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[P]
Fuck Natalee Holloway

By gbd in Op-Ed
Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 09:52:39 AM EST
Tags: News (all tags)
News

Does the name "Natalee Holloway" ring a bell?

If you follow the news media in the United States, particular the 24-hour cable stations, it certainly ought to. On the other hand, if you've been living in a cave for the past month or so, here are the highlights: Natalee Holloway is an 18 year-old girl from Alabama who vanished on May 30th from the island of Aruba, where she was vacationing with some of her classmates to celebrate their high school graduation. Based on the amount of coverage that this story has received from the national media (Fox News in particular), one must draw the conclusion that this is a Very Important Issue, and that all Americans should care very deeply and personally about it.

I must confess that I do not.


Now, before I get called a heartless bastard, let me hasten to point out that I agree that this story is tragic. Natalee's family and friends have doubtless been going through hell during this past month. I do hope that she can be recovered safe and sound, though that possibility seems very remote at this point. If I were the King of the World, I would snap my fingers and instantly transport every missing person back to the safety of their families.

But what makes Natalee Holloway more important than, say, Reyna Alvarado-Carerra?

In the United States alone, more than a million people are reported missing each year. The majority of these cases involve minors. The majority of those cases are runaways, but there are also significant numbers of abductions at the hands of both relatives and strangers. This brings us to the case of Reyna Gabriella Alvarado-Carerra.

Have you ever heard of her?

I certainly hadn't until I started doing research for this story. Reyna is a 13 year-old Hispanic girl who is believed to have been abducted by a stranger in Norcross, Georgia. She was abducted just a few weeks before Holloway. A Google search on her name yields a grand total of 6 results.

The same search for "Natalee Holloway" turns up 276,000 results.

But Natalee doesn't just get more Google search results. She's getting airtime, baby. As I mentioned in the intro, American news outlets are awash with a veritable cornucopia of Natalee fever. She also gets assistance from the Dutch Marines and special agents of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, who apparently already have enough resources at work battling mundane things like terrorism.

Here's the straw that broke the proverbial camel's back, and the reason I am writing this treatise: CNN is now reporting that Holland is sending three F-16 warplanes to assist in the search for Natalee. I was given pause by thinking about the sheer cost of this endeavor. My brother-in-law is a recruiter for the Air National Guard, and I have a rough idea of how much money it costs to even get one of those things off of the ground. How much do you suppose is being spent to equip these planes with the special search equipment and then actually get them to Aruba?

The disproportionate response of Aruban, Dutch, and American authorities to the disappearance of this girl can only be attributed to the disproportionate amount of media coverage. CNN, MSNBC, and (especially) Fox News feature hourly updates on the status of the investigation. They interview family members, law enforcement personnel, and representatives of the Aruban government. The case even features prominently on right-wing talk radio shows, such as the Sean Hannity Show and Bill O'Reilly's Radio Factor. This is perhaps the most interesting aspect of the coverage: What could possibly be political about this case? Why would Hannity and O'Reilly be interested in taking away airtime from discussions about the immorality of Democrats and spend it on Natalee Holloway instead?

I can guess, and will spend the next couple of paragraphs doing so. This is mere speculation on my part; you have been warned.

The initial Fox News coverage of the story was pretty transparent, particularly on O'Reilly's show. The incident was portrayed as a lesson: "See, this is what happens when you vacation outside of America in nations with swarthy peoples." Initially, two former security guards were arrested in connection with the disappearance. O'Reilly called these two men "slugs" and lamented the fact that Aruba does not have a death penalty that they could be threatened with. Of course, it later turned out that the two had nothing to do with the abduction, and they were released. (As far as I've seen, there was no retraction or apology from O'Reilly, a man who constantly reminds us that he does not "engage in speculation" on his show.)

Things changed when the focus of the investigation shifted to 17 year-old Dutch boy Joran van der Sloot. Since the new culprit was now Whitey, the initial political spin was invalidated. Fox briefly attempted to make the story into an argument for the juvenile death penalty (even going so far as referring to van der Sloot as a "17 year-old Dutch man.") This fizzled, however, and the current focus of the coverage, at least on Fox, is the supposed ineptitude of Aruban law enforcement. O'Reilly's new favorite pastime is lambasting the Aruban authorities for not giving the media enough information about the case and for not having recovered her body yet. This despite the fact that it took over a year to find the body of Chandra Levy (and Washington, D.C. is smaller than Aruba.)

But I digress; I would be doing a grave disservice to suggest that the other news networks have been handling this story responsibly. The coverage at places like CNN and MSNBC has been less political but certainly no less pervasive. Stories of actual importance to the daily lives of Americans are routinely ignored in favor of the latest non-updates in the Holloway case. (To be fair, however, the Holloway case is far from the only non-news that is being reported; my life is not particularly affected by shark bites to Austrians who are vacationing in Florida.)

Here are some things that you may have missed over the past couple of weeks if you rely on American television news for your daily dose of information:

These are just a few examples. But hey, we're getting our Natalee fix, right?

It would probably be impossible to figure out how many millions of dollars are being spent on the effort to find Natalee Holloway. But I'll wager it would be relatively trivial to determine how much money and effort is expended on a typical abducted person case. So if you've reserved a few moments out of your day to send your thoughts or prayers to the family of Natalee Holloway, you might want to do the same to the family of Reyna Alvarado-Carerra.

Does it make me a bad American if I just don't care about Natalee Holloway (above and beyond the general concern expressed at the beginning of this story?) Is the life and death of one teenager worth more than another on the basis of her socioeconomic status? Is America, as a nation, well-served by a news media that is more concerned with infotainment than it is with information? And if you think that the Natalee Holloway case is something that in any shape or form deserves my hourly attention, could you explain why?

I wish I could say that I care, but I just can't.

Update [2005-7-29 9:8:37 by rusty]: Hello, AOL visitors and others who found this article through Google! Many of you probably find yourselves in an absolute lather of dudgeon and froth right now, and are just itching to send off an email to the vile proprietors of this site expressing your shock and outrage at the title of this article (having not read beyond that). May I take this opportunity to gently recommend that you do not do so, since quite a few others already have, and with even more misspellings, grammatical mistakes, and capitalized sentences than you were going to use. Chances are that whatever you were going to say, whether it was a promise to report us to government authorities, threats against our persons and/or families, or just a stream of profanity, has already been said even less coherently by someone else.

While we do find your emails very entertaining, I feel bad that so many of you are wasting your valuable time on them. I felt it was only fair to warn you in advance that your emailed expressions of outrage will be at best ignored, and at worst posted elsewhere on this site for further mockery by the community at large.

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Poll
The Natalee Holloway case is something that
o I update myself on several times a day 11%
o I have a mild interest in 7%
o I couldn't possibly care less about 81%

Votes: 222
Results | Other Polls

Related Links
o Google
o Reyna Gabriella Alvarado-Carerra.
o three F-16 warplanes
o Chandra Levy
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o already have
o Also by gbd


Display: Sort:
Fuck Natalee Holloway | 1420 comments (1394 topical, 26 editorial, 16 hidden)
The compelling scuba boat (2.77 / 9) (#2)
by khallow on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 04:23:21 AM EST

I have lived in a cave for the past month and I still heard about this story. I saw a brief bit of CNN. At the time, there was this reporter trying to get close to this Aruban scuba boat which was anchored offshore. With the blurry telephoto shorts of this boat sitting in the water and the reporter's eloquent description of his arduous journey through treacherous mangrove swamps to get these shots (and dammit, he can't get closer without swimming, Mr. Anchorman!), it seemed, you know, compelling. I hope the boat turned out ok.

Stating the obvious since 1969.

Winkhorst (none / 0) (#340)
by Winkhorst on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 12:42:17 AM EST

This is exactly why I don't watch TV anymore. It used to be a vast wasteland. Now it's just a toilet. And folks like O'Reilly just float along.
______ *****Welcome to Avalon*****
[ Parent ]
AMEN! (none / 0) (#872)
by skotty75 on Mon Aug 01, 2005 at 03:13:41 PM EST

Thank god someone else agrees with me and has the balls to say it! She's dead, it's her own damn fault, her mother needs to get a grip, Greta Van Susteren needs to go back to respectable journalism, and we all need to get on with our lives!

My Thoughts on Natalee and other Stupid American Kids Who Die on Vacation...

[ Parent ]
sick (none / 1) (#949)
by smokingrooves on Thu Aug 11, 2005 at 09:25:33 PM EST

the title of your article is sick...your sick...fuck you...i hope if you have kids or ever do that something like this happens to you..your dirt

[ Parent ]
whatever (none / 0) (#1074)
by maab on Fri Sep 02, 2005 at 07:26:01 PM EST

it's funny that the person that started this article, was saying that this case gets to much media-attention and now it gets even more attention, cause of google and a belgian news article :) but it's all good

[ Parent ]
Positivity Changes Lives (none / 0) (#1196)
by twine on Fri Nov 11, 2005 at 11:58:33 PM EST

Though you've asked that we do not post any more responses to this subject, I feel that it's not right to refuse anyone the chance to share their thoughts. Otherwise, why would this site be here? After watching a movie tonight with my husband, I came across a special on sex slavery in the USA and Natalie Holloway's name was brought up. I was curious to learn more about these heinous crimes so I did a google search and came across your site. I was very interested to enter the site after reading the offensive title. Definately an attention getter - though negative. The Natalie Holloway story is a good example to young women to use good judgement when out alone. I'm very surprised that it's gotten such air time but after Jessica Lynch made the news I shouldn't be. The Tsunami received less air time in the USA than this case. It's because it's more effective to tell a personal story than the story of the mass. It touches the heart easier. Another thought is that the majority of the American population would rather know about a blond American that they can relate to rather than what's going on elsewhere. It is a racial issue but that is human nature. It's only recently that there's been an increase in non-caucasion races in the USA. We have to remember that the audience watching the television is still white and mostly female and the media is going to bring programs to that audience in order to sell advertisements. As a white female, I try to get a world perspective but there's that desire to find out what happened to Natalee and most importantly the 'hope' that she can be found. One person's experience can change our society such as Rosa Parks did when she refused to move from her bus seat. What if Natalee isn't dead but in sex slavery like some people suspect? Finding any connection to that could change many women's lives. Let the television air Natalee if they want and if you or I would like to see other news, go elsewhere or go find it and bring it to the public. No one's being violated by airing Natalee on the news. It seems unfair that other people don't get air time but the USA demographics aren't in their favor. Life is never going to be fair, some people get murdered, some die of cancer and others die of old age. Negativity, even in just the subject is not the solution. We have to enjoy the moments and do what we can to make things more positive for others. Sometimes, you have to know the right people to contact and never give up. My husband was stuck in Colombia for a month with no US help. The first week, I was nothing but negative and all I came across was negative people. Finally, a Congresswoman helped me after myself and my family called her for a week straight, a couple times a day. During the first couple of weeks, I heard comments that he wasn't a real American even from our own government but I kept hope. Today, my husband and I are grateful to have one another and we do what we can for the people in our community. It starts at the nuclear level. Say hello to your neighbor whatever the color and be there for each other.

[ Parent ]
sometimes I wonder if this bullshit hurts ratings (2.63 / 11) (#6)
by insomnyuk on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:14:25 AM EST

Everyone from my parents to my co-workers to some fellow students have noted the insanity of dedicating so much media coverage to the disappearance of one person.  This is purely anecdotal, but all of these people have decreased their TV news viewing in the past 5 years. After the constant barrage of missing white girls, the cable news networks have gotten a little tedious.

Howard Kurtz had this to say about the media's obsession a few weeks ago:

If there's a logical explanation for this, I've yet to hear it. And after JonBenet Ramsey, Chandra Levy, Elizabeth Smart, Jennifer Wilbanks, Natalee Holloway, etc., the pattern is unmistakable. In fact, I tried to look for stories about Holloway for the past month and Nexis interrupted my search, saying it would return more than 1,000 documents.

Here are a few different theories based on 'watercooler' discussions at work:

My theory- I think this is a cynical marketing issue, because my news sources are Google News, the AP Wire, and various blogs, so I only see this sort of shit from the cable news channels and newspapers.

Most American news consumers are white, middle-class. A story about a disappearing blonde woman or girl is tantalizing and scary. They pay attention, its news for ratings. It's theatrical and dramatic. American viewers are shallow and banal, and are fascinating by Brad Pitt and Jennifer Aniston's marital troubles, the Michael Jackson trial, and Oprah's free car give away. Tsunamis and pre-emptive warfare are boring. Americans are either racist or self-centered and the media cynically plays to this. Examples: Fox News, MTV. Or the American public is like that because they are spoon-fed by the media what to think and be interested in. Examples: Fox News, MTV.

These pretty disappearing white girls, in a way, is like Girls Gone Wild for the mainstream media. Except darker, and without a happy ending.

Co-worker's theory- White people are rich and have friends in the media, so when one of their kids disappears, they can get the media to cover it. I.E. the vast majority of Amber Alerts are for white girls, especially.

Unfortunately, for your specific examples, because I was on vacation I watched more TV than usual, and I ended up randomly switching between CNN, CNBC, Fox News, and MSNBC. I saw:

  1. The Unocal story on CNBC (closing bell I think)
  2. The NASA Comet story on Fox News (Neil Cavuto's show)
  3. the Kurdish bombing happened after I stopped watching the news channels, so no comment
  4. I saw a few references to Spain's law on Fox News in the context of a report on Canada's recent gay marriage amendment - and some stuff on it on CNN as well
I was actually impressed with CNBC overall - CNN and Fox News were incredibly stupid, and MSNBC was simply boring.  CNBC, as it has more of a business focus, never seemed to be completely caught up with the Holloway story or the Michael Jackson trial in the way the other networks were.  To be fair to the major networks, the Holloway story is more interesting than the usual disappearance story since it occurred on foreign soil. However, anything happening in Iraq seems like it should be a bigger story, relatively.

