to k5 shortly before it got spammed to death a couple of years ago. I vaguely lurked for a day or two, then down it went.

A while later I noticed it was back up again, so I lurked some more, then created an account as Tim C. Time passed, then the "see who's logged on now" box appeared on the front page, and I thought it would be amusing to register an account as "Cloaked User". (You could decline to be listed in the box, in which case you would be one of the XX "Cloaked Users" at the bottom. It amused me to think that there'd be a Cloaked User in the list, too. Tee hee.)

For ages I read the two sites together, but recently, I've come to realise that I don't really like slashdot very much. The quality of discussion just isn't up to very much. It seems to always centre around either the same tired old rhetoric ("Linux rules! M$ sucks!" "Windows rules, Linux is crap!", etc, ad nauseum), or generally be completely clueless (eg the recent thread on MySQL being a serious threat to the big database vendors, any science-based discussion, etc). Nowadays, I generally just skim the front page, occasionally reading a discussion, but almost always at at least +4.

As for the direction I'd like k5 to take, I'm not sure if I'm really qualified to speak, as I've never submitted an article (let alone had one posted). Still, I'd like to see less emphasis on political stories and more techy stuff. After last year's attack on the WTC, I very nearly had a k5 holiday for a while; I'm not looking forward to this September 11th (and not just because I'll be turning 28 :-) ).


"What the fuck do you mean 'Are you inspired to come to work'? Of course I'm not 'inspired'. It's a job for God's sake! The money's enough and the work's not so crap that I leave."

science (3.66 / 3) (#73)
by danny on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:13:18 AM EST

any science-based discussion

Heh, after seeing the discussion following my latest review on Slashdot (of Patterns and Processes of Vertebrate Evolution), I don't think I'll be posting any more reviews of evolution books there... 95%+ of the comments were about creationism - it could have been talk.origins. I'm not sure why, but I have a feeling Kuro5hin would handle that better.

I learnt about Kuro5hin from Slashdot, but I still participate in both - I'd read (and participate in) a much larger fraction of stories here, but perhaps the same number absolutely (Slashdot has a lot more stories).

[900 book reviews and other stuff]
[ Parent ]

/. refugees (4.00 / 5) (#74)
by Trollificus on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:17:20 AM EST

I came here around the time you did. It was a shame what happened, but as with all things, it eventually passed.
I ended up lurking for a long time before I caved in and signed up for an account. I have no idea why I went with this name. Maybe for the irony - Reformed asshole with an asshole name. Because of this name, people can't tell if I'm being genuine, or trawling for suckers. ;p~

I think what drove me away from Slashdot more recently though were the idiotic, uninformed and even slanderous editorial comments tacked onto the end of every story.
I get enough of that shit from mainstream media. I don't need to hear it from the so-called "underdogs" too. The moment I see a dollar sign in Microsoft, I lose whatever respect I had left for whomever is posting it.

All in all, I came here looking for a genuine community, and I found one. I've met a lot of great people on this site, and it really is a shame to see assholes(See: Queue crapflooders) trying to ruin it for the majority.
Yeah, I know. Considering my posting history on Slashdot, I'm one to talk. Hey, I was an asshole, I'll admit that. But never once was I a crapflooder. :p

"The separation of church and state is a fiction. The nation is the kingdom of God, period."
--Bishop Harold Calvin Ray of West Palm Beach, FL
[ Parent ]

Dear God (3.00 / 1) (#114)
by davidduncanscott on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 02:26:42 PM EST

Is September 11 your birthday? Man, that must really suck. I mean, I know that millions of people probably share that day, but still...

I hope you don't live in NYC, anyway. Whole town's mourning, and there you are, singing, "Happy Birthday to Me" into your beer.

Unless you're a fireman. Then you probably couldn't pay for the beer even if you wanted to.

[ Parent ]

Take a look at memigo (none / 0) (#148)
by costas on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 01:56:52 PM EST

Sorry to plug my own site in a reply, but the reasons you list against /. and, perhaps, against K5 is why I built <a href="http://memigo.com/">memigo</a>.  I basically noticed that I would only browse /. and if a story was interesting and enough major sites were picking it up, I'd follow the link.  If not, I'd ignore it and move along to K5 or <a href="http://metafilter.com/">MetaFilter</a>.  If a 'minor' story made it over here or at MeFi, I'd follow it, but only then.

So, I realized, I was basically looking for trust metrics in my browsing.  Since I am a dataminer by trade and I travel about 70-80% of the time, it sounded like a cool project to built on my downtime: an automated weblog that would rank stories based on trust metrics: users rate the stories, and indirectly rate the sites that the stories originated from or were linked to from.  

Memigo works exactly like that and has a completely open submission queue --no vote, no delay.  The idea is that memigo (the code, there are no human editors) has to parse the link, to QA it, so that it can reject crapfloods and vanity plugs (like the one I am just making :-).  Memigo works pretty well --the robot scoops /. and K5 regularly, but it is a news-filter.  Don't expect cool little bizarre websites or detailed diatribes there (that's what MeFi and K5 do best).  Give it a shot; the more users we get, the more ratings, the faster quality links bubble up in the rankings...

memigo is a news weblog run by a robot. It ranks and recommends stories.
[ Parent ]

Ah, the trolls. (3.83 / 6) (#56)
by mold on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 04:03:02 AM EST

Well, I don't have an ancient ID, here or on Slashdot, but I've been around long enough to know why I prefer k5: The trolls. Now, this may seem strange. They infuriate me as much as they do everyone else, but the trolls are the proof that kuro5hin is worth something.

If you compare the trolls on k5, to the trolls on Slashdot, notice how researched the k5 trolls seem. Slashdot trolls focus on idiotic posts, that never appear to have any relevance to the article, and many times will have a "goatse.cx" type of link. A good k5 troll, however, will be focused on the story, knows the preferences of the readers, and will post a comment that will be decently researched, and will focus on a part of the subject that is "just" a little hazy, and tear it to shreads*. The care shown in the making of these comments shows that, even in their blackened little hearts, the trolls care about k5.

* You'll have to excuse my description of a troll comment. I'm terrible at explaining myself at this part. I'm not saying that all comments that go against the general opinions of the k5 readers are trolls. Contrary, some of the best, and most enlightening threads have come from these comments.

Beware of peanuts! There's a 0.00001% peanut fatality rate in the USA alone! You could be next!

Trolls (none / 0) (#120)
by spiralx on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:25:07 PM EST

You're talking about all the crapflooders on /. with their never-ending stream of hot grits. They're one of the main things that killed off trolling on /.

You're doomed, I'm doomed, we're all doomed for ice cream. - Bob Aboey
[ Parent ]

Crapflooders and Trolls (4.00 / 1) (#123)
by mold on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:12:09 PM EST

Unfortunately (or lazily, depending on your perspective) many crapflooders fit the definition of  trolls. Those insistant "FP!" posts are not, and qualify as crapfloods; however, most are posted in order to irritate, and do attempt to drag in comments.

The fact that k5 has very few crapfloods, and almost exclusively high-quality trolls shows that the trolls know what they're doing. Of course, the zero rating is a strong reason as to why k5 isn't filled with crapfloods: It just isn't worth the time it would take to write a crapflood, since it would almost instantly be hidden compeletely from view.

The rating system has a strong influence on the quality of the trolls, of course. On Slashdot, a troll starts at about 2, along with most normal comments, that will stay there. In order to hide it, several moderators (many of whom really won't care) must vote it down, and until that happens, everyone sees it. On k5, everyone can rate comments, and so it will either be rated down very quickly, and if it isn't even decent quality, will be rated down to zero very quickly.

