---"On one side, you have smokers that feel the fact that they put a fag in their mouth every now and them likens them to a modern day George Washington. To these people, the sight of a lit cigarette is just as awe inspiring as the raising of the American flag at Iwo-Jima."---
+++"This is nothing more than inane hyperbole. In the recent smoking stories I've seen, the smokers basically said "stfu and mind your own business, and secondhand smoke won't kill you." It was the nonsmokers who were teeing off like it was the invasion of Normandy beach with panic-stricken rhetoric about cancer and 'nobody should be allowed to smoke within 50 feet of me' and "WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!""+++
I really don't care what somebody does to themselves, as long as they leave me (and those I care for) out. If they wish to smoke, get _drunk_ on alcohol, injest LSD, sniff crack... Fine. I want NO contact with thier habits. I dont want to smell the smoke, hear their incessant drunken behavior, or other obnoxious or dangerous things.
---"You have anti-abortionists who claim that abortionists want to kill babies who have been in the womb 8.5 months."---
Do they not? Get truth, not sensationialism.
+++"Yup. They also believe that pro-choicers want abortions. Last time I checked, nobody wanted one - some of us just want the option to be available when it's needed."+++
Please explain the situation in when it's needed.
---"You have pro-choice who claim that all anti-abortionists are against birth control."---
In some cases, that is correct, however, it's not constrained to K5. The Catholic faith believes that ALL contraceptives are evil, along with abortion, death penalty, and other situations that fall within determining life or death.
I am Catholic (so I believe I can give an honest idea, however I do NOT believe in the Catholic edict banning contraceptives). Their idea is (in belif of a God) that humans have no jurisdiction on the decision of life or death, other than in natural death (old age, disease, ...). This idea that humans have no jurisdiction over (cause) of death had to be brought to an extreme as to express how much Catholics in general hated abortion and the Death Penalty.
---"I've never heard this except for maybe one or two paranoid ravings here on K5. I have not encountered this in any other source, including religious-oriented pro-life websites and books."---
+++"The amusing thing is that the majority of people here are men, and have no real functional knowledge of the female body or the process of childbirth."+++
That seems in jest. I can surely say that many of us have had relationships- intimate ones at that.
---"More amusing is that the majority of the legislative body making laws about abortion are also men. I think the situation would be quite different if it were women in charge. There's a few pro-life women out there, sure, but pro-life men far, far outnumber them."---
Either way, I don't like the outcome. First is the 10'th Amendment. It states if a power is'nt held by the national government, it's held by the state. The second is life or liberty cannot be taken without due process. The argument now has "The definition of Life". That sure did'nt concern the framers. Many say that life is some religious definition.... Nope.
+++"Almost entirely from religions fighting with themselves or each other, I should add. I have yet to hear of atheists starting any wars, torturing anyone, or burning people at the stake for their beliefs."+++
I'm sure it has happened at least once somewhere.Jusy because you didn't hear about it does not make it "Not exist"
+++"Why is it that virtually every controversial topic in this world is open for discussion, but when it comes to religion, we're all supposed to say "Oh, well, you have your belief, I respect that"?"
Of course. It stops when you "Inflict" your religious belifs on other -possibly unwilling parties-. That's better than each religion seperation and killing each other again. COexisting and diversity is better than murder.
---"The bible thumpers preach that anyone who doesn't love Jesus will go to Hell, and get offended at anything that doesn't line up with their narrow view of the world. These people support laws banning cursing on TV and teaching of evolution in schools. They feel that anything to the contrary of their beliefs doesn't deserve to exist."---
I've been thumped before. Those people are totally irrational, and hold no coherent thought. That's why they're busy thumping on street corners. Of course, telling them "If I go to your Hell, will I STILL have to listen to you?"
Now THAT pisses them off.
---"On the other hand, there are extreme atheists who get offended at the sight of a church on a street corner."---
Fine, let them. Why do I care if somebodyy is getting offended by the sight of a church?
+++"Show me one. And "being offended" isn't the same as "trying to make it illegal" - not that I've ever heard an atheist, here or anywhere else, say they were "offended" at the sight of a church. Most of them either ignore it as they would a billboard or X10 ad, or quietly snicker and move along."+++
I believe the recent case brought up by the atheist family is trying to remove the words "Under God" from the Pledge of Alligence
+++"The point is, painting absurd characatures of the arguments espoused about these topics just so you can laugh at how silly they are is beyond ridiculous. You've proven nothing except your own lack of attention to the actual discussions being played out."+++
If that's true, so have you.
---"Let's try to go back to technology and culture, and leave the politics for the political websites."---
Very much agreed.
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