I think your story is a good one because it raises a key question: just what the fuck, exactly, determines what is a 'big' news story for these networks anyway?

---
"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken

News examples (1.50 / 2) (#11)
by gbd on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:59:15 AM EST

What I did for those four bullet points is go to Google News and pick out stories that I hadn't heard in the media. That doesn't mean that they weren't covered, just that I didn't happened to be tuned in when they were. It can definitely be said that all of these stories are more important than the Holloway case, and they are not being covered in the hourly updates. It is somewhat reassuring that you've at least heard of them!

I may look for some alternate examples tomorrow.

Thanks for your comments!

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Made my day (none / 1) (#1124)
by Kuro Pathetic on Thu Sep 15, 2005 at 06:53:41 PM EST

After reading your "opinion" I have formed one of my own. You aren't very well educated are you? Oh, I suppose you will tell me about your education and life experiences and what not but I do have to thank you for the comic relief. I think its sad that a small person like you feels so badly about what they see in the mirror every day that they feel the need to get attention the way you have. Seeing a shrink? I would bet that you are but are embarrassed to say. Besides, I think it's interesting to see you whine about her news coverage, then use her yourself for attention. Wasting my time with this email? No, because I know that as much as you may try to deny it, that after you read these messages, deep down you feel as stupid and small as you are. Feel that pucker? Sitting there trying lamely to think of a short, biting response? Good luck. Way above you. People like you? Just some sick demented little smudge on the underwear of society. In fact, bet you have one right now. Were you even able to read this completely before responding? I tried to use small words so you would understand without needing someone to read it to you. Sorry, laughing so hard its hard to type. You will keep me laughing all night. By the way. I agree about not wanting to hear about the Holloway girl anymore. Now....if it was you missing.....I'd love to watch that...and smile. Fuck her? No, fuck you.

[ Parent ]
Thou art a fool (none / 0) (#1218)
by Seiruu on Sat Dec 03, 2005 at 08:42:11 AM EST

'You aren't very well educated are you?'

There's no need to use that line, as, at the very least, your English could use some work. And your post isn't exactly intellectually stimulating, either.

At the very least, gbd gave arguments and challenged those who disagree to provide theirs.

All you've been doing is baselessly demean him with no arguments whatsoever. 'Are you visiting a shrink?' Oh please, you in high school, kid?

And even wishing for his disappearance with a smile on your face? gbd is worth 100 of you, you ignorant fool. Rather than tagging him a bigot, you need to take a good look in the mirror. And try not to (consciously) hurt people in the process.

[ Parent ]

Well... (3.00 / 6) (#30)
by trhurler on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 01:47:29 PM EST

First of all, ANY story gets old after a couple of years. Iraq included. Frankly, in all the discussion of "approval ratings" and so on, what is being missed is the growing sense of guilty apathy. People WANT to care, feel like they SHOULD care, but in fact, they DON'T care anymore. They just wish they could fast forward past it and talk about it in the past tense, no matter how long it takes or what happens.

Second, there is no doubt some institutional racial bias in the media, but I don't think this is as simple as it seems. Even among whites, you don't see any ugly kids making the national news, and we've seen some very photogenic black kids in national missing kids in national missing children stories. I postulate that what really makes a difference is how much empathy the networks figure a given image is going to garner - empathy equals interest equals ratings, after all. Sure, it may be wrong that less photogenic kids don't get as much press, but that wrong is in human nature, not some television executive.

Third, be serious. Jessica Lunsford's parents were rich and that's why she was all over TV? Your coworker is a fucking moron. The reality is, Lunsford's dad DEFINES "trailer park resident." This Holloway girl's parents are hardly rich themselves, although at the very least they appear not to be dyed in the wool NASCAR fans. Further, there are plenty of rich minorities, and I don't recall any kidnap or missing persons stories regarding any of them recently. Surely they must have connections too.

It is trivial to decide what is a 'big news story.' They have all kinds of experience with this, because the ratings systems they use categorize people by race, age, sex, and all kinds of other things. A "big story" is a story that will pull in as many people(numerically, rather than as many separate demographics,) as possible. Everything else is bullshit, and should be, since news organizations are indeed judged almost solely by their ratings.

--
'God dammit, your posts make me hard.' --LilDebbie

[ Parent ]
yes... (none / 0) (#129)
by insomnyuk on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 07:58:51 PM EST

you are correct about my co-worker.

The other stuff, I agree with as well, I don't think it really contradicts what I said.

---
"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken
[ Parent ]

RE Natalee Holloway (none / 1) (#267)
by PittPanthersFan on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 11:26:34 PM EST

Natalee Fix? I would love to talk one on one with the person that came up with that one. I have a million things I'd love to say to you but I will just say that I hope one day you realize that you get more in life by giving. So if you have to give a few minutes of your day and stop and pray for someone else, dont complain. I bet you havent even mentioned her in a single prayer of yours. You were probably too busy bitching that she was "getting all the media coverage..." No worries, I'll mention you in my prayers tonight. Maybe when you wake up tomorrow morning you'll have a heart. Love and sympathy to you.
God Bless
[ Parent ]
i agree except (none / 0) (#271)
by insomnyuk on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:02:32 AM EST

that prayer doesn't work.

If this poor young woman had used her mind instead of her drug-addled, media-addled emotions which tell her to live for the moment every possible chance she gets, she might still be alive.

Instead, rich mommy and daddy bankrolled her corrupt, materialistic lifestyle, leading to her demise.

Others have, since I posted here, pointed out that this is whole story has the potential undercurrent for a condemnation of the 'American' lifestyle that values short term pleasure and gratification. This girl was 17 or 18 and getting her rocks off in some foreign country with strange men, alcohol and possibly other drugs included. The men that killed her? Rich, pampered, spoiled pleasure seekers. Wealth for these unimaginative dolts has led to boredom and then to destruction. I have no sympathy for any of them.

Prayer is all about short term pleasure and gratification. I can just pray to God to forgive my sins and make everything better without actually working at it! And He can forgive me for all the naughty things I'll do on Spring Break in Aruba or Cancun or Miami. Why not? It's the American dream.

If you really cared about people you fucking hypocrite, you would concern yourself with the Sudanese being murdered around Darfur, or the people still reeling from the tsunami. Have you ever donated money or DONE anything to tangibly help other people, or do you just say a little prayer in your head and pat yourself on the back for being righteous? You make me sick.

If there really were justice in this world, you would go to Hell for being a self-righteous fuck.

---
"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken
[ Parent ]

Grow Up (none / 1) (#492)
by BabyMorgan on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 01:55:40 PM EST

What you fail to realize, is that before there were major news coverage and search teams etc, this poor young womans disappearance was being swept under the cover so to speak. By no means am I saying that she is more important than any other missing person, but when you're dealing with a different country that showed no concern until her brave mother MADE them, you have to take any measures that you can. I am a mother of 3, and one did in fact pass away. If there had been anything, and I mean anything, that I could have done to prevent her death, you better believe I would have done it. There isnt a parent in the free world that would do any different than what this young womans mother is doing right now.

[ Parent ]
C'mon (none / 0) (#816)
by The Diary Section on Sat Jul 30, 2005 at 12:56:08 PM EST

This "foreign country" business is thinly veiled cocktail of xenophobia IMHO with a pinch or two of "somebody else's fault" to taste.

She was an adult, she went missing. The Aruban police actually moved a damn sight faster than most would have (usually its wait 24 hours, then they'll get back to you in 24 hours and then maybe, if you are lucky, someone will check some files and begin what they laughingly describe as an "investigation"). The Aruban were in her hotel room within hours. Thats not bad going.

Easier to blame those pesky unAmerican darkies though isn't it.
Spend 10 minutes in the company of an American and you end up feeling like a Keats or a Shelley: Thin, brilliant, suave, and desperate for industrial-scale quantities of opium.
[ Parent ]

Agreed. (none / 0) (#540)
by Eleventh Guard on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 05:02:38 PM EST

I think your theory is probably right. And if the Holloway case is big enough for 8 weeks of constant coverage and millions of dollars of help looking for her, then I ought to be able to get 15 minutes to ask for donations so I can get my bad tooth replaced. Especially since my bad tooth was not partially due to reckless behavior, unless not drinking milk as a child is considered reckless behavior. How many non-whites get massive press coverage when they disappear? How many boys? How many people older than early twenties? How many from the working class? Hmm.

[ Parent ]
Theories (2.57 / 7) (#9)
by Ward57 on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:35:43 AM EST

  1. It's all the Iraq war: - the news networks are just doing their patriotic duty supporting the war by distracting Americans from their rightfull daily dose of body bag generation.

  2. Who wears the pants? The media are just getting a kick out of showing themselves how powerfull they are. I mean, three F-16s, Arnold Shwarzeneggar only got six.


Except that... (2.50 / 2) (#78)
by rbochan on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 10:10:08 AM EST

...the news networks are just doing their patriotic duty supporting the war by distracting Americans from their rightfull daily dose of body bag generation...
Except that they're not allowed to show those body bags or flag-draped coffins.
Who wears the pants? The media are just getting a kick out of showing themselves how powerfull they are. I mean, three F-16s, Arnold Shwarzeneggar only got six.
The 'Liberal Media' is only as liberal as the giant corporations that own it.
...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
[ Parent ]
irony (2.75 / 8) (#12)
by Morally Inflexible on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 07:08:55 AM EST

This is the firt I have heard of "Natalee Holloway"

Yeah (2.75 / 4) (#89)
by JahToasted on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 01:06:23 PM EST

Same here. But then I realised years ago that American media is shit and just don't watch it anymore.
______
"I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames" -- Jim Morrison
[ Parent ]
s/media//g [nt] (none / 0) (#105)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:08:42 PM EST



[ Parent ]
heee! (2.83 / 6) (#13)
by retardation jackson on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 08:37:05 AM EST

entertaining link:
White Women in PERIL

--
i <3 kuro5hin

May I suggest not watching TV news? (3.00 / 10) (#17)
by Dont Fear The Reaper on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 10:12:54 AM EST

Yeah I know, that's not what this is about, but seriously, there is no good reason to watch it. TV news is a business that makes it's money by getting you to watch, not by telling you things that are useful to know. What does that mean? It means 1) novelty, and 2) lowest common denominator titillation. It's entertainment, whether they are honest about it (Jon Stewart) or not. Rule of thumb: the larger the intended audience for a message, the less average meaning it has for you as an individual member of that audience. If you're watching stuff targeted at a different audience (Fox if you are not staunchly conservative) it gets worse by an order of magnitude. Staying informed about things that are important to you takes active effort both in finding the things that you want to know and avoiding the rest.

My thoughts exactly (2.50 / 2) (#19)
by greenplato on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 11:29:57 AM EST

I agree with don't fear the reaper. gbd: Does the name "Natalee Holloway" ring a bell? I confess it did not. Not until you reminded me about that story that I hear coworkers talking about.

Look, if you don't like the content or tone of teevee news, stop watching it. I abstain, as "Natalee Holloway" did not ring a bell, and I do not have to live in a cave to do so.

To summarize your story as I read it: tv news does not reflect my priorities, so it upsets me to see this news coverage increase the money and time spent on an issue that is not important to me. There are other people missing that need help and there are other issues that deserve our attention.

Solution: stop watching it, stop writing about it, stop talking about it, stop thinking about it. I don't care to watch it on tv, and I don't care to read it here. If you don't care about this issue why did you bother to write this article? Don't let them get your goat. It's like you are co-dependent on your television newscasts, stuck watching to see what the next great outrage will be, but never having the courage to leave.

[ Parent ]

I have to agree (3.00 / 3) (#79)
by rbochan on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 10:18:00 AM EST

Watch your local news or read the local newspaper to see what's going on in your community, though even that's getting more and more sensationalistic, at least around here.
Get your world/national news from places like Reuters, the BBC, or any number of independent news sources... or hell... even the Daily Show gives you better coverage than the "majors".


...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
[ Parent ]
I think the submitter was just venting. (none / 1) (#106)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:11:54 PM EST

And God knows I can't get me enough of venting.

[ Parent ]
There's a problem with that... (none / 1) (#146)
by Smokin Juan on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 05:10:37 AM EST

Sure, I don't have to watch the pap, but millions of other feel they do. Then they engage in useless conversation. After that they write their senator and the FCC. Then they vote. Not to mention how they provoke their churches. Then they give their money away to their rediculous idols which become more bloated and harder to ignore.

When it's all said and done I have to put up with thier godamned ignorance one way or another. I have to deal with the shitty laws they let pass. I have to endure the half-assed leaders they elect and won't hold accountable.

And so do you.

And so will they, in due time.

[ Parent ]
Reyna Gabriella Alvarado-Carerra. (2.50 / 4) (#20)
by NoMoreNicksLeft on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 11:31:41 AM EST

Well, it truly is her parents' fault. Whoever named their little white girl "Reyna" should be ashamed of themselves, that is clearly a hispanic name. No wonder CNN didn't know to cover her abduction.

--
Do not look directly into laser with remaining good eye.
Whoever named their little white girl 'Natalee' (3.00 / 5) (#103)
by Kasreyn on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:02:20 PM EST

should be ashamed of themselves, that is clearly a trailer-trash name. No wonder Fox rushed to cover her abduction.


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
NPR (2.81 / 16) (#22)
by rusty on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 12:25:49 PM EST

I get most of my broadcast news from NPR, and as far as I can tell, they have totally ignored this case. I was at a family gathering last week, and everyone was talking about this person I'd never heard of. I was like "Wha? Who?" So they explained the case to me, and, like you, I was totally unable to imagine why I should care. And no one could explain why I should either.

So I didn't care, and NPR continues not to mention it, and as a result, I actually do know about the other stories you mentioned.

If you'd like to have some fun though, next time someone badgers you about how you must have an opinion on this, ask them to explian to you why you should care. They won't be able to, and it'll be pretty entertaining to watch them try.