Beware of peanuts! There's a 0.00001% peanut fatality rate in the USA alone! You could be next!
[ Parent ]

purposes (4.50 / 2) (#58)
by Quila on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 04:12:34 AM EST

Go to Slashdot to see the basic stories (a larger version of K5's MLP), but come here for discussion. I don't post much on Slashdot anymore, it's just not really worth it.

The difference (4.00 / 3) (#59)
by Master Of Ninja on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:08:59 AM EST

Slashdot is good if you an MLP type person. The news in there is what you want if you're into the "technology... from the trenches" part of k5, as I assume most Slashdot exiles(?) are.

Myself, I first found k5 from slashdot, and I have to say they both have their strengths (and weaknesses). Put it this way Slashdot is not very good for discussion - discussions tend to be either low number of comments (with relatively high levels of noise), or a high number of posts (which cannot be read through without browsing at +3/4/5).

On the other hand, the high rated comments can be good, and you do get insight from famous tech people e.g. John Carmack (him of id fame) posted the other day. I'm pretty sure most technologists have a slashdot account or keep a tab on what's going on there. Plus while most of the trolls are just boring, some are just classic quality. Everyone on k5 should go over to experience the magic of an original and creative troll.

K5 is better for discussions although it now seems to lack the techie aspects of what Slashdot has. Some of the techie topics that come around are good in that you can actually have an informed discussion of the practicalities of technology (e.g. Public Buses in the 21st Century) without falling in to a mass of "imagine a beowolf cluster..." or "hot grits" or whatever trollers like (not that is applies to buses, but some on slashdot would find a way to reference it). I have noticed that the technology aspects seems to be deteriorating from k5 which I think is a shame.

Also taking up some k5er's hang-ups about slashdot, people here seem to have something against Adequacy in particular. It's not that I read adequacy, but do k5er's feel that we have to have a nemesis in the form of other news sites that we loath?

In summary:
    "Where Did You Come From?" - Slashdot refugee (although I take regular trips back)
    "Why are you here?" - to actually have a discussion (from time to time)
    "When Did You Arrive?" - lurked for some time - made an account, forgot the username, made this account
    "And what direction would you like the site's content to go in?" - more slashdot like techie stories without the trolling and noise

Mainstream news site. (3.00 / 2) (#61)
by Graham Thomas on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:42:06 AM EST

A gentleman who frequented the forums on another well known media site recommended Kuro5hin to me a while ago.

Why I came here (4.50 / 2) (#64)
by Mr Spot on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:00:32 AM EST

I came here some time in January this year. I was getting pretty sick of the way things were going over at /., especially with the discussions and how they were degenerating into the crap that they were when I left. I didn't particularly like being associated with those sorts of people, so I started looking for other places to get news and read what others think about it.

I had seen K5 mentioned on there some time in the past, and when I came across a link to it, I followed it to see what it was like. The people here seemed to be having intelligent conversations, so I decided to give it a try. After reading it for one day, I read a story on /. and the comments were nothing but idiotic masturbation references by a bunch of undersexed nerds. I really didn't like the thought of being among those people. So I simply didn't go back, and I can't say that I miss it that much.

I really like K5, and although I spend most of my time lurking (this would be my first real post), the discussions are one of the things that I like. I do agree that the political stories get old after a while, and would prefer more tech articles. But I would say that other than that, the direction that K5 is heading in is, in my opinion, a good one.

idiotic masturbation references (3.00 / 1) (#86)
by wiredog on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:06:37 AM EST

Ahem. Kuro5hin Masturbation

Can't sleep. The clowns will get me.
[ Parent ]
Yeah, but not in tech articles (none / 0) (#151)
by Mr Spot on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 02:40:57 AM EST

At least here they are mainly in the diary section, instead of hijacking tech stories.

[ Parent ]
I miss the old k5 stories (4.77 / 9) (#67)
by rdskutter on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:24:18 AM EST

I remeber the stories about how to prepare coffee properly - and a HOWTO of chewing tobbaco.

The only stories that have been in the queue over the past 3 weeks have been either political or complaining about k5.

Write about what interests you. I don't care what it is - just write about it.

One thing has to change. If a story does not interest you then vote [0 - Abstain]. Perfectly good stories get lost becuase the first 20 or so people to see them aren't interested. The other solution to this problem is for Rusty to drop the -20 threshold to something like -50. That gives stories that have been voted down a chance of recovering.

If you're a jock, inflict some pain / If you're a nerd then use your brain - DAPHNE AND CELESTE

From slashdot, but (4.00 / 1) (#68)
by johnny on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:32:29 AM EST

I hadn't made a comment on slashdot in years because the level of discussion was so low and the mechanics of using the site were so complicated and the mojo so byzantine. I used, and still use, /. as a news (MLP) source.

After lurking here for a while I got an account about 20 months ago. On k5 I've posted 2 stories, I've made over 100 diary entries and several hundreds of comments.

I'm expecting a review of my new book to appear on slashdot soon. When (if) it does I'll make a diary entry comparing number of visits to my site & number of book sales directly attributable to slashdot/k5 reviews. Last time (spring/summer 2000) this happened the /. review generated about 30 times as much response as the k5 review.

yr frn,
Get your free download of prizewinning novels Acts of the Apostles and Cheap Complex Devices.

Bad trend (4.20 / 5) (#69)
by 8ctavIan on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:44:31 AM EST

When people try to define their identity by by saying they are not something, they quickly find that they are not period. Nobody wants to hear somebody say: "I am great because I am not that other bad thing". This K5 is not Slashdot thing is getting to be a pain in the rump roast.

Injustice is relatively easy to bear; what stings is justice. -- H.L. Mencken

the 'not slashdot' meme (4.00 / 1) (#156)
by aphrael on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 08:19:28 PM EST

was *very* strong about a year and a half ago; after the DDOS attack there was a great wave of people coming to try out k5 and failing to immediately notice the difference in the two communities; people who didn't want k5 to turn into a slashdot clone used the refrain mercilessly, and regularly, for months.

It's died down a great deal; k5 is a much stronger and vibrant community than it was then, and much longer, and has a much greater sense of what is *is* ... and much less fear of turning into a slashdot clone.

[ Parent ]

/. + register for headlines (3.00 / 1) (#70)
by LQ on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:45:52 AM EST

These days, I check /. and the register for headlines only. Frequently I don't drill past the front page. I come to k5 for discussion.

How come I be here (5.00 / 1) (#71)
by rickydazla on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:02:29 AM EST

... I was a fairly regular reader of Maddox' site. Trollaxor was one of the links on his list and I was intrigued by how much time these people spent doing what they do (which to be honest with you, I still haven't quite fathomed). I knew and occasionally read /. but never posted. The sheer volume of inane banter really put me off. K5 I'd never heard of but it had interesting articles which I kept going back to. And I've kept coming back. I don't post very often, but have started voting on articles and comments and I dare say I will post when I have something worth saying. Thanks, you've been great.

I'm a million different people
My path to k5 (none / 0) (#75)
by boxed on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:19:56 AM EST

It all started at home. My brother, me, my father and my mother are very argumentative people. We discuss things in heated arguments very often. I carried this forward into school, and I became somewhat of a mini-celebrity because of my radical opinions and the very agressive way I told them. I started with computer-based discussions on FidoNet, lots of years ago. This was great fun, and the discussions were of high quality largely due to the fact that FidoNet was dying so there weren't many people there. Eventually school came in the way and I lost touch with FidoNet.

Then I came to slashdot. I quickly learned that discussion on slashdot is totally impossible and worthless so I just stopped and settled for reading the news. I first heard of k5 when slashdot ran news of the DDoS attack, and I headed over as soon as it came up again.

Becoming a celebrity by arguing aggressively? (3.00 / 1) (#78)
by Graham Thomas on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:46:42 AM EST

Rather than relying on aggression to validate or defend your arguments, put logical, rational reasoning into them. Aggressive arguing will only get you ridiculed in higher circles of civilized debate.

[ Parent ]
I think you misunderstood (3.00 / 1) (#79)
by boxed on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:59:26 AM EST

When I said "agressive argumenting" I didn't mean in an immature way, I just meant that I don't try to soften the blows of my arguments to spare the feelings of the other party. When proving my point I am ruthless, but I will yield if the other side beats me of course. If you were to search through my comments here on k5 these things will become obvious.

[ Parent ]
Ah, indeed (3.00 / 1) (#81)
by Graham Thomas on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 08:17:46 AM EST

I just meant that I don't try to soften the blows of my arguments to spare the feelings of the other party.

In truth, this is the only way to conduct debates honourably. Good on you.

[ Parent ]
good on me often but... (3.00 / 1) (#82)
by boxed on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 08:30:39 AM EST

...it has backfired. Specifically my ex-gf could never fully see that her arguments were under attack, not her person. She has begun to cry at least once from a comment I said on pure reflex. Women :P

[ Parent ]
Slashdot boycott! (4.00 / 1) (#76)
by FredBloggs on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:26:52 AM EST

Remember that? A few people posted pissy tantrums about SlashDot for a short while here. I can't say I've noticed any change there, however.

Anyway, isn't the point of K5 that you can post what you like, whereas SlashDot is more tightly controlled/defined, if only as a function of what its owners want to see on its front page.

And - despite K5s `Culture and Technology` tag -this site isn't really about either; its about anything you like. (Probably because the word `culture` means anything you want it to mean.)

So really, the two sites have little in common, other than you can leave comments underneath other peoples stories in both. Big deal.

K5 vs. Slashdot (none / 0) (#100)
by Skinny Rav on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:37:56 AM EST

As many other people here I also came from Slashdot and I read now both.

I think you're wrong saying the two sites have little in common. They have in common one very important thing: quite a lot of people read both.

As some people already mentioned: if you want to stay in touch with what's going on in technology, OSS/FS, how are things with DRM or Microsoft - /. is for you, but if you want better stories and decent discussion - here's where K5 comes.

I almost always start my surfing from a short glance at /., check if there is anything interesting, open few links, check boxes - and then I proceed to k5 for slower, deepened reading, moderating or commenting.


[ Parent ]

We agree! (none / 0) (#101)
by FredBloggs on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:47:29 AM EST

Except for the thing about what they have in common. The fact that both have a lot of readers doesnt really mean both sites are similar, just that they are both popular.

[ Parent ]
Are we Missing Tech or Missing Slashdot? (4.25 / 4) (#80)
by bodrius on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 08:09:42 AM EST

Is this a criticism to the lack of "tech stories" in Kuro5hin (a real problem), or the dumping of "Slashdot-like stories" recently (which I don't consider a problem)?

Some stories are indeed dumped, criticized, etc. for being "more appropiate for That Other Site(TM)", but the tone on which this is usually argued tells me its not a matter of content but precisely of quality.

I mean, look at the Slashdot frontpage these days: most of the stories are worthless in terms of content AND of discussion. These are the kind of stories that would be rejected because their quality is lacking, not because they are tech-related or have been posted in Slashdot. Stories like:

- Kids build/overclock/mod hardware for cheap. Check pictures.
- New release of Editor's Favorite Anime. Much Happiness. Pictures.
- New release of Editor's Favorite Videogame. Much Merriment. Pictures.
- Open Source Project Releases version 23.8. Much merriment and downloads.
- Closed Source Project Releases version 23.8. Why is it not Open Source?
- My Neighbor installed Linux and has an opinion on the GPL. See interview.
- OSI speaker said something. Free Software complains about FSF/OSI confusion. Much flaming ensues.
- Some Open Source developers said things in a discussion that could, if translated from  Japanese by some videogame company and read by an schizoid Cold War analyst living in a fantasy Cuban-Missile Crisis, be interpreted as a "serious disagreement". Whose license is morally corrupt and a danger to Free Software, Freedom and the Geek Community?

Now, some of these could make an average MLP. But if they have to compete with the rest of the MLPs they'll have to show better editorial content than Slashdot stories (and yes, MLPs should have editorial quality, among other things they should be clear and on-topic).

In any case, at Slashdot's current standard of quality the fact that a copy-and-pasted-from-Slashdot story is likely to be dumped should be seen as a Good Thing(TM).

As disappointed as I am with the discussion level of Slashdot, I don't think the lack of interesting tech stories is due to the Editors' interest on inane matters. Rather, there's not much of interest going on, tech-wise, to discuss.

Slashdot will never lack story submissions as long as it has the current demographic... their solution to the lack of interesting stories is to publish the best of the mediocre, because they are a fast-paced tech-oriented site that depends on the freshness of the MLPs to keep their demographic.

Kuro5hin doesn't really need to fill the gap because its core value is not the freshness of the stories, but the depth of their content and related discussions. As a matter of fact, recently someone posted a Meta story about slowing down the pace of the front page.

Ok, now lets get it over with:

"Where Did You Come From?":
Online-wise, I'm a Slashdot refugee.

"Why are you here?":

Although I was never really active in Slashdot per se, I did find it an interesting news source (for the kind of thing not usually covered in news) and posted comments every once in a while. I did find some things annoying, though, such as the boring trolls, the political pandering, and the superficiality of most discussions.  

After losing tolerance for the overuse of the words 'geek' and 'community' in Slashdot, at about the same time I was giving up on the site as a public forum, I saw a couple of references to Kuro5hin suggesting it might be a better place.

To my surprise, I found it was indeed a much better place for technological (and non-tech) discussions. The moderation system seems to have a direct effect on the quality of the content... and there was content, actual content in the first place!

Perhaps more remarkable, after a few weeks reading Kuro5hin I lost almost all my revulsion for the use of the words "online community" in a non-sarcastic tone.

"When Did You Arrive?":

I think early this year, but it is possible I "arrived" in December 2001. I visited the page once or twice before, but that's when I started to actually pay attention and got a user account.

It might be worth to mention as a social commentary that I got a user account almost immediately after my visits to Kuro5hin became habitual. Yet I visited Slashdot for about a year before I felt I wanted a user account and the ability to post comments.

Freedom is the freedom to say 2+2=4, everything else follows...

Slahdot bites.. (5.00 / 1) (#141)
by lenrose on Sun Sep 01, 2002 at 11:10:36 AM EST

If you post anything vaguely resembling real news that wasn't pasted from wired or cnet, and that has real significance, it never gets posted no matter how well it's written.

As an example (and forgive the linking, please ..) I posted a story about this to slashdot: iName/Mail.com security holes opens door to millions of e-mail accounts thinking it would be critical news, and I posted it about 5 minutes after the author sent it in to the list.. it got squashed. Before that, I posted a story about this: A revolution in search technology and design which seemed to be very apropos for that site.. which also was rejected. It almost seems like original content is least preferable to these people.