____
Not the real rusty

you try too hard to be a prick rusty (1.00 / 11) (#24)
by community icon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 12:41:17 PM EST

"why should we care?"

um, how bout because she's a young energetic fellow member of our society

same reason you get a little choked up if you see a drunk driver mangle a guy on a motorcycle

same reason you get a little choked up if you hear about a hostage situation at the local elementary school

same reason you get a little choked up when you hear of an airplane crash, bus accident, train derailment, etc

if you don't care you probably need to reexamine your life

i'm not saying this girl should have 24/7 media coverage, but you seemed to be complaining more against that her incident got any coverage at all

let's just hope you're going thru one of those phases where you're trying be be "hard", ya know, e-tough guy and all that (-:

i am not as cool as a: video of a hot chic working out
[ Parent ]

Sorry (3.00 / 2) (#34)
by rusty on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 02:57:37 PM EST

I didn't think the numerous and obvious disclaimers were necessary for me to repeat too.

So, all together, on more time: Of course it's a tragedy. Like all the thousands of other tragedies that get no coverage whatsoever. When I say "why should I care" I mean "why should this be a topic of obsessive saturation media coverage, instead of the one or two local newspaper items that most missing kids get?"

It's terrible. Girl missing. Shame. But I just summed up what appears to be the entire substance of this whole story right there. Beyond that... why should we care?

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]

YHBT [nt] (none / 1) (#43)
by mr strange on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:43:44 PM EST



intrigued by your idea that fascism is feminine - livus
[ Parent ]
yuo are a father, man (1.12 / 8) (#46)
by community icon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 06:16:38 PM EST

think of how yuo'd feel if yuo were in his shoes

i can't imagine personally because i dont have kids

but yuo have a kid or two and i bet if they went missing yuo'd want it covered 24/7

i am not as cool as a: video of a hot chic working out
[ Parent ]

It's spelled YOU [nt] (none / 0) (#54)
by benna on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 11:23:27 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
YHBT [nt] (none / 0) (#59)
by LodeRunner on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:38:18 AM EST

[ni tpick]

---
"dude, you can't even spell your own name" -- Lode Runner
[ Parent ]

Watch out (2.50 / 2) (#69)
by kitten on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 05:08:24 AM EST

You'll rumble his carefully crafted persona.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
want != should [nt] (none / 0) (#65)
by warrax on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:30:12 AM EST

n/t = ihbt, i know

-- "Guns don't kill people. I kill people."
[ Parent ]
Fear not! (none / 0) (#102)
by Kasreyn on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:01:00 PM EST

Soon those filthy public radio commies won't have the funding to ignore stories about poor Christian Anglo-Saxon girls like Natalee any more! :P

seriously though: go NPR. I normally listen to them every day but my radio's busted right now. Things aren't the same without All Things Considered. Although, on the positive side, I don't have to listen to Daniel Shore wheezing and snuffling into a mic like Mr. Snuffleupagus.

Only thing that bugs me about them, not only do they never read my comments on the air, they also won't even reply and tell me if I just sent them in some incorrect format or if I've been ignorelisted for being politically incorrect.


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
NPR (none / 0) (#237)
by gbd on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 02:54:35 AM EST

I'm in the same boat. I listen to NPR on the way to and from work to get the Real News. This means no Natalee Holloway, no Michael Jackson, no Robert Blake, and no shark attacks. NPR gets attacked for being "liberal" (a classification that I would contest) but at least they report real news that actually matters to me.

When I want to read grassroots commentary, I'll go to Democratic Underground, DailyKos, WorldNetDaily, or FreeRepublic (I like to get the full spectrum.)  But when I'm actually looking for the news, there are fewer and fewer outlets to turn to anymore. NPR is one of them. (And there are folks who have a hard-on for shutting it down .. should we be surprised?)

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

fuck YOU sir (1.12 / 16) (#25)
by community icon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 12:42:44 PM EST

yes, fuck you

i am not as cool as a: video of a hot chic working out
why i care more about natalee (1.18 / 22) (#26)
by community icon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 12:47:43 PM EST

than Reyna Alvarado-Carerra

ETHNOCENTRISM

yes, a phrase many of you should know but probably do not due to any and all baldrson stories getting dumped here in less than half a day

we are all natural 'wired' to be ethnocentric:  i.e. me against all, me and my brothers sisters father mother against all, me and my brothers sisters father mother grandparents against all, me and my town against all, me and my state against all, etc.

this Reyna Alvarado-Carerra person i have never heard of but i dont care about them already as much as i do natalee

why?

for one, me and my family and friends tend to be named david, or jessica, or michael, or britney

when i hear Reyna Alvarado-Carerra i can just tell immediately that they are way away away away from me biologically, ethnically, morally, etc.

way away away from here I'll be
way away away so you can see
how it feels to be alone and not believe (feels to be alone and not believe)
feels to be alone and not believe anything

i am not as cool as a: video of a hot chic working out

unfortunately for her (1.80 / 5) (#27)
by retardation jackson on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 01:03:39 PM EST

she was not nearly as ethnocentric as yuo! ^_____^

--
i <3 kuro5hin
[ Parent ]

Oh shut up! [nt] (1.00 / 3) (#42)
by mr strange on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:42:22 PM EST



intrigued by your idea that fascism is feminine - livus
[ Parent ]
(0) - Adds nothing to the discussion at hand (1.00 / 3) (#45)
by community icon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 06:14:46 PM EST

nt

i am not as cool as a: video of a hot chic working out
[ Parent ]
all i know (3.00 / 5) (#49)
by trane on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 07:40:00 PM EST

is this natalee person will probably never fuck me, so why the fuck should i give a damn?

[ Parent ]
-1 go look it up (none / 0) (#61)
by livus on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:39:50 AM EST

Dude that is so not what "ethnocentrism" means.

---
HIREZ substitute.
be concrete asshole, or shut up. - CTS
I guess I skipped school or something to drink on the internet? - lonelyhobo
I'd like to hope that any impression you got about us from internet forums was incorrect. - debillitatus
I consider myself trolled more or less just by visiting the site. HollyHopDrive

[ Parent ]
interesting (none / 0) (#196)
by muyuubyou on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 02:48:14 AM EST

Maybe when the USA is a hispanic country in some decades, nobody will give a damn if Britney, David or Natalie get abducted, gang-raped and sunk into the ocean.


----------
It is when I struggle to be brief that I become obscure - Horace, Epistles
[ Parent ]
dumb fuck (none / 1) (#476)
by staagrounded on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 07:05:49 PM EST

you stupid racist fuck

[ Parent ]
-1, YFI (2.54 / 11) (#29)
by trhurler on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 01:33:26 PM EST

The reason this is on national TV is because she's an American and this happened outside of the US. If this had happened on the beach in Florida, it might have made the news for one or maybe two days, and then it'd have only made local media. If this had happened to a nonwhite American in Aruba vacationing after high school graduation, it'd still be all over the media, because nationalism is generally a stronger force than racism anymore.

An aside: did you know that studies done for the big television networks have shown that the only thing that really matters in the ratings impact of a missing persons case is whether the victim seems innocent and helpless? Ironically, it appears that if you show nonwhite victims, more white people seem to care than otherwise would these days, but less minorities care enough to bother watching. Apparently they care more about white people. I find that fucking hi-larious.

Oh, and really, yes, the value of the life of one person, in any practical sense if not theoretical, DOES depend on socioeconomic status and so on. Sorry to break this news to you for the first time on LivingInACaveVision[tm], but even poor people care more about what happens to rich worthless idiots than they do their own neighbors.

--
'God dammit, your posts make me hard.' --LilDebbie

I doubt it (2.62 / 8) (#31)
by kitten on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 01:57:44 PM EST

She's getting airtime because she's a cute white blonde girl ("cute" is relative, I guess). It has nothing to do with where it happened.

If this had happened on the beach in Florida, it might have made the news for one or maybe two days, and then it'd have only made local media.

Evidently you're forgetting the Elizabeth Smart fiasco, where we were pounded with updates for months. A little earlier, another girl named Erica Pratt was kidnapped, but we barely heard anything at all about her. Of course, she was black, and her family wasn't wealthy like the Smarts were, so who cares?

All your uncited studies and such notwithstanding, the simple fact is that if you're white or wealthy or both you'll get a lot more airtime, regardless of where you were abducted.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
Should we be surprised? (none / 1) (#92)
by shm on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:15:28 PM EST

That that website has stupid desktop wallpaper for download, just above a donation link?

[ Parent ]
Not just any wallpaper (3.00 / 5) (#98)
by kitten on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:52:59 PM EST

Hugely patriotic wallpaper! Going to Aruba for Spring Break on Mommy and Daddy's credit card and boozing it up and going back to hotels with strange guys is the American dream, you know. She was just living it. May God continue to bless America and have mercy on her soul.
mirrorshades radio - darkwave, synthpop, industrial, futurepop.
[ Parent ]
I was going to point that out (none / 0) (#108)
by shm on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:20:25 PM EST

but that donation link got me all riled up and I forgot to s/stupid/patriotic/.

[ Parent ]
IAWTP 1billion percent [n/t] (none / 0) (#122)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:21:44 PM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
I must say, (2.81 / 16) (#35)
by it certainly is on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 03:25:23 PM EST

this article is the first I've heard of Natalee Holloway.

In other news, the G8 leaders are holding a summit at the Gleneagles Hotel in Scotland from the 6th to 8th of July. In conjunction with this event, Bob Geldof launched a series of concerts around the world, called Live 8. Also, yesterday a group of over 200,000 people marched through Edinburgh under the banner of united banner of Make Poverty History. Both Live 8 and Make Poverty History's aim is to put pressure on the G8 leaders to give genuine debt relief to African nations, rather than the "strings attached" relief they have received in the past.

Are there any other news stories that might have been missed by the American people?

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.

It's not even on the BBC's America page (3.00 / 5) (#37)
by it certainly is on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 03:27:27 PM EST

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/default.stm There is no news story, even on the America page, about Natalee Holloway. As far as my national broadcaster is concerned, this is a non-story.

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

Debt relief (2.50 / 2) (#47)
by 1318 on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 06:33:42 PM EST

Although the "strings attached" from the g8 might be the not so subte strings of economic imperialism, that doesn't mean that debt relief is the communist milk from the baby of jesus be-all of good will.

I am under the general impression that a lot of amazingly corrupt governments ask for and received billions of dollars in assistence in loans which go straight into their pockets while their populations get neglected. To simply forgive the debts might keep the burden of those fake-debts from falling on the population it doesn't at all address the problem of bad lending to begin with.

"So then, why don't you die?"-Antisthenes
[ Parent ]

Plenty of nations (none / 0) (#126)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:55:26 PM EST

where that isn't the case. One example being Brazil.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
Brazil's not on the debt-relief list, though (n/t) (none / 0) (#179)
by Delirium on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:11:24 PM EST



[ Parent ]
That figures [n/t] (none / 0) (#319)
by destroy all monsters on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:13:06 AM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
Leaders of the most powerful countries are meeting (3.00 / 6) (#73)
by godix on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:34:52 AM EST

But in more important news, a rock concert is going on and a bunch of people who have never been to Africa, don't understand Africa well enough to talk about it more than the one or two catchy slogans they've learned, and most likely couldn't name ten countries in Africa to save their life are wandering around the streets.

Thanks for proving that focusing on worthless tripe instead of real news isn't a US only thing.


- An egotist is someone who thinks they're almost as good as I am.
[ Parent ]

in other news (none / 1) (#181)
by Delirium on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:17:49 PM EST

Every non-rich actual African any news organization was able to track down and interview about Live 8 answered with some variation of:
  • I've never heard of this Live 8 thing.
  • These people don't understand Africa's problems; it's just a rock concert.
  • Only Africans can solve Africa's problems; the West needs to leave us alone.


[ Parent ]
Pity the BBC is so hopelessly biased (1.00 / 4) (#121)
by Rapeman on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:18:58 PM EST

On this topic and many others. I sincerely believe that Fox news and its ilk are actually less biased than the bbc. The bbc exists to brainwash people with left wing nonsense, pretty much. It is unsurprising that they are so sympathetic and blatantly in favour of live8 and the G8 protests, when the form of funding they propose for Africa is so similar to how the BBC itself is funded.

Incidentally, it has certainly been amusing to see them warping Bush's offer of dropping farm subsidies if Europe does too into an example of American intransigence, rather than French greed and consumption, since it is they who stand against it.

It has also been fun to watch those hopeless long haired soap dodgers getting a rightful beating from the police.

[ Parent ]

Yeah, it's a pity. (none / 1) (#128)
by tthomas48 on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 07:15:48 PM EST

Thank God we have the equivialant here in NPR and PBS. Otherwise, you conservatives wouldn't actually get any news since the only reason you get it now is because the IBC Network and Fox News are reporting the inaccuracies in it to you. Good God, could you imagine what Limbaugh would be like without legitimate/biased news outlets? He'd have nothing to be angry about. He'd just recap fox news from the night before ad nauseum.
All news is biased. But Fox News isn't news. It's speculative conservative current events commentary.

[ Parent ]
Are you American, by any chance? (2.80 / 5) (#157)
by it certainly is on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:21:11 AM EST

See, the USians have two right wing parties by UK standards, one right wing and one extremely right wing. However, they refer to these as left and right-wing, respectively.

It's no wonder that, when they look at a centrist UK broadcaster, they see left-wing. They presumably wouldn't look at the real left-wing UK media (The Independent, The Guardian, The Morning Star) for fear of being branded "a stinkin' commie".

It's no surprise that the BBC is UK-centric and writes stories from the POV of a UKian. Would it do anything else?

It is unsurprising that they are so sympathetic and blatantly in favour of live8 and the G8 protests,

Except that they weren't. Most of the G8 protest articles are regarding the tiny minority of violent clashes with police. Even the articles that weren't about that spent more time focussing on how well prepared the police were. If you read the full clutch of UK newspapers, you'd find them all focussing on the Live8 concerts and G8 protests, because it genuinely is one of the most newsworthy topics in the country this week. Blame lazy journalism (celebrities supporting good causes get heavy coverage. Mass protests get coverage) if you wish.

when the form of funding they propose for Africa is so similar to how the BBC itself is funded.