After that, I gave up because that site is more interested in the money they make from banners, and assuaging the egos of their editors. I've been hanging around this site for about 6 months, but never registered, since I normally don't have time for alot of online discussion, and diatribe. When I recently installed Scoop on one of my sites, I decided I had to use K5 as a reference site for what my site should become, and somehow I've gotten interested in also writing here. I don't know how successful I'll be, but I'll try to add more technical content to K5.. if people like my writing style, that is. to me, K5 has a great potential in distributing security news, which between unix and security, I hardly ever pay attention to anything else, so for K5 to be useful to me, it will have to serve that need.. Hopefully the technical discussions will become just as energetic as the socio-political ones :)

Thanks for listening. Len
real hackers write code.
[ Parent ]

I've been lurking... (none / 0) (#83)
by daragh on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 08:39:21 AM EST

...for about 8 months now, and the reason I continue to do so is the variety of generally well thought out and intelligent viewpoints on a large number of different issues. I stumbled accross the site by accident, I think a link from /. or the reg. I don't know what's caused the rise in the current affairs/politics stories, it could well be that that's the persuasion of new users, but I imagine the fact that global politics is at a particularly dangerous juncture at the moment has helped inspire people to speak out... I know that I keep on meaning to when I clarify my thoughts on certain issues. Certainly I think the roots of any community are important and should help to define it, but evolution and change of focus is inevitable without firm directives being imposed. And I figure that's not what this site is about...

No work.

came from? (none / 0) (#84)
by dreancha on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 08:47:07 AM EST

came from? well, i suppose mostly TOS, but i heard about k5 from SegFault first, so does that count for anything? g


Plastic (4.00 / 1) (#85)
by Genady on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:03:44 AM EST

I'm fed up with Slashdot's commenter base. Slashdot comments stopped being about semi-intelligent discussion a long time ago and now more closely resemble Crossfire for Geeks than a place where you can banter a subject back and forth until it's throughly picked appart.

Being fed up with Slashdot I started looking around for other sites with a similar community engine, but with more intelligent conversation. I landed at plastic.com. Plastic is, like Kuro5hin is now, more politically based, with few tech articles. The thing that really drew me to Plastic was the way that articles were contributed and posted. Having the high karma (mojo whatever you want to call it) site members comment and vote on articles is where the whole concept of a community blog needs to go in my opinion.

Plastic sated my needs for a good long while (Internet time mind you) But the community was cliqish and liberal and generally depressing. Ultimately when I got a message from a good on-line friend that they wouldn't be frequenting Plastic anymore that was all I needed to hear. I didn't want to know why he'd left, that someone had done something so agredious that he felt that he needed to zero out his account and leave was enough for me.

I started lurking around Kuro5hin shortly there after, looking for more intelligent discussions to add to. For me personally the tech fix happens on the ARSTechnica boards. That way I can commisurate with like-minded curmudgeons without the chaff of Linux geeks getting in my Apple Butter ;)

Kuro5hin however sates my need for political discussion. I do still miss things from Plastic though, like the built in spell checker.

In Summary: I came from Plastic for the political discussion about a month ago.

[gratuitous switch line here] My name's Genady and I'm a liberterian.

Turtles all the way down.
Karma/Mojo/whatever (3.00 / 6) (#90)
by Ruidh on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:37:48 AM EST

Why don't we all be honest and call it what it really is.

Penis size.
"Laissez-faire is a French term commonly interpreted by Conservatives to mean 'lazy fairy,' which is the belief that if governments are lazy enough, the Good Fairy will come down from heaven and do all their work for them."
[ Parent ]

The Big Difference... (3.00 / 1) (#131)
by pwhysall on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 10:00:31 AM EST

...is that one can easily look down and determine one's penis size.

Mojo is a hidden value - you don't know what it is.

All you can know is whether you're trusted or not.
K5 Editors
I'm going to wager that the story keeps getting dumped because it is a steaming pile of badly formatted fool-meme.
[ Parent ]

The K5Cabal Knows All, Sees All, Doesn't Care (3.00 / 1) (#87)
by wiredog on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:10:23 AM EST

Nov 1 2000, my first comment, attached to this story. The first story of mine that made it through the queue, on 1 Jan 2001.

I think I came here after seeing Rusty's "slashdot dying, news at 11" (or something like that) sig...

Can't sleep. The clowns will get me.

Another /. refugee (4.00 / 1) (#88)
by Canthros on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:18:51 AM EST

I first started reading just after K5 got mentioned on /., because I was sick of the garbage comments, editorial bias, pretension of professionality (without actual professionality), et al that was CmdrTaco and company. I posted my first comment in October of 2000, apparently, so I've been registered at least that long.

It's now obvious you are either A) Gay or B) Female, or possibly both.
hmmm.. (3.00 / 1) (#96)
by Danse on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:29:31 AM EST

How the heck do you find out when you posted your first comment? I migrated from /. too. Well, maybe that's not the right word. I still visit /. regularly, although I don't post there as often as I used to. I just like the way K5 gives the readers more control over the site.

An honest debate between Bush and Kerry
[ Parent ]
Finding your 'first' comment (none / 0) (#108)
by Canthros on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 11:24:58 AM EST

Click on the link that reads 'Your Comments'.

Click on the 'Next Page >>>' button until there are no more pages and the button disappears. Last comment on the page should be the first one posted with the logged-in account. If you were around when logins weren't required and have some anonymous posts, I can help you no further.

And if I sound like a pedantic asshole... well, it's just because I'm at work, and the job is wearing on me a tad.

It's now obvious you are either A) Gay or B) Female, or possibly both.
[ Parent ]

that's it??? (none / 0) (#125)
by Danse on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 07:45:25 PM EST

Oh hell... that'll take forever... i'm not sure how many posts i've made, but it's well into the hundreds I think... maybe rusty could add a button to skip to first comment :)

An honest debate between Bush and Kerry
[ Parent ]
Slightly better method (none / 0) (#129)
by TheophileEscargot on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 07:15:06 AM EST

Do that a couple of times, then look at the URL. There's a field there saying something like offset=90, if you've gone 90 comments into the past. To go 1000 comments into the past, for instance, change it to 1000. Mess around until you find your first comment.
Support the nascent Mad Open Science movement... when we talk about "hundreds of eyeballs," we really mean it. Lagged2Death
[ Parent ]
thanks (none / 0) (#135)
by Danse on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 01:47:50 PM EST

That worked. My first comment was on 6/30/00. I've posted 890 comments total.

An honest debate between Bush and Kerry
[ Parent ]
"The first Slashdot troll post investigation (none / 0) (#122)
by ffalcon on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:44:40 PM EST

I migrated after The first Slashdot troll post investigation, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

[ Parent ]
Non-refugee from /. (5.00 / 1) (#91)
by danaris on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:38:05 AM EST

Let me first say that I tend to ramble a bit, so please forgive me.
I am from Slashdot, but I don't consider myself a refugee; my default page is /., and I find it generally quite interesting. I admit that I have to wade through some stories that aren't quite as important or interesting to me, but I know that many people will find each of the stories to their taste. I discovered K5 through Slashdot at one remove: when I went to Macslash, a sister site that deals, sensibly enough, with Macs, one of the Slashboxes was headlines from here. Eventually, I started coming occasionally, when it looked like there was something worth reading. I've found that rather than just giving a link to an article with a little bit of summary/commentary, the stories here almost always have more text than just the brief blurb on the front page. However, I feel that both ways have their merits. I am here because many of the stories are interesting, and I like more than just the stuff on Slashdot. As to when I came, well, I've been reading stories here and there for a few months, but I just now created my user account.
It seems that the problem most people here have with Slashdot is their penchant for posting "tech toy" stories (which a lot of people actually are interested in; it's not an inherently bad thing), and the trolls. Now, I'll be the first to admit there are plenty of trolls, but I don't see how it has to rule your opinion of the site. It's hardly Slashdot's fault that there are stupid people who post there. But, partly in reply to bodrius below, what's wrong with posting lots of Open/Free Software news? Or news about Microsoft? (I will say here, and on K5 this will probably get me a lot of grief, that one of my main reasons for reading /. is that I'm pretty militantly anti-Microsoft) Just because you're not a big Open Source fan doesn't mean that posting stories about OSS is worthless. For one thing, it is the first place that many people will hear about important updates to pieces of software they run. And much of the dialogue is far more cogent than you give it credit for.
Deriding it simply because it is essentially a geek site is pointless--if you're not a geek, you obviously won't like it, just as you wouldn't be very interested in a site that posted mainly news about interior decorating if you weren't in that field.

Dan Aris

We are Rangers. We walk in the dark places others fear to enter. We stand on the bridge and no one may pass. We live for the One. We die for the One!
Thank god (4.66 / 3) (#92)
by Silent Chris on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 09:52:27 AM EST

I thought I was the only one who noticed the political upheavel here.  An occasional story to whet the pallete (and foster interesting debates) is one thing.  Constant debating, where most opposing viewpoints are visibly ignored, is another.

That's why I very rarely write anything other than technology story (and most of these have to do with video games, my favorite geek hobby).  If I read one more story about how the Palestinians are right (sigh).

Debate (none / 0) (#140)
by wiml on Sun Sep 01, 2002 at 03:17:31 AM EST

If you reach the point where "most opposing views are visibly ignored" then it's no longer debate. That's the problem with a lot of political traffic, though: people become convinced that their opponents will never really change their views, and no longer try to convince them with reasoned argument, evidence, and discussion (which requires listening to and understanding your opponent). Instead, many people seem to feel that the important thing is to talk louder and longer than the other guy, perhaps in hopes of winning over an invisible audience of lurkers.

[ Parent ]
Tech Stories: A solution (4.62 / 8) (#94)
by gauntlet on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:20:14 AM EST

This may sound trite, but it's what I believe. The "direction" in which the content "goes" is dependent on the people that are voting, and the people that are writing. There are fewer people writing and voting for tech stories, as a percentage of the whole. This is, I think, a natural result of the popularization of the web.

You see, tech people would be the first ones to design and implement a blog, and they are likely going to want to talk about themselves. With the internet getting more popular, you have a bunch of non-tech people interested in a good on-line conversation that have nowhere to go but tech blogs.

What the author seems to be suggesting is that we should somehow curtail this change in focus of the users. I would respond that it would be impossible to do without violating the democratic principles of the site.

If you are one that feels that the number of tech stories has gone down, and you'd like to see more of them, here's my suggestion: Recruit.

  1. Lurk the diaries, and if you see someone who seems to be working with an interesting piece of tech, encourage them to write an article.
  2. Lurk the internet in general for clueful techies, and invite them to join us.
  3. Advertise K5 to absolutely everyone. This will not increase the percentage of tech stories, but it will increase the raw number.

Into Canadian Politics?

That's pretty much my opinion... (3.00 / 1) (#102)
by porkchop_d_clown on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:48:29 AM EST

The lack of tech stories is annoying, but the community doesn't seem to want them, and this is a community site, so...

I've been thinking about doing an editorial about orphan and near-orphan OSes and computer hardware; but finding the time is hard...

So many freaks, so few circuses.

[ Parent ]

Me (none / 0) (#95)
by Cro Magnon on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:29:25 AM EST

I came here earlier this year, January or February, because work was slow and Slashdot was frequently crashing. K5 came up in a /. discussion, so I followed the link. I have mixed feelings about it; when I first discovered it I was disappointed by its low tech content, but lately I've been too busy yelling on K5's political stuff to read /.'s tech stuff. I'd still like to see tech stories, especially on Linux.
Information wants to be beer.
Content Directions (4.50 / 2) (#97)
by Inhibit on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:33:22 AM EST

Comparing the relative number of tech stories on Kuro5hin lately just isn't fair, as the tech market is in a bit of a decline/slump lately and hasn't produced truly groundbreaking product for a while because the overall purchasing market has been slow. Even without my Linux bias, I probably wouldn't be a ble to affectively fill my tech site with pure tech news and have steady content. (Please, no flames. I KNOW that you were waiting your whole life just for widget X, released last month :)

Kuro5hin's article makeup (to me) seems to represent the overall character and flavor of it's readership, as well as current world economic trends/climate. This is a site about, for, and by the readership.

On a more topical note, I first stopped in after having the site reccomended by a friend a few years ago, and have only taken up permanent "residence" a few months ago.

-- Inhibit, PCBurn Linux hardware/software reviewer
No groundbreaking products? (2.66 / 3) (#99)
by Herring on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:37:23 AM EST

What about Windows XP Service Pack 1?

Say lol what again motherfucker, say lol what again, I dare you, no I double dare you
[ Parent ]
No, No (4.00 / 4) (#104)
by virg on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:58:52 AM EST

He said groundbreaking, not computerbreaking.

"Imagine (it won't be hard) that most people would prefer seeing Carrot Top beaten to death with a bag of walnuts." - Jmzero
[ Parent ]
Tech Discussion is an Oxymoron (4.33 / 3) (#103)
by dcheesi on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 10:51:54 AM EST

The fact is, K5 has become a discussion site, not a news site. Articles which are merely informative are relegated to the MLP dustbin. This includes most technology-related articles, simply because there's not much to discuss. For instance, consider a new product announcement, either for sale or in R&D. Beyond the requisite "Cool! I want me one of those!" responses, what more is there to say?

The fact that political opinion pieces have taken center stage is simply a byproduct of the discussion-oriented nature of the site. And I don't think this is a bad thing. If you want tech news, Slashdot can supply it (contrary to the author's assumptions, I'd bet that most people here still read /. as well). If you want (mostly)intelligent discussion, you go to K5.

The main problem as I see it is that K5 still bills itself as a tech site, which it no longer is. Maybe we need to acknowledge the change in direction, and update the site's charter?

I got here (3.00 / 1) (#105)
by Cannonfodder on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 11:02:29 AM EST

by chance. 6 months ago or so I followed a link here and liked what I saw. About a month ago I tried to remember what the site was called and after a bit of searching found the site again. I have no connection to /. I don't like /. it has that "we're superior to you" feel to it. Keep it coming!

I don't even remember... (none / 0) (#106)
by quartz on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 11:13:51 AM EST

"where I came from". Does it even matter? I clicked a link, somewhere, and I got here. That's what people do on the web.

On the web, I'm not anti-anything. I'm not pro-anything either. It's just websitesTM. IMO investing any amount of energy in other people's websites is just stupid. That said, my personal answer to the "why aren't there more stories on K5" whin^H^H^H^H question is "because I don't care for tech stories on K5". I read K5 for its culture & politics content. Not because I hate slashdot or any such nonsense. In fact, I like Slashdot. I also like a bunch of other tech sites that give me all the tech news and discussions I want. I just don't need another tech site.

If K5 somehow returned to being tech-centric, I'd stop reading it, because frankly, K5 as a tech site would probably be worse than Slashdot, at least from my point of view. Many people complain about the bias on Slashdot or the Register, but that's exactly why I read them. All the tech sites I read are biased, and their bias is my bias. I'm a UNIX geek, I need to pick heavily UNIX-biased sites in order to get my tech news/discussions fix in a 98% Microsoft world. The last thing I'd want to read is a democratic tech site 98% full of desktop-centrism, dotnet and other stuff I'm not interested in.