This is a non-sequitur. Really, I'd love to take the drugs you're taking in order to make that analogy. Live8 and G8 protesters generally want Africa's paid debts dropped, where the only thing being paid is the accrued interest. They also want the developed world to stop paying such large farm subsidies which allows their produce to come on market below cost. Finally, they want aid to come without strings - specifically strings that mandate shit like making school/hospital users to pay an "end-user fee" to prime them for Western companies to come in and provide the same services for a fee, or to mandate that aid money be spent on buying goods and services from the country that "donated" it.

I fail to see how this correlates with TV licensing in your mind. Either you don't understand TV licensing, the protestors' position or both.

it has certainly been amusing to see them warping Bush's offer of dropping farm subsidies if Europe does too

I haven't seen a word about this offer, not from the BBC and not from any of the American news websites. The only thing the BBC has said about the topic is "So far, the US and the European Union seem unwilling to make concessions on this issue.". Hardly "warping". Please share the source of this revelation.

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

I think you are the one on drugs (1.83 / 6) (#171)
by Rapeman on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 03:41:16 PM EST

The BBC's G8 coverage involves: endless programmes about the plight of "poor starving africans", sycophantic coverage of how great geldof and pals are, endless articles about how wonderful the protestors are, etc. I don't think I have actually heard any real unbiased coverage by the BBC. I certainly haven't heard anything about the opposing point of view that one would think a state owned "centrist" (?) broadcaster might represent.

To wit, that sending money into african dictator's pockets is a waste of time and an expensive folly, and perhaps we would be better to tell them to sod off until they can goivern themselves without mass murder. Or maybe the view that the whole protesting movement is just a rehash of the motivations behind the "scramble for africa" ie more leftwing imperialist "lets change the world for the better and civilise it" nonsense that harmed africa in the 19th and 20th century and will surely harm it further now.

As far as Bush goes, see here: Bush offers to drop farm subsidies. I am very sure I saw an article on the bbc that phrased things rather differently (Bush: I Put US Interests First or something) but you are right: this piece of important information seems to be sadly underreported by the BBC, which is mostly content to bash Bush as much as possible. God forbid it shoudl report any actual offers by him to alleviate the "plight" of Africans. It would just get in the way.

Now, I must take exception to your daft notion that most UKians are extremist lefties like yourself. In fact, most british people are very sensible on most topics, it is only their self-styled elites - BBC journalists, guardianistas, bloggers, etc - who insist on sticking to the left-wing groupthink. This is not unlike, in the US, the difference between Hollywood and newspaper writing elites, and the great mass of opinion among common folk.

I'm a working class lad of Dundee, and like most my folk, I'm sick to death of being told what to think and what I think by the likes of you.

The BBC is kith and kin to the guardian and independent, it is not to the left of them at all. Its entire output is permeated by the harmful ideas of the left. If you can't see this, then you are indeed brainwashed. The BBC's has succeeded in your case. I have never come across someone with an outlook so thoroughly moulded by the British state, with hardly an independent thought left in there.

[ Parent ]

You make a fair point. (3.00 / 2) (#202)
by it certainly is on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:31:54 AM EST

The BBC, taking its entire output into consideration, is pretty left-wing. I was specifically talking about its news unit, which is far more balanced.

I certainly haven't heard anything about the opposing point of view that one would think a state owned "centrist" (?) broadcaster might represent.

While I don't think the BBC will become like the Murdoch press any time soon, the reason I see it as not hopelessly left wing is that it tends to back the state institutions (e.g. the police, the Home Office, the Queen, the Lords, etc.) whenever possible. As I'm sure you know, the Guardian wants a republic and the Morning Star wants to institute communism.

To wit, that sending money into african dictator's pockets is a waste of time and an expensive folly, and perhaps we would be better to tell them to sod off until they can goivern themselves without mass murder.

That's an overly simplistic view of the situation although it's a popular sentiment. The problem is that leaving Africa to itself won't work, mostly because we're cheating the market on agriculture, using our wealth in financial/technological markets to subsidise farmers. So the one thing that Africa has right now to trade honestly is utterly fucked. It would be nice for Dubya to hold to his untenable rhetoric - his party would lose every single one of the rural states in the next election, as folks there love their subsidies and don't give a fuck about Africa. Much the same situation exists in France.

Then there's the problem that most African "aid" money goes to Western private businesses, not Africa. It's corporate welfare by proxy.

Also, if we really do leave Africa to itself, it will take quite some time for the warring to end, if at all. In the meantime, millions die. Do we in the west just shrug our shoulders, say "that's life" and get on with the business of being incredibly rich?

I'm a "charity begins at home" man myself, but I'm all for fairness, lack of unnecessary suffering, and the guilt-ridden rich people having an outlet of some practical use.

Or maybe the view that the whole protesting movement is just a rehash of the motivations behind the "scramble for africa" ie more leftwing imperialist "lets change the world for the better and civilise it" nonsense that harmed africa in the 19th and 20th century and will surely harm it further now.

Well, I disagree with this. IMHO, it's mostly white guilt for getting involved in Africa in the first place. being comparatively rich and not currently subject to crippling wars, corrupt leadership and natural disasters. Whatever the proposed solutions, they pretty much stem from the knowledge that there is unnecessary suffering in the world, and extreme suffering and hardship in Africa particularly. People want to address that without causing more hardship. If you have any good suggestions, let us know. Your "leave them to rot, why can't they fix it themselves?" one sounds particularly shit, btw.

Oh, and some Scotch mist for you.

extremist lefties like yourself.

I take exception to being labelled an extremist leftie, you cheeky bugger. Go read some of my diaries. As an ex-working class Aberdonian, you can probably surmise that I don't have much time for the petty-minded industrialists, woolly-minded liberals or Dundonians.

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

Interestingly, Africans agree (none / 1) (#214)
by Rapeman on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:56:36 PM EST

Africans seem to agree with me quite a lot, certainly more than we would be led to think. Of course, it is unsurprising that if one spends £500000 on a refugee camp of 200 folk, very soon you have 3 refugee camps where there used to be one. People like getting things for free and not working. Keep pumping money into africa at the absolutely atonishing rate it has been for the last 40 years, then triple that as Geldof suggests, and you are making things much worse. Just encouraging Africans to not bother fixing their problems. After all, if they do, the cash dries up!

This is highly similar to how the welfare state strongly encourages the jobless to not get jobs that pay less than all the multiple benefits you can accrue, from incapacity benefit to jobseeker's allowance to housing benefit to child benefit to... you get the picture. If benefits were abolished, I wager the amount of "incapacitated" men suddenly becoming able bodied and finding proper, non-parasitical ways of life in the likes of Glasgow would be astonishing.

Africa of course has exactly the same problems. Phenominal amounts of money have been spent on it already, while it has not improved one iota. It has got worse, and worse. This suggests to me that just writing cheques is not the answer.

ps "just leaving them to rot" - ie respecting Africans as human beings who are fully capable of solving their own problems and should be allowed to figure out their own destiny - does not seem cruel to me. It seems like the only acceptable course. Treating them like poor wee dependents and hopeless basketcases is patronising and worsens the problems you wish to solve. Their problems aren't yours to solve. Just leave them be. Have some faith.

[ Parent ]

Sorry, but that's bullshit Calvinist thinking, (none / 1) (#239)
by it certainly is on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 05:54:03 AM EST

the sort that leads so many Scots men to their downfall, as they turn to drink rather than confront their problems with help of their friends and family. "I dinnae need ony help" and "It's ma ain fault for bein' lazy" are the words of a condemned man.

There's being lazy and deceitful, which is of course wrong, and then there's eschewing all help because you think anything that needs external assistance is a sign of weakness. This is just as bad.

Africa is a problem. It has wars and famine and corruption and millions of people dying completely preventable deaths, many of which are the legacy of our colonial exploits. We can't undiscover Africa, we can't unexploit it and we can't shrug it off.

The hard-man attitude doesn't get you far in global politics. It's a shame you seem so upset with Geldof and pals, because they've got the general gist of the idea: Africa's problems cannot be solved with just money, it's all politics. Tony and pals currently refuse to fuck with the rural vote. Bob is trying to tempt them to do it.

The majority of dole money goes to legitimate people who reallly do need it. It's the con-artists that give it a bad name. Living on only the benefits you're genuinely entitled to and nothing else is a meagre fucking living. Scamming the system (which is what the neds are generally up to) catches a lot more money - as you say, there are plenty of folk on incapacity benefit who are perfectly able to work (and they fucking well do work, which voids their dole, which is why they'll do sly homers for cash-in-hand. Cheeky cunts). Your solution (ban all benefits to everyone to spite a scheming minority) puts us back at ths start of the 20th century, where if you're crippled you might as well do the decent thing and kill yourself early to avoid being a "burden" on your family. Even the USA won't do what you propose.

Their problems aren't yours to solve. Just leave them be. Have some faith.

I do have faith. I have faith that, when natural disasters strike or governments systematically murder their own people, the world won't stand by and let it happen "for their own good".

kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

Attack of the 5 Foot welfare mother (3.00 / 2) (#328)
by mettaur on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 04:14:42 PM EST

"This is highly similar to how the welfare state strongly encourages the jobless to not get jobs that pay less than all the multiple benefits you can accrue, from incapacity benefit to jobseeker's allowance to housing benefit to child benefit to... you get the picture. If benefits were abolished, I wager the amount of "incapacitated" men suddenly becoming able bodied and finding proper, non-parasitical ways of life in the likes of Glasgow would be astonishing.

Either you're talking crap or welfare payments in Merrie Olde Englande are much higher than anywhere else. The dole is less than half the minimum wage, so I doubt people would be on benefits if they could work.

If you have a major physical disability you can get more, but probably not enough to pay for everything you'll need to compensate for the problem. And you need a doctor's certificate every few months to say that you're disabled. You actually have to tell the DSS that your legs haven't grown back and you still can't walk. And to add insult to injury you are required to do that in person.


--
[Applying business theory to trolling]
[ Parent ]
Don't think you're a regular watcher... (none / 1) (#167)
by RegularFry on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 01:25:12 PM EST

...or you'd know that we treat French greed and corruption (especially around the CAP) as expected, ambient, background noise, completely to be taken for granted and utterly un-newsworthy. Not that I can remember any specific coverage by the BBC, mind you, but I can't help but feel that both sides might have a point on this one...

There may be troubles ahead, But while there's moonlight and music...
[ Parent ]
Fuck Bob Geldorf, too (n/t) (none / 1) (#180)
by Delirium on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:11:54 PM EST



[ Parent ]
hear hear [nt] (none / 0) (#184)
by benna on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:57:15 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Jesus, They Still Haven't Found Her? (1.75 / 16) (#36)
by unknownlamer on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 03:25:25 PM EST

I don't care about her because she looks like a bitch. I mean, her friends went to Aruba. That screams pretentious white slutty bitch to me. You know what everyone in Maryland does for Senior Week? We drive three hours to ocean city, drink bud light, and get arrested for being loud at four a.m. Well, I stayed at home and worked ninety hours because I was a god damn loser when I graduated high school. But all my friends did that...

And Yeah, you're probably thinking "white trash" because of this, but it's not true. Sure, a lot of the people in Maryland are, but a lot of them just aren't pretentious. My aunt hates that I drive a Camaro and hang out with the people who live in less suburban areas around here because they aren't "in our class" (she talks with a slight southern accent, hates black people with a passion, and is from the back country in Tenessee originally... but a little money makes her high class...bullshit).

So fuck the pretentious bitch.

+1FP



--
<vladl> I am reading the making of the atomic bong - modern science
GOD-DAMN-IT! (1.00 / 31) (#38)
by Peahippo on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 03:31:05 PM EST

This is the first time I'd heard the name. I made it over 30 days not hearing the name. A NEW RECORD! And it all stems from avoiding "niggernews".

Another name for it is "happynews". It's "news" that is designed to keep you a drooling fucking moron in front of the TV, fat-assed and happy, with a remote control in one hand and a 40 of malt liquor in the other.

While the niggernews networks work hard and diligently to distract you with fluff, the common wealth continues to drain from the First World, into the pockets of the new international elite who have hit upon the idea of hyperliberty -- which depends upon mega-wealth leveraging themselves away from all sovereignties and law. Of course, it also depends upon on our complicity, based upon stupid greed, which brings us back to the purpose of happynews: IT KEEPS YOU GREEDY AND STUPID.

The only thing substantive about the Aruba case is that it probably touches upon White slavery. We don't hear much about that, however. The Israelis have indulged in it for years, so given their control of niggernews through the connection to American Jews, it's not like we'll be having more exposure on THAT topic. The Western media doesn't like to talk about class war. Similarly, it doesn't like to point out anything the Jews are doing. So the Aruba thing will continue to be fluffynews and will even avoid the substantive element of White slavery in its heart.

Sad. Just sad.

Now, let's take a station break, and we'll be back for circletimessquare to show up with his faux righteous Neo-Liberal anger about my use of the terms "nigger" and "Jews" ... as if being angry about expression can do away with the truth of my words.

More after these messages.


You've gone all Baldrson. (none / 0) (#41)
by mr strange on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 05:37:49 PM EST

Where did the Jews come in? Sorry, out here in the real world we don't get to hear anything about this irrelevant circus, so please bring me up to speed.

intrigued by your idea that fascism is feminine - livus
[ Parent ]
You can't be this dense; here: (1.12 / 8) (#48)
by Peahippo on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 06:36:49 PM EST

  • White chick missing from Aruba => White-slavery kidnapping
  • White slavery => Israeli involvement
  • Israelis => Jews
  • Jews => "the media"
  • finally, "the media" => public perception
Like I said, the American media is extremely gun-shy about Jews. Anyone who says the word "Jew" is at great risk of being labelled an anti-Semite. So inquiry is killed off, and in such a dead zone of examination, much illegal or immoral activity thrives. So the presence of Mossad activity in America is largely ignored. As well, Israeli criminal networks are also largely ignored.

We accept the fact that the Neo-Cons have taken control of the American government and news media. Why is it so difficult to understand then that the Jews did the same thing much earlier than that?


[ Parent ]
In other words (3.00 / 2) (#74)
by HollyHopDrive on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 07:11:03 AM EST

You presume the kidnapping is about white slavery, you slap a childishly oversimplified view of the Middle East crisis on to it ("We're the goodies, they're the baddies") with no relevance and conclude with the ancient chestnut that JOOZ RUN THE MEDIA!!!!1111 AND THEY'RE COMING TO KILL YUOR CHRISTIAN CHILD AND DRINK THE BLUD!!!!!!!!!!!111111111

Come on, all the good anti-Semites can come up with better stuff than that. Ah, fuck you.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Actually, I take that back (1.50 / 1) (#75)
by HollyHopDrive on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 07:14:01 AM EST

Rabid racists never come up with better logic because this is all they've got. Thank you for illustrating it.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

True. (none / 1) (#85)
by NoMoreNicksLeft on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 12:44:49 PM EST

But where can I buy a white female slave?

--
Do not look directly into laser with remaining good eye.
[ Parent ]
Here you go... (none / 0) (#97)
by mr strange on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:44:55 PM EST

alt.personals.slavery

intrigued by your idea that fascism is feminine - livus
[ Parent ]
But isn't it (none / 0) (#207)
by Cro Magnon on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 09:22:38 AM EST

run by the jooz?
Information wants to be beer.
[ Parent ]
watch the Liberals squirm over the J word (none / 0) (#194)
by Peahippo on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:52:02 AM EST

Nice dismissal. I note well that you refused to address any part of the logic chain ... which is the case of the "anti-anti-Semite" thought police who have nothing to bring to the table except a wholesale refusal to notice anything with a Jewish connection. The only news story that's killed faster than a Jewish-connection one in America is a CIA-connection one.

Care to give any of my bullet points a shot? No? Probably not, then. After all, rabid dupes ALSO never come up with better logic. Note: A "rabid dupe" is YOU.

P.S. Jews are not a race. They are primarily a culture with some racial overtones. kthxbye


[ Parent ]
You stinking arsewipe (none / 0) (#364)
by HollyHopDrive on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 12:28:17 PM EST

I'm not dignifying your rabid racism with any more rebuttal than I have already below - can you read?

When some fetid Nazi comes in with racist filth it's obvious to all right-minded people why it's wrong. It makes you look even worse that you think there's anything there valid enough to be worthy of discussion. Your leader is dead, your army lost and the world knows your crimes and will wring your scuzzy neck for them if ever you step out of cyberspace.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Extraordinary claims (3.00 / 2) (#83)
by rpresser on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 11:55:25 AM EST

require extraordinary evidence. So far you've made accusations of so low a grade that I wouldn't belive O'Reilly capable of them.

Where the fuck did you get the idea that Israelis as a group are involved in white slavery?

Where the fuck did you get the idea that "the Jews" as a group took over the American government and news media?

Whether or not your puny brain can comprehend it, there are so many Jews, of so many different backgrounds and organizations, that to say "the Jews  have taken control of the American government and news media" is as stupid as saying "the people with strawberry birthmarks have poisoned the water reservoirs in every state containing a nuclear reactor."

Do you believe that the Russian people as a whole should be shunned and imprisoned because there do exist corrupt Russian politicians and oligarchs?

I confess that I'd be very happy if the next national news story featured YOUR death or disappearance.  Particularly if it turned out to involve white slavery.
------------
"In terms of both hyperbolic overreaching and eventual wrongness, the Permanent [Republican] Majority has set a new, and truly difficult to beat, standard." --rusty
[ Parent ]

your refusal to notice only condemns you, fucko (1.00 / 3) (#195)
by Peahippo on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 02:01:41 AM EST

These are hardly extraordinary claims. They only seem extraordinary to the sheep who have been well trained by the United States media system ... which -- it is not difficult to discover -- is overly dominated by Jews. What a coincidence!

So go grab another movie, news magazine, newspaper and another website, and continue to ignore the Cohens, Greenbergs and so on that figure prominently on the mastheads and credits ... and tell yourself that you actually understand anything, despite the enormous "DO NOT NOTICE THE JEWS" message that has been constantly been flashed before your eyes since the day you were born. The Jewish viewpoint (characterized as: religious, intellectual, mercantile, monetary, urban and anti-Arab) is the "fnords" in most media.

But you wouldn't know that. You refuse to see the "fnords". See, the following is apparently an empty block of text for you:

FNORD
COHEN
FNORD
GREENBERG
FNORD
KAHAN
FNORD
SILVERMAN
FNORD

"Extraordinary claims"! {snort} You are only indulging in willful ignorance, while the rest of the civilized world is basically waking up to the fact of excessive Jewish influence upon the West. Iraq, anyone? (Iraq invasions #1 AND #2.) 2 to 6 billion dollars don't flow to Israel from the US Congress every year just due to some accident, do they? It all has to do with controls behind the scenes, and enforced by the thought police who chant "anti-Semites must die".

And you've swallowed the Big Lie about it hook, line and sinker. Dolt. There's little else so amusing as watching the big-L Liberals squirming once someone uses the "J word".


[ Parent ]
Congratulations! (none / 0) (#215)
by rpresser on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:03:25 PM EST

You've just earned an automatic -1 to any story of yours, and 0 to any post of yours.

You didn't provide any evidence, merely insulted me over and over.

I can only conclude that you are trolling, and that you get an extra point from your troll masters for each mm HG of blood pressure raised. Well, you got a few dozen from me, but no longer.

Adieu.
------------
"In terms of both hyperbolic overreaching and eventual wrongness, the Permanent [Republican] Majority has set a new, and truly difficult to beat, standard." --rusty
[ Parent ]

Throw in a little oil .. (none / 0) (#111)
by hebertrich on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:56:13 PM EST

Dont even dare to mention the protocols of the Elders of Zion :) You will be crucified :D If you ever read the texts , you will see that all this is part of the plan .. keep people happy to be morons while the real game goes on .. mainly .. real power .. real authority let the small people play their little games.. meanwhile , they have won and that's all the loosers deserve .. shit news :D AHEM .. No coverage for the takeover of the planet is necessary .. nor any type of any kind of analysis .. Thank you .. Read between the lines and laugh :)

[ Parent ]
We must protect hot white chicks at all costs (2.33 / 9) (#39)
by nlscb on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 04:09:36 PM EST

Why do you hate America?

Comment Search has returned - Like a beaten wife, I am pathetically grateful. - mr strange

If you think that's hot I'd hate to see your fugly (2.00 / 2) (#123)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:32:29 PM EST

No Telling

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
I think we have to put things in perspective (2.71 / 7) (#44)
by stuaart on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 06:01:14 PM EST

I mean, we need to weigh up the fact that the major American news channels are probably the worst examples of reasonable journalism in the western hemisphere. Here in the UK we complain about the BBC's claim of impartiality, but in my experience of channels like CNN and Fox, impartiality is not a word that is known, and sensationalism seems to be the default presentation style.

Linkwhore: [Hidden stories.] Baldrtainment: Corporate concubines and Baldrson: An Introspective


I See Two Main Culprits (2.80 / 10) (#50)
by dcm266 on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 08:06:23 PM EST

Hey,

I read through your post and thought it was well thought out overall. I don't much care about the story either, and not because I'm heartless. I just see no use getting upset about every tragedy that occurs. This idea has been around for awhile and has been mentioned by Marcus Aurelius and in the Christian "Serenity Prayer," and it is that rather than worrying about things, you should determine whether or not you can do anything about it. If you can, then you can feel good for taking action, and if you can't, then feeling bad will not solve the problem. Marcus Aurelius and the Christians put the idea much more eloquently, but I want to move on to the topic at hand. Thanks for saying that you don't care, as I find the honesty refreshing.

I think this case is a fine demonstation of exactly what is wrong with the media in the United States. Of course, you can't just scapegoat the media. Here's the problem. You're right that while this is a terrible tragedy that we would not like to see happen, it doesn't merit constant news time. Very few things do. That having been said, the media is doing this because it gets attention, ratings, and sales. It's part of an inherent conflict of interest that the media faces between what it should be doing, namely reporting the facts and giving us an objective view on the world, or at least having each side admit their biases, and of course making profit. There's no easy way out of this, unfortunately.

Still, I don't just blame the media. I also have to blame the American people. Why? The media knows what sells, and this sort of thing sells and gets attention all too well. Still, it wouldn't sell if the public wasn't so interested in this sort of thing. So it goes both ways. This isn't the place for a long rant on the state of our society which I would happily write, so I'll leave my post as is for now, blaming the conflict of interest in the media and the American public for what we see on our television screens.

-dcm266

+1 FP (3.00 / 3) (#52)
by mtrisk on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 10:05:28 PM EST

Captured my sentiments exactly.

Of course, I don't really watch TV at all, and I get my news from the BBC most of the time, so I don't have your problem. But when I headed over to CNN's home page and saw that pretty white girl headlining, I thought, "Fuck that." Plenty of young people go missing every year, why the hell do the media outlets in the U.S. insist on telling us all about this one girl? Damn the media, damn them all.

______
"If you don't like our country, why don't you get out?"
"What, and become a victim of your foreign policy?"

To be fair... (none / 0) (#53)
by benna on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 11:19:56 PM EST

They do pick 2 or 3 of them each year.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
BBC isn't imune to worthless fluff stories (none / 0) (#72)
by godix on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:27:03 AM EST

Look at their treatment of the Michael Jackson case for example, they went right along with the media frenzy on that one.

I personally find I need several news outlets to keep a relatively sane perspective on the news. Drugereport gives me a good run up to what the next media fluff story and for the very rare times I care it makes it easy to follow. Google news gives me a wide variety of things and fluff usually only has a marginal impact on it, I already knew about all four alternate stories mentioned in the article because of google news. BBC gives me a less US centric view of the news and occasionally they'll go into much more detail on non-mainstream stories than the paragraph or two that AP gives them. And finally K5 gives me, very occasionally, a decent laugh. Not as often as Kos does but OTOH it doesn't make me draw back in revulsion as often as Kos does either.


- An egotist is someone who thinks they're almost as good as I am.
[ Parent ]

i don't have a problem with the story (2.07 / 14) (#55)
by circletimessquare on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 01:31:00 AM EST

i just have a problem with people loudly and shrilly claiming they don't care. it doesn't ring true

be honest, you do care: you hate

and that's ok too, to hate white chicks in jeopardy all over the "news", i don't have a problem with that. i'm just asking you to be honest about your feelings

Have you ever heard of her?

to be honest with you, i had to read the story to remember. so maybe your problem is you watch fox news all day. there are many "solutions" to your problem, but a sure one is to stop using the news source you are using. it's just like social conservatives complaining about violence or sex on tv: if you don't like it, just turn off the fucking tv

so you have to be more honest about the painfully obvious about how you feel, and you have to do the braindead obvious to solve your "problem"

i mean what do you expect? it's sensationalism. this is nothing new, it's as old as yellow journalism, if not older. open up a newspaper from the 1880s and see how much has really changed. i highly suggest you readjust your understanding of what to expect from your commercial news sources

what are you going to do? establish a news adequacy board?

now you're as bad as the social conservatives

just change your sources of news man, and stop, pardon the pun, getting your panties all twisted in a knot

it's ok to vent, just don't be surpised that the response to your venting might be blood simple: getting hysterical because of hysteria doesn't make it go away, it just amps it up


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

It's more a matter of *what* is hated. (3.00 / 9) (#58)
by mjfgates on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:22:26 AM EST

The young woman in question? I bet he <i>doesn't</i> care. One person getting killed in a place whose name I'd never heard before except on Bugs Bunny cartoons? I don't care either.

The phenomenon where fluff completely displaces serious news? That, he can hate, and oh yes, I hate it too. I spent a few weeks wondering whether all that Schiavo nonsense was a deliberate screen for passing a truly evil federal budget before I realized that this kind of pointless crap gets more airtime than the real events of the week, EVERY week.

[ Parent ]

i hear you, now listen to what i am saying: (2.25 / 4) (#63)
by circletimessquare on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:48:44 AM EST

sensational journalism is a static state

it's been with us for decades if not centuries, it will be with us for centuries more

you can't change the media, because the media simply reflects what people want to hear about

people always complain the media, BUT THE MEDIA IS NOT THE PROBLEM, IT'S THE PEOPLE

the media feeds us massive informations about the state of the relationship between tom cruise and katie holmes for example

i don't care, i know you don't care BUT SOMEBODY DOES

so you either bemoan the state of humanity and the stupid crap it cares about, or you make peace with it and listen to npr or bbc like i do, and move the fuck on

fact: you're NOT going to change the media, because you're NOT going to change human nature from caring about stupid shit

in fact, i can't do that because i would feel hypocritical: there's a lot of shit i care aobut that a few other people care aobut, and few others, and i know they would laugh at me if i divulged that subculture i was a part of, but that's not the point: i've made peace with the fact that my passions aren't everyone else's passions, so i won't bemoan the fact that a lot of people care about what i think is some really stupid shit, and i won't pass judgment on them because then i would be asking them to draw judgment on the stupid crap i care about

capisce?

so make peace with the stupidity of yellow journalims, and move on

and stop wasting your emotions on crap you can't change

people pay attention to stupid crap, little birds like shiny objects

welcome to reality, accept it, move the fuck on

The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

[ Parent ]

Never heard of her (1.22 / 9) (#66)
by Armada on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:32:09 AM EST

Never heard of this girl before you wrote the story on it. And you're right, I don't care about her.