Fuck 'em if they can't take a joke, and fuck 'em even if they can.
The problem is volume (5.00 / 7) (#109)
by ajf on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 11:26:55 AM EST

I came from Slashdot, at least in the sense that I had seen the site mentioned there. But rusty used to post at Advogato too back then, so I'd heard about it elsewhere as well. I started reading K5 around July 2000, about two weeks before the first big K5 downtime if memory serves.

[Short shameful confession: I first heard about The Onion on Slashdot too. But it was never mentioned in more detail than "I read The Onion sometimes", so given the context I assumed it was a Perl blog or something. Heh.]

Anyway, onto the traditional "why K5 is no fun any more" rant.

Like a few others who have posted, I still browse the Slashdot front page when I'm bored but almost never actually read comments or post. When I first started visiting Slashdot regularly (mid-to-late 1998 I think), it would be rare to see a story with more than 100 comments on it. Seeing a story like that made me think, "whoa, that's a hell of a lot of comments — that'll take forever to load, and I doubt I'll have anything to say that won't already have been said".

When I started reading K5, the same thing was true here. For a few months now, it has seemed noteworthy when a posted story has less than a hundred comments attached. And I think that, rather than the popular topics of the day or newbies who "don't get the culture", is the real reason people who have been around K5 for this long are finding it wanting these days.

I noticed that in a recent story Carnage4Life mentioned that he only reads the Technology stories on K5 these days. I had a look at it just now (I have Everything for my K5 front page), and it looks a lot more like what K5's front page looked like a couple of years ago: with ten stories on the front page, the oldest one on the page goes back a month, while my front page gives you less than two days' stories. This lone data point reinforces my kooky theory that someone who has been around that long (uid 1877) would like a view of the site that resembles the olden days.

There are other problems with Slashdot that don't apply to K5, though. The main thing, for me at least, is that rusty has always seemed much more responsive to the community. CmdrTaco and the Slashdot editors seemed to have lost that a long time ago, but they didn't replace that loss of the personal touch with anything resembling professionalism or pride in their work. Maybe it was expecting too much, but I hoped that when it became a real full-time job that they would be more concerned with things like typos and spelling errors on the front page, and would have time to check last week's stories to see if it was a duplicate. Maybe it's just that my expectations were unreasonable — in retrospect, it seems funny to me that they went to such lengths to assure people that there would be no real changes despite the Andover deal, and that now I wish they actually had looked at what opportunities for improvement the deal provided. There were external problems with Slashdot too, such as the ridiculous "I'm crapflooding/karma whoring/trolling to demonstrate the flaws in the moderation system" mindset, but I think it's the direction set by the staff that has made it what it is today.

"I have no idea if it is true or not, but given what you read on the Web, it seems to be a valid concern." -jjayson
Origin: Slashdot (4.00 / 1) (#110)
by mercutio on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 12:05:43 PM EST

I learned about Kuro5hin from the time when their server blew up or get DoS'd or whatever that problem was that they were having.  I recall they got hooked up with a server from the then VA Linux company (now VA Software.)

At that point I hadn't really started reading K5, only glanced over it a few times.  Then one day one of my friends recommended it and I actually took it more seriously and realized it was a decent site.

The thing is, I still read Slashdot everyday just as I always did.  Sure, the comments are of lower quality and there are a lot of weenies there, and most of their news is from Wired or the Register, but once and a while they have so good stories linked, and sometimes they have a good interview or two so I think it's worth it.

My 27,000,000 cents.

coming from... freshmeat.net (4.50 / 2) (#111)
by KiTaSuMbA on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 01:00:01 PM EST

Those of you visiting freshmeat.net must have noticed the far-right column where down to the bottom, after the "index of new projects" there is a "news" section. But freshmeat is a pure software-tech site so you might think I came over for the tech stuff. Wrong! I came for the political / cultural discussions! I orbitted k5 for quite some time as a "visitor" and admired the more or less maturity of the discussions (in contrast to other sites where any article is either followed by an endless queue of "wow,that's great" or, if it touches a "sensitive" issue, endless flames. Granted, K5 is not immune to flamewars but you can find a serious post or two, it is worth reading the comments rather than using it as a "hot links list." I finally registered when I had this feeling I had to comment on a story.
If "collaborative journalism" is what K5 is all about, then the political/cultural dominance over the tech articles is not only to be expected but also hailed. Let me explain this. While on the tech field there is a plethora of sites from the most generic (/.) to the the most specialized (you can find specific sites and forums even for your overclocked Athlon!) the cultural and political field are not so well served on the web. As far as politics are concerned, mainstream news sites never allow a real discussion (some even avoid to include the author's mail) while most "indy" ones come with a more or less specific agenda. Choose one distant to your ideas and you'll get mindlessly bashed, choose one close to you and you bless each other without ever making serious arguements. K5 with its "user is the editor" orientation and feeling leaves room for that. If you keep your eyes open you will find interesting info and documentation even in the worst flamewars. On the more generic "culture" field, there is still a vacuum of sites: they are either "over-specialized," so it's tough both to dig them out and keep up with the discussions, or they are way too much devulgative and taking the stance of "feeding" the visitor instead of allowing him to say his own. In other words, I couldn't submit a paper to K5 but I most definately could discuss the social implications of my ideas and even probe for other points of view and general feelings. Since K5's "editorial decissions" are made in a "democratic" manner, it is clear that political / cultural issues are more popular than specific tech ones. I don't know much nor do I care about the X feature in the Y programming language to allow Z functionality and a programmer couldn't care less about the anandamide's negative effect over GAP junctions in the CNS but we both are probably affected and interested in a political decision / philosophical discussion.  
There is no Dopaminergic Pepperoni Kabal!
Origins... (3.00 / 1) (#112)
by jLici0us on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 01:10:27 PM EST

I came from DailyRotation... i'd never heard of K5, but saw an interesting looking headline one day and checked it out. i like the intelligent commentary/essays and the way people attempt to supply valid reasoning for the opinions opined. Keep up the good writing...

valid reasoning (3.00 / 1) (#126)
by Josh A on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 12:04:02 AM EST

i like the intelligent commentary/essays and the way people attempt to supply valid reasoning for the opinions opined.

That is definitely an aspect of k5 I find appealing. I also like that many people here are not only knowledgeable of various fallacies, but call each other on them.

Thank God for Canada, if only because they annoy the Republicans so much. – Blarney

[ Parent ]
Too many politics stories? (4.50 / 4) (#113)
by Rogerborg on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 02:15:03 PM EST

You could have fooled me.  If I had to pick a meme of the moment, it's meta whinges about why K5 has too many politics stories.

On that theme, why write yet another "K5 is such and such" article?  All that's doing is making K5 be about K5.  Why not actually address the issue by writing a technology article?  

You're suggesting that we do as you say, not as you do.  Round of slow handclaps, that man.

"Exterminate all rational thought." - W.S. Burroughs

can't remember; probably from slashdot (none / 0) (#115)
by janra on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 03:30:45 PM EST

Let's see. I showed up sometime in early 2000, following a link which was probably from slashdot, but my first comment wasn't until that September. I was here for a while, had gotten to like it, and had recommended it to my boyfriend about 2 days before the crapflood blackout. I still checked the site every day, looking for updates. I guess that makes me an "oldtimer" :-)

I continued to read slashdot for most of that year, but I gradually got bored of it. I still poke my head in once in a while, skim the headlines, and leave again, having found very little of more than passing interest. As such, I wouldn't call myself a slashdot "refugee". I was never a big fan of slashdot comments - I hung around but rarely read comments and didn't make an account until comment thresholds were added.