The Chinese government is looking to buy Unocal, an American oil company

NASA has fired a "robotic bullet" at a comet to help study cometary makeup and origins

Kurdish guerillas bombed two trains in Turkey, increasing tensions between that nation and northern Iraq

Spain has legalized gay marriage

What I were to tell you that these stories don't interest me either?

I've heard enough about "world news" that it makes me sick. As a USian, I imagine I get the "typically American scum" remarks, and probably deserve them. But then again, I'm also against the US getting involved in nearly every friggen international incident that gets reported in English. As if my tax dollars are supposed to be taking care of civil war or "insurgents" in another country.

Here's an idea: give me back the money and I'll invest it to make more. Then, as time goes on, I'll see fit to donate to charitable programs both national and international. I always thought it'd be great to give back to the community, but as it is now, I can't fucking afford to. Why the hell does the US government think they are the only ones that can donate to charity?

If China's ascendence at the hands of the US (3.00 / 2) (#124)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:42:13 PM EST

doesn't make a dent in your dim little mind then I'm afraid that you're a complete waste of perfectly good oxygen and nutrients.

Your failure to grasp that as a basic US-ian issue is pathetic.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]

Is it only China? (none / 0) (#241)
by jfb3 on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 08:06:34 AM EST

Or, would you care if the Italian company that was looking to get Unocal actually bid? Would you care if it were BP? How about Shell? (In other words are you generically xenophobic or just anti-asian racist?)

[ Parent ]
Neither (none / 0) (#281)
by destroy all monsters on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 07:31:41 AM EST

Nice Troll

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
Not a troll (none / 0) (#288)
by jfb3 on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 01:54:56 PM EST

Actually not trolling. I really wanted to know. But since you don't have a coherent answer, maybe you are...

[ Parent ]
If this is not a troll: (none / 0) (#297)
by destroy all monsters on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:06:30 PM EST

"In other words are you generically xenophobic or just anti-asian racist?" then you are just a moron.

There are a multitude of reasons why this is a bad thing. That you haven't even bothered to think of the negative implications shows you have a pencil-headed world view.  

But I'm not going to go into details for someone so stupid as to classify this issue as either racist or xenophobic and worse to ascribe them as personal beliefs. Next time pull your head out of your ass and read someone's comment history before making yourself look like a complete idiot. Jackass.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]

If China takes over from the US (none / 0) (#294)
by monkeymind on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 05:06:43 PM EST

As the world's tough guy there will be little effect on the rest of the world.

I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people and assume the deserve it.
[ Parent ]

Cos the U.S. and China are interchangeable (none / 0) (#318)
by destroy all monsters on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:12:39 AM EST

Right?

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
To most of the rest of the world, yes. [nt] (none / 0) (#337)
by monkeymind on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 09:55:47 PM EST


I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people and assume the deserve it.
[ Parent ]

Especially to Taiwan and Tibet I'm sure [n/t] (none / 0) (#350)
by destroy all monsters on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 11:43:19 AM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
or cuba or iraq or palestine [nt] (none / 0) (#357)
by monkeymind on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 04:52:42 PM EST


I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people and assume the deserve it.
[ Parent ]

Thanks for proving my point that (none / 0) (#360)
by destroy all monsters on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 10:05:16 PM EST

nations don't see us and China as the same.

Not that I'm holding the pom-poms for this administration.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]

+1, FP (3.00 / 3) (#76)
by diocletian on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 08:20:57 AM EST

Questions mass media.
_____________________________________

simple empathy is my motivation ~ circletimessquare

You miss the point (2.12 / 8) (#77)
by A Bore on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 08:44:29 AM EST

Natalee is not merely a mundane physical person to be drawn and quartered by the news media and at home viewer for their entertainment. By focussing entirely on her very ordinariness you miss the true reasons why there has been such a focus on her mysterious disappearance.

Natalee is a symbol. She is America. And America has lost itself. This is the single unifying thought in the unconscious of the viewers and content providers subconscious.

America has lost herself in drinking bars and holidays abroad. She has lost herself fraternising with the wrong people; people she assumed she could trust; people who took advantage of her naivety. Now America must be found, or mourned. Everyone should be interested in this story on that basis.

Bah. (2.91 / 12) (#101)
by Kasreyn on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:56:44 PM EST

Fuck America. So America has lost itself, so what? All it needs to do to find itself is find the honesty to look at itself in the mirror and confront the truth.

America could find itself again whenever it wanted to. That's the entire point. America doesn't *want* to find itself. Being dazed and confused is such a great excuse for all the evil shit we're doing.


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
I'd rate this 100 if I could [nt] (none / 0) (#107)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:18:30 PM EST



[ Parent ]
America Is Lost (3.00 / 4) (#177)
by Mousky on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:24:23 PM EST

America has lost it's way. Seesh, everytime a small plane crosses into the no-fly zone over DC, buildings are evacuated. Wimps. Your forefathers had the balls to declare independence and fought a war and two to prove they were serious. Today, Americans have been brainwashed into believing that the security of the nation is all that matters; that spending more money, adding more obstacles such as requiring Americans to have passports to reenter their own country and slowly curbing your freedoms here and there will lead to a secure country. Want a secure country? Stop making enemies.

[ Parent ]
Why do you hate yourself? (none / 0) (#208)
by A Bore on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 11:25:03 AM EST

Your attitude is the most sickening. "I know we do great evil - I do nothing about it but wail and moan here and there about how terrible it all is." At least the others believe what they do is right - you know its wrong yet do nothing but hide behind this cloak of plain-speaking contrariness.

[ Parent ]
Yep yep, I do nothing. (none / 1) (#213)
by Kasreyn on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:47:10 PM EST

Also, my name in real life is actually Kasreyn! Really! So you see, you already know everything there is to know about me!


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
If Natalee is America (none / 1) (#125)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:45:21 PM EST

then we should target our nukes at ourselves now and start the countdown so that we can put ourselves out of our misery.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
I don't give a flying fig (2.85 / 7) (#80)
by mike3k on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 11:25:19 AM EST

Why is the life of a white girl from america more important than the other thousands of people who die every day?

Dude, she's Dutch. (none / 0) (#117)
by fury on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:34:45 PM EST

Not American. Dutch. Dutch 17 year olds are so much hotter than American 17 year olds.
Kevin Fox - fury.com
[ Parent ]
Oops, my bad. (none / 0) (#118)
by fury on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:37:06 PM EST

That's what I get for not watching CNNBCBS 24/7.
Kevin Fox - fury.com
[ Parent ]
Yeah... (none / 0) (#186)
by debillitatus on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:28:38 PM EST

You should've known that, because her name isn't Naatalije Holliewoordeveld

Damn you and your daily doubles, you brigand!
[ Parent ]

What the hell? (3.00 / 5) (#81)
by djkitsch on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 11:33:45 AM EST

WARNING: SHAMELESS RANT

I live in the UK. We have a national broadcasting corporation, as well as several other commercial ones (including those owned by Mr Murdoch), all of whom fight for ratings. And yet, even on days when Prince Harry's girlfriend can make the front page, I can *still* check out most US news outlets' websites and find at least 3 things that make me go "Huh? Whu?"

I'm aware that many individual Americans are great people, intelligent and good. It's just that I'm never-endingly dumbfounded with America taken as a social group. I will reiterate - Huh? Whu?

And what the hell is Peahippo on about halfway up this page? I'm Jewish and I wish I had a stake in the media outlets that are apparently run by my fellow Jews. Then I wouldn't owe $25k and live in a shitty rented apartment. Fuckwit. Write to the Oxford English Dictionary and see if you can get "niggernews" added (nb: his word, not mine).
-------------------------
sig:- (wit >= sarcasm)

We feel the same way... (none / 0) (#96)
by Skywise on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:44:46 PM EST

The reason Fox news got so popular over here wasn't and isn't because it's a bastion of good reporting.  It's because the existing news services were so much watered down drek giving the same point of view that anything different was just a joy to behold.

[ Parent ]
And there I thought.... (none / 0) (#384)
by MKalus on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 02:16:21 PM EST

.... Fox News was a Satire......
-- Michael
[ Parent ]
Peahippo is a racist (none / 1) (#148)
by HollyHopDrive on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 05:12:48 AM EST

Ignore him. Sorry you had to run into him.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Yeah, I got that (none / 0) (#156)
by djkitsch on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:11:19 AM EST

Well, obviously. It just really gets on my tits how anyone with half a brain can not only be so dumb, but actually not realise how they make themselves look. I mean, Jesus, if you're going to post a racist rant involving racist words of your own invention, why would you do it on a mostly liberal weblog like K5? You're not exactly going to find loads of supporters, are you?

My apologies - this gets me worked up.

-------------------------
sig:- (wit >= sarcasm)
[ Parent ]

Peahippo does not have half a brain (none / 0) (#159)
by HollyHopDrive on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:22:26 AM EST

His brain, in fact, would rattle in a gnat's skull. Most kurons, with a few exceptions such as Baldrson or community icon, realise that. But I don't blame you for getting upset about it.

Actually, it's fortunate. Peahippo demonstrates himself, perfectly, without a trace of irony, why tired old anti-Semitic tirades about JOOZ RULING TEH WORLD are so fucking stupid. You needn't discredit him because he's done the job impeccably already.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

possible motivation (none / 1) (#172)
by tjw on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 04:51:48 PM EST

I mean, Jesus, if you're going to post a racist rant involving racist words of your own invention, why would you do it on a mostly liberal weblog like K5? You're not exactly going to find loads of supporters, are you?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

[ Parent ]
Incorrect. (3.00 / 2) (#185)
by debillitatus on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:25:52 PM EST

Peahippo is a douchebag.

Damn you and your daily doubles, you brigand!
[ Parent ]

Wha? Huh? (1.00 / 6) (#415)
by TeamAmerica on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:11:08 PM EST

You're Jewish and flabbergasted by the actions of Americans? How quickly you forget; or maybe you're just blinded by ignorance. My grandfather should have left your slut grandmother at Auschwitz, you brainless piece of shit.

[ Parent ]
Look on the bright side... (3.00 / 6) (#82)
by sharkfish on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 11:51:46 AM EST

Brown people can go pretty much anywhere in the world and because the media won't pay any attention, so there will be fewer kidnappings.
...what happened to all the IT jobs?
however... (none / 0) (#686)
by toot4u on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 02:52:07 PM EST

yes but if it's connected the white slavery issue then why would they be kidnapping 'brown' skinned people?

[ Parent ]
I am ashamed this title was published here (1.78 / 19) (#84)
by StephenThompson on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 12:16:15 PM EST

This person has had her name dragged through the mud yet again. Realize she is not responsible for her name being used by the vultures in the national media to make money. Then you come here and say "fuck" her. Well fuck you buddy. You want someone to blame, say "Fuck the Media" or somesuch, but to drag a (probably) dead girls name through the dirt while she still has family and friend to come here and read that title is totally thoughtless and callous. We have no right.

Pardon my cynicism (3.00 / 6) (#91)
by paranoid on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:14:45 PM EST

She's got enough good positive coverage to balance the occasional "Fuck Natalee" headline. Furthermore, she seems to be dead now or something and I don't think she read Kuro5hin while she was alive. She doesn't care. As for her friends and family, chances are they aren't looking online for her name either.

[ Parent ]
Haha (3.00 / 2) (#109)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:21:40 PM EST

I would shit my pants laughing if this ended up being the #1 search result on Google for Natalee Holloway. In fact:

Natalee Holloway Natalee Holloway Natalee Holloway Natalee Holloway Natalee Holloway



[ Parent ]
ummm. not yet (none / 1) (#115)
by shm on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:10:51 PM EST

But this is close. Warning, there be rude stuff here.

[ Parent ]
Not that rude (at least not compared to K5) [nt] (none / 0) (#119)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 05:19:02 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Oh comon! (none / 1) (#95)
by SlashDread on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:42:40 PM EST

His first paragraph explains he means the <i>story</i> not the girl. And did you really think he was going to talk about how miss Holoway is fucked when you read the title?

[ Parent ]
I don't fuck dead chicks. [nt] (1.50 / 2) (#110)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:22:21 PM EST



[ Parent ]
You should give it a try (2.00 / 3) (#132)
by godix on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 10:20:32 PM EST

They won't yell rape, unlike the live chicks.


- An egotist is someone who thinks they're almost as good as I am.
[ Parent ]
fuck natalee (1.50 / 2) (#133)
by crazy canuck on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 10:36:42 PM EST

fuck her up her stupid dead flabby ass

[ Parent ]
Bleah (none / 0) (#235)
by gbd on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 11:46:21 PM EST

I've explained the rationale behind the title many times now. I was trying to make a point, not to be as tasteful as possible.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]
Natalee Holloway is hot (2.50 / 6) (#86)
by ubu on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 12:44:50 PM EST

C'mon. That is a hot little girl. I'm pissed.


--
As good old software hats say - "You are in very safe hands, if you are using CVS !!!"
Why I can't watch CNN any longer (2.80 / 10) (#87)
by CaptainZapp on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 01:04:53 PM EST

CNN, MSNBC, and (especially) Fox News feature hourly updates on the status of the investigation.

No disrespect to the missing girl and certainly no disrespect to the 3000 9/11 victims and their loved ones. But it was 9/11, which did it for me.

In essence: something really, really dramatic happens. You have 24 hour coverage of that dramatic topic. Every self declared 6th rate "terrorism expert" (but you may insert any "expert", which matches the news subject du jour) is dragged in front of a TV camera and spews garbage. In essence you are not supplied with news, but with a barrage of shit and a snazzy logo.

It's not that I ignore such breaking news, but I rather get it from a reputable paper then from a fucking TV station, spewing garbage for 72 hours with no interruption (except the ads, of course), while supplying precious little actual information.

I didn't watch CNN since that faithful day, because I just can't stomach the bullshit.

Thankfully Fox news, which - from all I read - is a third rate propaganda outfit, which makes the good old Soviet Pravda a quality paper in comparision, is not receivable in the sticks where I live.

To summarize: If a news outfit is just spewing shit, presented by a preppy youngster/youngstress who hasn't a fucking clue and the only purpose is to sell more expensive ads to the shee^H^H^H^H public I rather spend quality time in the next Whisky bar, while enjoying a Havanna cigar.

It's less frustrating too.

Simpler example of broken media... (3.00 / 3) (#143)
by Gooba42 on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 03:28:28 AM EST

On 9/11/2001 where was the Emergency Broadcast System?

In California now it goes off for every Amber Alert which is even remotely in my area but I don't know a single person who heard it go off on 9/11.

If an actual attack on the country doesn't warrant an Emergency Broadcast, what in the hell does?

[ Parent ]

Best thing about the case (2.96 / 29) (#88)
by The Diary Section on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 01:05:16 PM EST

Best interview evar on MSNBC

Blonde Presenterette (BP): So, the FBI have gone to Aruba?

Former FBI Pundit (FFP): Indeed, I understand they landed sometime yesterday and are in the process of setting themselves up.

BP: So, the FBI are taking over the investigation...

FFP: Erm, no, I expect they'll be offering their assistance with forensics and of course their databases.

BP: Really? Are the FBI being blocked from taking over the investigation?

FFP: Er, I understand the authorities are keen to liase but I guess we'll see.

BP: Surely the FBI lead the world in investigations of this type? What justification is there for their taking a backseat?

FFP: [long pause, sound of the penny dropping] They are there as visitors not as , er actually card carrying law enforement officials. Aruba is a Dutch dependency, the FBI don't have official powers there as they do in the United States.

BP: [longer pause] Oh, I suppose thats an important point. Thank you.
Spend 10 minutes in the company of an American and you end up feeling like a Keats or a Shelley: Thin, brilliant, suave, and desperate for industrial-scale quantities of opium.

Xenophobic jingoism, or The Ugly American at Home (3.00 / 3) (#140)
by hershmire on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 02:21:54 AM EST

That's another point. A lot of this obsessive news coverage relates to the fact that she disappeared in a foreign land. The general inane emotion the news agencies are appealing to is patriotism*. This is a shining example of American fear and distrust of foreigners, even the "good guy" cops of Aruba, and "by God those Aruban bastards better not fsck this investigation up for us," "That's an American over there!", etc. etc.

You can glean a sense of this when they report some obscure airliner crash in a far-off place killing 150 people and then immediately state there was x Americans aboard.

*see where Fox news has a stake? It's target audiences holds this as a "core value."
FIXME: Insert quote about procrastination
[ Parent ]
Not unique (none / 0) (#149)
by warrax on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 05:56:59 AM EST

You can glean a sense of this when they report some obscure airliner crash in a far-off place killing 150 people and then immediately state there was x Americans aboard.
This is not unique to the US media. It always leaves a bad taste in my mouth when they do this. (I can understand that it may be relevant in cases where the victims are difficult to identify, but that's probably the vast minority of cases.)

-- "Guns don't kill people. I kill people."
[ Parent ]
nothing particularly American about that (none / 1) (#178)
by Delirium on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:06:32 PM EST

See, for example:
  • The Australian media coverage of that woman who got caught smuggling drugs into Indonesia. Lots of Australians were saying they now regret donating money to the tsunami victims, and there's a general tone of "goddamn third-world countries and their shitty justice systems, this would never happen in good old Australia!"
  • Every BBC story on an airliner crash reports the number of UK citizens killed.


[ Parent ]
Monkeys in the trees (3.00 / 4) (#189)
by blackpaw on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:58:47 PM EST

Did you hear that gem on the radio - a talk back host (Alan Jones I think) actually was refering to the judges as "Monkey's just down from the trees" and a lot more in that vein, I couldn't belive my ears. He also thought they were idiots because they didn't speak english in the court room - its a fucking foreign country ! A lot of his listeners were agreeable to his remarks, it was intensly disturbing, I hadn't heard such ignorant, raw and public racism ever.

[ Parent ]
Every time I read this transcript.. (3.00 / 2) (#199)
by SlashDread on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 05:36:07 AM EST

It scares the bejeezus outta of me more. Frigging superioritists. (Not all of you ussians ;-) some are really nice, see the nude PETAians running in Pamplona)

[ Parent ]
If you don't mind... (none / 0) (#236)
by Sarcasmooo on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 01:07:55 AM EST

Would you happen to have an exact quote I could google, or the name of the interviewee so that I could search MSNBC transcripts? I'd like to save this exchange, but it loses credible-oomph when it's through the grape vine. Thanks in advance if you have any info.

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
Its from memory (none / 0) (#240)
by The Diary Section on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 07:06:09 AM EST

so it may be entirely accurate but on the other hand I wasn't making it up. A little license perhaps but it wasn't my intention to misrepresent the exchange. It was some time between the 10th and 15th, I know because I was in DC on business; I'm not actually an American.
Spend 10 minutes in the company of an American and you end up feeling like a Keats or a Shelley: Thin, brilliant, suave, and desperate for industrial-scale quantities of opium.
[ Parent ]
Oh... (none / 0) (#252)
by Sarcasmooo on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 02:13:56 PM EST

Oh I watch enough TV news to know you weren't making it up. I just like to save really horrible little tidbits like that and being able to find a transcript would be better.

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
Columnist from the MEDIA comments (3.00 / 2) (#90)
by sharkfish on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 01:11:04 PM EST

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/chi-0507040162jul04,1,2419015.colu mn?coll=chi-news-hed&ctrack=1&cset=true

She thinks it is the "Damsel in Distress" syndrome and non-blondes from the inner city do not qualify for the role.

What a culture have we.


...what happened to all the IT jobs?

won't load, error -nt (none / 1) (#99)
by Kasreyn on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:53:37 PM EST

nt
"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
Try this (none / 0) (#113)
by shm on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:03:31 PM EST

The original had a s pace in the wrong p lace. You still need to register though. Or use Bugmenot.

[ Parent ]
bugmenot account (none / 1) (#116)
by sharkfish on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:20:58 PM EST

noaccount@mailinator.com
noaccount
...what happened to all the IT jobs?
[ Parent ]
Remember the OJ trial? (2.94 / 18) (#93)
by shm on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:38:02 PM EST

This is similar.

Free script,
tragic bimbo,
appropriately coloured villain(s),
no actors need apply,
free e[r|x]otic sets,
what more could Mr Producer want?

As a bonus, it happened in A Foreign Land. Bring out the Flag. Send in the Marines. Blame the Eye-raak-ies. Outsource the databases. Sign up for collective counselling and grief sessions. Sue someone!

Ah, good, good stuff for ratings.

smirk (2.75 / 8) (#94)
by eleusis on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:40:46 PM EST

I love how..

- you assume that anyone who doesn't "follow the news media in the United States, particular the 24-hour cable stations" is automatically someone who 'lives in a cave'. Hey, maybe if you don't like it outside the cave.. come back in, with the rest of us? :P
- you only want 'real' news (i.e. none of this so-called 'non-news') that are of "actual importance to the daily lives of Americans" that includes 1) alleged terrorist bombings in Turkey, 2) legalisation of gay marriage in Spain.

On the other hand, I'm really wondering how the hell an F16 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F16) is going to help in finding a single missing person. I mean, a jet. Flying at what, Mach 0.5? Kilometres above the ground? Maybe it's really a covert test for an ultra-high-resolution-x-ray-facial-recognition system...
§:)

Recon planes (none / 0) (#120)
by cherberos on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 06:03:29 PM EST

They are specially equipped recon planes, with some ir-camara's and stuff. Here in the Netherlands those same planes were used for this purpose before.

On the story about this Natalee: it is indeed quite ridiculous. If I didn't know any Americans personally, I would think you were completely mad.
The funny thing is: here the coverage is more about the media-frenzy the Americans make out of it :)

[ Parent ]

Americans crazy? (1.20 / 5) (#417)
by TeamAmerica on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 04:14:50 PM EST

Go back to the Grasshopper, smoke another bowl, shoot up some more junk, and then finish fucking your 15 year old male prostitute. You Dutch crack me up with your moralless, Godless existence. You haven't had a quality export since that crazy motherfucker cut his ear off.

[ Parent ]
pretty much (none / 0) (#289)
by mpalczew on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:46:20 PM EST

this is the first I hear of it.  I chose not to watch crap.  I don't really understand why someone would watch faux news that didn't like it.
-- Death to all Fanatics!
[ Parent ]
F16 (none / 0) (#414)
by TeamAmerica on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:06:30 PM EST

They've been using them to find mass graves in Eastern Europe for the past 15 years, dumbass.

[ Parent ]
Her father.. (3.00 / 2) (#100)
by SlashDread on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 02:56:17 PM EST

.. is connected to Bush says the grape vine in the Netherlands.

Got a link? (none / 0) (#135)
by LodeRunner on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 12:44:04 AM EST

Now that would make the story marginally interesting.

---
"dude, you can't even spell your own name" -- Lode Runner
[ Parent ]

Only in Dutch to a blog (none / 1) (#150)
by SlashDread on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 06:06:42 AM EST

Not very usefull, the comment went like this: "Sources say Natalee's father is connected to G.W. Bush"
Another rumour: "Natalee has ran away before twice, and had a troubled relationship with her mother"

In Dutch: http://blog.lachicamerengue.com/archives/000895.html

I read the Bush connection before in quality newspaper "NRC Handelsblad."

Brownie points to the people finding the connection, or confirming the runways of Natalee before.

Not to say she ran away... The boys interrogated over this have changed their story halfway, usually a pretty guilty sign.
Hope the enigma clears up, hope the story fades from fox.
In The Netherlands this is a page 6 story by now.

[ Parent ]

to slashdread (none / 0) (#193)
by veasun on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:12:14 AM EST

Ah......... so THIS may explain the Texass BBQs they had as fund raiser for the Twitty's. Oh god, next we will be looking for WMDs in Aruba.

[ Parent ]
And also... (1.30 / 13) (#104)
by Pat Chalmers on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 03:06:07 PM EST

...fuck Bill O'Reilly and fuck the USA as a whole.

NUKE THE USA
 NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE A LIFE

So, you must be anti-abortion then? (none / 0) (#131)
by porkchop_d_clown on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 09:38:19 PM EST

Since no one has the right to take another's life?

How many trolls could a true troll troll if a true troll could troll trolls?
[ Parent ]
uhhhh (none / 0) (#141)
by QuantumG on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 02:24:10 AM EST

define "another's".

Gun fire is the sound of freedom.
[ Parent ]
You pick on that? (none / 1) (#142)
by Shajenko on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 03:18:32 AM EST

Why do you concentrate on abortion, when he flat out says "Nuke the USA", an action that is guaranteed to kill countless innocents?

[ Parent ]
Not necessarily. (none / 1) (#160)
by NoMoreNicksLeft on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:05:59 AM EST

He could be planning to ship all US residents to Chile before commencing the nuking. Duh. MMM, chilean grapes...

--
Do not look directly into laser with remaining good eye.
[ Parent ]
Dear sir, (none / 0) (#308)
by trhurler on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:38:47 PM EST

Please do nuke the USA. We will nuke you in return, and there will be nothing left on earth. It'll be fun.

--
'God dammit, your posts make me hard.' --LilDebbie

[ Parent ]
Fuck yeah Road Warrior here we come [n/t] (none / 0) (#317)
by destroy all monsters on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:12:01 AM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
There was a little girl... (none / 0) (#112)
by bhearsum on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:01:16 PM EST

There was a little girl in Toronto that disappeared a couple years ago, Cecilia Zhang. As soon as it happened there was all sorts of police reports and amber alerts, search parties, tons of media coverage. This went on for weeks. While reading through the paper throughout those weeks I saw reports of other children missing, tucked away in the corner. Why does this girl get special treatment?

simple (1.50 / 1) (#219)
by j1mmy on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:15:14 PM EST

she was a princess

[ Parent ]
Because (none / 0) (#249)
by Ken Arromdee on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 01:17:08 PM EST

Because, as clearly stated in so many other posts, the media only cares about white girls.

[ Parent ]
she was asian (none / 0) (#344)
by crustacean on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 05:30:04 AM EST


Will take to the forest before the oil overlords annex Canada.
[ Parent ]
here you go... (none / 0) (#114)
by sharkfish on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 04:04:19 PM EST

article

bugmenot username: noaccount@mailinator.com


bugmenot password: noaccount
...what happened to all the IT jobs?

A Primary Difference (none / 1) (#127)
by destroy all monsters on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 07:07:33 PM EST

between this case and that of Reyna Alvarado-Carrera is that Carrera's is a family abduction case. This is necessarily stickier (and she's also less likely to be dead).

A caveat to be made though is that a co-worker of mine's wife was killed by a cousin of his that was staying at the house. Family can be dicey to say the least.

As far as Natalee and her gawdawful name is concerned I direct you to this: http://www.misanthropic-bitch.com/briandrye.html

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice

huh? (none / 0) (#137)
by orestes on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 01:11:08 AM EST

the carrera link says non-family abduction.

[ You Sad Bastard ]
[ Parent ]
I didn't see the word (none / 0) (#147)
by destroy all monsters on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 05:11:07 AM EST

"non". Still I can't believe that you'd put it as a "non family abduction". Abduction seems clear enough. Then again I keep forgetting that in this country "inflammable" has come from it's correct meaning as not flammable to flammable in my lifetime.

So yeah, I lose a point for reading it too quickly and stupidity wins a point for terminology.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]

Inflammable (none / 0) (#209)
by fairthought on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 11:43:39 AM EST

Sorry, inflammable has never meant "not flammable", although it looks like it might. The "in" prefix here is an intensifier rather than a negation. The word is related to inflame and inflammation which are not usually confused to mean "not to set on fire" and "not burning".

[ Parent ]
I looked it up and I stand corrected (none / 0) (#212)
by destroy all monsters on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:39:33 PM EST

Of all the pedantic things my parents taught me to be wrong... :P

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
Damn English language... (none / 0) (#228)
by Shajenko on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 08:04:21 PM EST

Can't keep from making contradictions...