I haven't gotten bored of k5 yet, because there's actual content here. Some of it I'm interested in, some not, but there's enough that I'm interested in. Most other message boards, weblogs, or news sites I've had accounts on I've gotten bored with pretty quickly - not enough new content to keep my interest, once they had it.

Discuss the art and craft of writing
That's the problem with world domination... Nobody is willing to wait for it anymore, work slowly towards it, drink more and enjoy the ride more.
Sigs! (3.00 / 1) (#116)
by thekubrix on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 03:38:42 PM EST

Thats how I cam across this great site,....was reading a well written comment on some board (can't remember, (no not slashdot)) and since I can't help but alwas skim people's sig I saw a link to here and a few minutes later I registered. I think good advertising (or the thick of it) comes from word of mouth.....

My catalyst (4.00 / 1) (#117)
by thekubrix on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 03:46:57 PM EST

As I posted earlier I saw a sig with a link to this site, but what I forgot to mention was the first story I read absolutly had my eyes glued till I finished reading (link posted below), and I think thats what mostly kept me coming,...well written stories and good quality control, keep up the good work.

A Casino Odyssey: Part One
a very well written story by localroger, well worth a re-read!

I can't recommend that series enough ... (4.00 / 1) (#157)
by HypoLuxa on Thu Sep 05, 2002 at 11:05:33 PM EST

... despite the fact that is was the first of the "series" articles, which is a format I tend to hate. I remember being glued to k5 like a soap opera junkie; checking back at least once a day (usually many, many times a day) to see if the next part had been posted.

I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons.
- Leonard Cohen
[ Parent ]
who, how, and why (4.00 / 1) (#118)
by Kellnerin on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 03:50:06 PM EST

I don't think which site I was on when I first clicked a link to K5 is all that important (I think it was freshmeat, yay OSDN), but more "where I come from" generally. I'm in many ways a typical lit major, studied a bunch of (human) languages (including some dead ones), and am doing fairly lit major things with my career. But a few years ago I started dabbling with code, ripping open computer cases, and running linux and all that, bringing me towards the intersection between "technology and culture" that Ye Olde K5 used to have.

I think what I found appealing, and what I miss now, is intelligently written, mostly original content, by people who generally knew what they were talking about. Maybe because I've been around for a while and seen most topics come up more than once, it doesn't seem as fresh to me as it used to, and maybe the old days always seem more golden, but it does feel like there's a lot more political flamebait, op-ed wanking, and mindless LP'ing than there was before. I've finally come to realize the dread when I see "MLP" in the queue now, that I didn't understand when I first got here (around March of 2001).

I know the best way to buck this trend is to write the kind of story I'd like to see and discuss on K5, submit it, and hope the current community still finds it interesting. One day, RSN, I will ...

--sometimes you pick your gods, sometimes the gods pick you -odin--

Bad memory... (4.00 / 1) (#119)
by aluminumaloi on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 04:26:37 PM EST

I truly don't remember where I came to this site from, but I remember when: shortly after Sept. 11. I was in search of a source of news other than the big media companies and, while I didn't necessarily find that here, I did discover that, if nothing else, articles and comments here tended to contain links to news sources I had been previously unaware of. Then it sort of just slowly sucked me in. Now-a-days I at least check out the new headlines daily, and occasionally write in my diary.

So, yeah, there you have it. Not too interesting.

Lemme tell you ... (5.00 / 1) (#121)
by mami on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 05:29:40 PM EST

Once upon a time there was the lady illiterate, the computer, the web, the geek and an idea, all of which didn't seem to work and fit together the way they should.

The geek told me to read the sources and the docs. That led me among others to usenet and /. and /. taught me that something is broken with the geeks that needed some fixing.

One day I heard that there are more thoughtful geeks than the /.er ones and they are at K5.

So, I came here. That taught me that something is broken with the more thoughtful geeks and the wanna be (and good) writers that needed some fixing.

So, I thought to myself, I am goint into the fixing business and tell 'em what I think of them. That taught me that it really doesn't make sense to talk to trolling libertarian hawks.

Then I had too much time on my hands and had nothing better to do than getting mad with all these creepy nicks out here.  

Then I realized that I am interested in knowing how a guy like Rusty makes money with something horrible like K5. Now I am here to see how I get myself above the nick level commentaries. But then I want to see how K5 survives or dies. So, I still have a reason to watch out for you.

Well, K5 is to blame for my continuous downfall from a decent lady to a libertarian hunting, angry old woman, who will never understand why nick-geeks are that terrible people.

Was that a helpful comment?  

The immigration analogy is flawed (5.00 / 2) (#124)
by jbuck on Fri Aug 30, 2002 at 06:32:06 PM EST

If I immigrate, I must leave one country in order to live in another one. Lots of folks read both /. and K5, and many post on both. The two sites serve different purposes.

However, one of the biggest problems K5 has is that the K5 community seems so intent on defining itself in terms of /., or more specifically as not-slashdot. In fact, K5 is just too self-conscious in general. Concentrate on good writing, interesting discussions, and so forth and the site will be good and interesting.

In fact, (none / 0) (#137)
by Quick Star on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 06:22:08 PM EST

many of us do just that.  I used to post to slashdot HOURLY.  Now, I look at it about once every 3 to 4 days.  Things here are much, much better - largely because Rusty is not Taco.

"absolutely no one can sex a lobster without cutting it open" -- rusty
[ Parent ]

Everything is a metaphore (none / 0) (#138)
by Holloway on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 09:22:33 PM EST

No, but you see, the airplane is like the internet, and the snack trays, they're the front page of the site, the stewards - they're the http protocol, http 1.1, I think.

The toilets, that's like the moderation system, and the in-flight movie is like the diary entries.

== Human's wear pants, if they don't wear pants they stand out in a crowd. But if a monkey didn't wear pants it would be anonymous

[ Parent ]

blah blah blah, shut up (5.00 / 2) (#152)
by codemonkey_uk on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 05:33:21 AM EST

Yes: It's a crap metaphor. I think I might have mentioned that myself in the article. And anyway, your wrong. Many people did "leave" slashdot in favour of Kuro5hin.

No: K5 no longer defines with regards to /. - had you read the article you would have seen that I was talking about a period of the sites past.

No: K5 isn't even a fraction as self absorbed as it has been in the past. It is true that excessive masturbation can be unhealthy, but then so is a lack of introspection.

I have no idea how you've managed to get 2 moderations of '5'. Your comment is part stupid, part obvious, part short sighted. Of course good writing and good discussion is a focus of the site, but writing and discussion cannot - or should not - exist in a void. A writer writes about a topic. Discussion does not exist without a subject. Nobody argues that the writing/discussion here should be bad, so what was your point?
"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there is no good evidence either way." - Bertrand Russell
[ Parent ]

I got lost on the web... (2.00 / 1) (#127)
by threaded on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 05:21:04 AM EST

So I asked a search engine where I was, and up popped the drop down list box at the bottom of a page here.

/*Good, Quick, Cheap: Choose two!*/
KDE endorsed? (4.00 / 1) (#128)
by mishmash on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 06:08:12 AM EST

Just a silly note: I came here by the way of KDE -- it ships with a horribly-addictive news ticker applet, and kuro5hin is one of its pre-set news sites.

It's -- oddly enough -- lumped together with Slashdot in the "Computers" sources.

Same way (3.00 / 1) (#149)
by tangocharly on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 02:08:32 PM EST

I found kuro5hin by the same way. Actually I first subscribed to k5 before discovering slashdot.

[ Parent ]
The pace of the site. (5.00 / 1) (#130)
by nr0mx on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 08:43:18 AM EST

As others have already pointed out, the site has definitely changed a lot in the past one year. Till this article came along I reckoned that it was because the old warmth and personal touch was gone. The kind of articles that got posted in the earlier days were _different_, I thought.

Your article provoked me to actually go back and take a look at why & how the articles were different. I took a look at the Culture section. Nothing much seems to have changed; the articles are similar, only the volume of comments is overpowering. Ditto the Technology section.

In the earlier days, the comments were where most of the interesting stuff happened, unless you had an absolutely brilliant article on a topic that you were totally clueless about before.

This increase in the number of comments means that effectively the site moves much, much faster. Earlier, the site and the stories ambled along at a steady, easy pace. You looked at the site in the morning, selected the stories that interested you. Then you followed the discussions around those stories; contributed if you could. You had the time to follow a discussion completely. I certainly felt some satisfaction reading all the comments attached to a story that I cared about. I'd rather not go by some pre-judged rating that others have already applied on the comments - it leaves me feeling rather uneasy ( don't ask me why ).

Add to this the undisputed fact that the ratio of Technology & Culture stories versus everything else has taken a beating, and there you have another major change in the nature of the site.

There, you have the reason why the articles and the discussions left me cold. Now that I know, I'll probably confine myself to just reading selected Technology/Culture articles. Perhaps Meta too. I just wish there were some way of filtering out all political discussions. Not just from the Freedom & Politics section, but postings with policial leanings masquerading as MLP, News, Op-Ed etc.

This is a community site, and I respect that. But I came here for the Technology and the Culture, not the News and Politics ( well, most articles on Freedom are just a stone's throw away from Politics, aren't they ? ).

I came from Slashdot, but it was not really a migration. I still look at /.'s FP daily, and I have always lurked around there, never contributed, never had the urge to. I guess I will stick on here as it is still the best site I know. But, if there were a site out there that resembled the k5 of old, I'd switch.

NOOO! You mentioned the other site (4.66 / 3) (#133)
by p0ppe on Sat Aug 31, 2002 at 12:05:18 PM EST

First rule of K5 is "you do not mention the other site"
Second rule of K5 is "you do not mention the the other site"

"Democracy is three wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner."
Stumbled in (4.00 / 1) (#142)
by Goldblubber on Sun Sep 01, 2002 at 08:59:25 PM EST

I got home late from the pub one night, couldn't sleep, so I went surfing. The next day I found K5 on my favorites. Nothing scientific about my net migration.

The Register (3.00 / 1) (#145)
by GavinWheeler on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 04:28:17 AM EST

While I first heard about K5 on Slashdot, it was a story on the Register that actually prompted me to come take a look, I think.

MeatBall Wiki (none / 0) (#147)
by sebpaquet on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 12:08:47 PM EST

I'm an oddball from MeatBall. Although I already knew of high-signal, open communities, this seemed like the largest one by far. I subsequently found out that the loose community of personal weblogs is even larger and more diverse.

Seb's Open Research - Pointers and thoughts on the evolution of knowledge sharing and scholarly communication.
Through a friend. (3.00 / 1) (#150)
by Rock Joe on Mon Sep 02, 2002 at 05:47:53 PM EST

I was reffered to this site by a friend of mine. He said I'd like it because it's a site for people who like to think. And I gotta admit that since I started visiting this site, I've been going to /. more seldomly. But as far as this anti-slashdot mentality goes, I haven't been here long enough to really notice any changes, but those who hate /. are probably disgruntled geeks. And who cares what disgruntled geeks think? :o)

Signatures are for losers!
--Rock Joe
Possible explanation for politics influx (4.50 / 2) (#153)
by wrinkledshirt on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 11:43:12 AM EST

There really isn't anywhere on the web that publishes articles from wingnuts on both sides based solely on quality and ability to provoke discussion. This is really something. You don't have to look far to see that most outlets have a mandate to express one view over another, or at best token viewpoints from both sides. Editors get fired for writing an editorial that goes against the company leanings. K5, on the other hand, has no such obligations, and offers the chance to really dig into it. I suppose usenet offers the same opportunity, but on K5 it's packaged really nicely and in a more media-friendly way.

For the record, despite my interest in the politics more than technology, I'm a refugee from Slashdot, although I still go back occasionally just to browse the headlines.

Part of what happened (4.00 / 1) (#158)
by aphrael on Fri Sep 06, 2002 at 12:55:11 AM EST

was the US presidential election of 2000. The US was obsessed with it, to a certain extent, and stories about it flooded the queue for almost two months. all the immigrants during that period saw all these political stories and assumed it was a primarily political discussion site. (of course diaries started at about the same time, but i'm not sure that's related).

[ Parent ]
I came from slashdot (3.00 / 1) (#155)
by krek on Tue Sep 03, 2002 at 04:28:54 PM EST

It was mentioned in some story or comment on slashdot, and I came here to see what was what and immediately became addicted.

I am here for the debate, the articles, in my opinion, serve primarily as a jumping off point for discussions. That is not to say that I do not enjoy well written but non-comment inspiring articles, just that I would not be here if that was all there was here.

My main goal here is to improve my mind, solely and simply, I have, what I feel to be, many good ideas and facinating thoughts, but, there are so many others who have better thoughts and are able to articulate them so much better than I, and, as luck would have it, there seems to be an above average concentration here at K5. I am here to pontificate, to disagree and correct, to be wrong and be corrected, to enlighten and be enlightened, and sometimes, just to vent some frustrations.

I came from slashdot (none / 0) (#159)
by moronstrosity on Sun Feb 09, 2003 at 11:33:15 AM EST

Me too. I like slashdot, but I think I need more brain food. Too much specific tech stuff going on over there with fanboys fanning the flames. Thought I'd check this site out to see what's different.

These are my interests:

-urban legends and myths and how they affect human behaviour on a large scale

-relevant computer tech issues (not anal-retentive, obscure programming)

-anything to do with cryogenics (but not computer case-cooling or freezing Walt's head)

-engineering neatness not related to computers -people that think "outside of the case"

Since I'm new, I figure I've made about 5 K5 cultural mistakes already, so I'll just wander around and look at the neat stuff.

--- Comments from those under 30 are disregarded
[ Parent ]
Came for 'The Man just wants to bring us down!' (none / 0) (#160)
by phenrich on Mon Mar 03, 2003 at 08:05:46 PM EST

I first came here on the suggestion of another geek friend of mine. We were both /. readers, and he showed me this site. It was sort of funny because he showed it to me when it was down and just had a splash page about how there was a government investigation of a certain comment someone made about biological warfare/terr'r.

Paul Henrich
Owner, WorldHive
Immigration and the "notslashdot" period | 160 comments (124 topical, 36 editorial, 0 hidden)
Display: Sort:


All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. The Rest 2000 - Present Kuro5hin.org Inc.
See our legalese page for copyright policies. Please also read our Privacy Policy.
Kuro5hin.org is powered by Free Software, including Apache, Perl, and Linux, The Scoop Engine that runs this site is freely available, under the terms of the GPL.
Need some help? Email help@kuro5hin.org.
My heart's the long stairs.

Powered by Scoop create account | help/FAQ | mission | links | search | IRC | YOU choose the stories!