[ Parent ]
I agreed (none / 0) (#130)
by Redcatblack on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 08:46:03 PM EST

Here.

They only care because she is pretty. Hence the news decides we should care.

All my views in that same diary (none / 0) (#153)
by HollyHopDrive on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:27:30 AM EST

and I can't be bothered to repeat them.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Really? (none / 0) (#538)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 12:08:36 PM EST

It's not the media, its the public. The media wants money, the public fuel it. Think about it, her mom is the one pushing the issue.

[ Parent ]
Well. (none / 1) (#134)
by /dev/trash on Mon Jul 04, 2005 at 11:13:55 PM EST

There are some of us that have heard of her and the other stories you mentioned.  But, yeah the focus on the WHITE young females that go missing is really really odd.

---
Updated 02/20/2004
New Site
Don't Worry (none / 1) (#136)
by clawDATA on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 12:57:12 AM EST

Pictures of her and her new boyfriend will appear on PrivateVoyeur.com soon enough.

Sure it's a good (none / 1) (#138)
by balsamic vinigga on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 01:20:18 AM EST

critique of modern news media.  But get your story straight, on the one hand you express simpathy to nat as well as and abductee, then also say "fuck nat" and that you just don't care about her.

You contradict yourself.  You're trying to be edgy with your shit, but it just looks inconsistent and poorly written to me.  You're bizzare sensationalised rhetorical tactics seem to be mimicing the very thing you're critisizing.

---
Please help fund a Filipino Horror Movie. It's been in limbo since 2007 due to lack of funding. Please donate today!

I would say (1.25 / 4) (#139)
by evilmeow on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 01:36:12 AM EST

..that the whole design of your post is a cleverly disguised way to pick up a random irrelevant topic and gradually turn it into an argument against the rightwing media.

The only problem is it's not really cleverly disguised.

"[O]ne thing is certain: people are certifiably historically myopic"

Shitty news coverage is the only way... (2.84 / 13) (#144)
by Smokin Juan on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 03:47:27 AM EST

... to keep the United States from a bloody civil war right now and I don't imagine that the facade will hold much longer.
The article mentions a few 'other' newsworthy items but really only scratches the surface. How about:
a) Downing Street Memos
b) Plame Rove
c) Eminent Domain
d) Vigilante Minutemen in Tennessee (and how the originals are spinning in their graves)
e) Doctor state/patient-doctor rights trumped by federal law despite the fact that the people voted for that law (prop 215 California) and have never had a chance to actually vote on the "drug war" until they'd been thoroughly fear-mongered. And even then they only voted for it through their pre-nominated figurehead who slipped it into his agenda as an afterthought... who had to resign to avoid impeachment... who was never punished for his high crimes and misdemeanors as the rest of us would've been for merely smoking a spliff.
f) The 2004 televised presidential debates where the candidates of the number 3 and 4 parties were arrested (that's right, two presidential candidates arrested at a presidential debate) for trying to serve papers concerning the validity of presidential campaigns being funded by tax dollars. AND THERE WASN'T A FUCKING PEEP FORM THE MEDIA. Not a single one. If you thought the Iraqi elections held under Hussein were corrupt have a look at the US. Hell, with their very lives at stake the Iraqis had a valid excuse for voting dumbshit. We americans on the other hand voted dumbshit because we're too fucking lazy to think without the TV saying so. And how does that make the US more corrupt than Iraq under Hussein? People in Iraq bit their tongues to spare their lives while people in the US, from the media to the voters to government employees themselves, bite our tongues to save a little face.
g) The real cause of $60 barrel oil.

With news reporting in such a sorry state do you really expect the reporters to do any real investigative work? If they actually reported future changing events rather the Jerry Springer news they'd uncover the certain shitstorm which would leave all of us wondering whether or not it'd be safe to go to work tomorrow... Just like our good pals who we've so valiantly saved from Deceptive Democracy, the Iraqis.

BTW, have you read anything about Yugoslavia lately?

more on g) (none / 0) (#174)
by Rhodes on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:33:18 PM EST

Here is one explanation: What else did you have in mind?

[ Parent ]
Well, yeah, but... (none / 1) (#197)
by Smokin Juan on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:52:37 AM EST

I didn't want to come off as a parnoid conspiracy theorist (peakers still seem to be in that camp) seeing as how there's much other important stuff in that post ;) esp. f) the 2004 election bit. Seriously, why didn't you bite on that one? I really think it's the most telling indicator of media sloth/conspiracy and goes a long way to explain why there are only two valid parties in the US. If you are interested, here's more on the story and a news.google serach for "badarik arrested". In case you're wondering, the google serach turned up null soon after the event too - it's not a caching issue.

So far as oil is concerned I don't really doubt peak theory, but for some reason it just doesn't really exite. Maybe I'm eager to get rid of the oil economy and the shitty side of culture that it's perpetuated. Hence, no fear, no concern. OTOH, if you're into it here's the site to check for Peak Oil discussion.

[ Parent ]
i like responding to things (none / 0) (#218)
by j1mmy on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:13:10 PM EST

a, b, c, and e have been in the major media, but have been treated with kid gloves. a brief overview with no real discussion of the issues involved.

d I hadn't heard of, except for the guys in New Mexico. The Feds could put a halt to immigration almost immediately, but no politician has the guts to deny government services to non-citizens and citizenship to children born in the states to non-citizens.

f was an argument over technicalities in how Arizona State funded the debate. They put up the money initially but it was all backed by private donations to the school. That aside, I still wanted to see Badnarik and Cobb in the debates.

g Peak oil, duh. It's only going to get worse.


[ Parent ]

Me too! (none / 1) (#238)
by Smokin Juan on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 04:58:32 AM EST

a, b, c, d, g, yeah, yeah, yeah...

But you poo-pooed f? You'll never hear Badnarik or Cobb in a debate with that attitude! Which is a shame because, if you listened to their debate, it was far more interesting than then pap regurgitated by the Leading Brand (well, Badnarik was). Granted, the arrest was a technical issue and mostly a publicity stunt (they did try to serve papers at republican and democrat offices prior to the event) but it still drives home the point - the collusion of media and government to subvert the Democratic Republic by censoring those outside the loop.

Think of it this way: Had two leading presidential candidates been arrested in Iraq's elections under Saddam there would've been an immediate and (more so) damning media circuis in the states, but when it comes to our own Deceptive Democracy it's safely swept under the rug.

Hence the topic of the whole conversation, shitty Jerry Springeresque media coverage.

[ Parent ]
did any of you hear (2.50 / 4) (#145)
by auraslip on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 04:05:14 AM EST

about that chubby ugly pasty white little girl that got lost in the woods? Her dad took her picture and photoshopped the fuck out of it to make her teh hottness.
You can damn well believe that they found that girl in no time.

this just happened in the past two months...seriously
124

any details? (none / 1) (#188)
by forgotten on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:37:01 PM EST

her dad deserves a fucking medal for thinking that clearly.

--

[ Parent ]

It's True (3.00 / 4) (#298)
by unknownlamer on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:16:38 PM EST

Family Altered Photo of Missing Child to Get More Help.

I saw it on the local news while I was eating dinner with the family and just spent some time on google news digging a link to an online story about it. Which was hard because it's a few weeks old.



--
<vladl> I am reading the making of the atomic bong - modern science
[ Parent ]
It's Fake (none / 0) (#1070)
by EraseMe on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:23:40 PM EST

Read the other stories on that web site. It's clearly a spoof.

[ Parent ]
nataly who? (1.50 / 4) (#151)
by slaida1 on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:07:27 AM EST

aiiee! you're the real enemy of me, watching, reading, listening, buying and supporting all that crap entertainews and then going around spreading it. if there's a scapegoat here to blame for the awful state of "news" it's all those ordinary gurbby stupid hands, reaching for newest print of their daily entertaining news. hate them.

scold your closest friends and relatives for buying such crap. i do. it's their fault ultimately that i have to tolerate stupid news.

i mean, I'm the real victim here not some random nataly or jessica or kimberly or carol. goddamnit. oh the horror.

(because i'm so much above of those ordinary feeble consumers who support stupid news is what i'm really saying here. they don't deserve their place in this world. i do. because i whine.)

Schapelle Corby (none / 0) (#152)
by ccdotnet on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:15:27 AM EST

Down here (Aust) we've endured a similar media barrage over a pretty young thing called Schapelle Corby. She was caught bang-to-rights with a rather large haul of dope when she arrived in Bali, and the media and public have turned this story into the event of the decade. She escaped the death penalty (prosecution didn't seek it) and received 20 years. Case is now going through the usual appeals.

I don't know exactly how many Australians are caught each year bringing drugs into/out of Asian countries, but the way this story is playing down here, Schapelle is the first and only. No doubt at all that but for her smile, she would rate 1-2 days mention in our news, not 1-2 years.

Pisses me off too.... (3.00 / 2) (#154)
by claes on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:42:26 AM EST

The whole thing irked me too. The story is repeated over and over again: if an attractive woman is involved the media goes ballistic. Just like that australian woman with the drug conviction.

Personally, I just start my own personal news blackout, just like I did with Elian Gonzales and Michael Jackson. Don't read, don't listen.

The scary thing is that I sort of understand the motivation -- have you seen pictures of the canadian woman involved with the horrific sex-murders? She's really HOT, and I find myself strangely fascinated by the whole thing. I have to struggle to not read about it.

-- claes

haven't seen the hot sex-murder woman. links plz!? (none / 0) (#165)
by quidorg on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:07:09 AM EST

ha ha, hah
no, really. :P

[ Parent ]
Used to be hotter; (none / 0) (#343)
by crustacean on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 05:22:28 AM EST

12 years in the can, no outlets for her darkest urges takes its toll. Still, look in her eyes: http://www.francesfarmersrevenge.com/stuff/badgirls/homolkapics.htm
Will take to the forest before the oil overlords annex Canada.
[ Parent ]
You find Karla Homolka hot? (none / 0) (#166)
by The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 12:34:36 PM EST

She's so white trash.

___
I'm a pompous windbag, I take myself far too seriously, and I single-handedly messed up K5 by causing the fiction section to be created. --localroger

[ Parent ]
Living in a cave or any other place outside USA (none / 1) (#155)
by Niha on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 08:33:36 AM EST

 Anyway, it seems to be quite frequent using some particular news so people don't pay attention to other events... This being really feeding up? Of course.
 Saying also I feel sorry for all the missing persons, as well as for their families and friends.
 

I don't care much, but I understand why (1.33 / 3) (#158)
by Thrasymachus on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:21:52 AM EST

If you don't care about young pretty girls of your own race, then you aren't really human.  I'm white; so are most Americans.  Natalee is white.  Reyna isn't, and I don't really care about her.  I might if I saw her picture and thought she was pretty.

Applying the logic of the article author lead to many kinds of silliness.  By his logic, should he care about his family and friends simply because they're close to them?  After all, what makes the plight of his family more important than the Iraq War?  Or China's oil company purchase?  He'll have a hard time justifing with pure blistering logic.

We're human beings, and stories like Natalee's get to us because we are human beings.  

I don't have much sympathy for the girl.  Going off with strange men in the middle of the night strikes me as stupid behavior.  But I understand the people who do have sympathy.

Reyna not white? (3.00 / 3) (#162)
by Niha on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:42:12 AM EST

 Someone has to explain me the "race" concept according to USA standards.

[ Parent ]
Race according to USA standards (3.00 / 11) (#201)
by LodeRunner on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:26:35 AM EST

In the US, "white" does not follow the anthropological definition of caucasoid. It means something along the lines of "European descendant coming from or whose family came from a First World country (Europe, Australia, etc)".

A few examples:

  • if you're from an Irish family, you're "white".
  • if you're from a German family, you're "white".
  • if you're from an Italian family, you're "white" too.
  • if you're from Spain, or from a Spanish family coming straight from Spain to the US, you're still "white".
  • if you're amerindian from the United States, you're "native-american".
  • if you're amerindian from the border of Mexico on, you're "hispanic".
  • if you're from a Spanish family who migrated to Latin America prior to going to the US, with no amerindian blood whatsoever, then you're "hispanic" too.
  • if you're semitic, it gets tricky. Arabs are definitely not "white". They're usually referred to as just "arabs", or by nationality or religion ("iraqi", "muslim", etc.). Jews are considered white occasionaly, but I believe they tend to describe themselves here as not "white" too (but you often see a "white" actor playing a jew and vice versa -- and many popular jewish celebrities are considered white by the public).
  • if you're from a Japanese family, you're "asian".
  • if you're family is from India, which is of course a country in Asia, then you're not asian: you're "indian". The term "asian" is used only for those who match the anthropological definition of mongoloid (I'm using the original technical meaning of the word here, no offense intended): chinese, koreans, japanese, thai, etc. Indians (most of them, at least) may be caucasoids, but they're not "white".
  • if your race matches the anthropological definition of negroid, you're "african-american". If you are african-american, you may call yourself "black".
  • with mixed races, it gets even more complicated. Usually, you're only "white" if both your parents are "white" (according to the above definitions). There seems to be an order of precedence to determine your "primary" race if your parents are of different races. Apparently the order goes (from most to least determinant, from the ones I mentioned in this post):  african-american, asian, indian, hispanic, arab, jewish, white.
If I made any mistakes, I welcome corrections. I've only been here in the US for a few months, so I didn't get the hang of its intricate racial classification system completely. Note that this is not official, but is an unspoken de facto system. Some people take offense at the pinpointing of races on people, so they tend to have what they call "affirmative determination" -- it's up to you to define which race you are. (In practice, however, if your affirmation does not match the well-established norm, people will just think you're trying to deny your "real race".)

Whereas for me, I'm of mixed race -- my father is Palestinian and my mother is of a Polish family. Guess which is my race by US standards. Amazingly, it's "hispanic". Reason: I was born and raised in Brazil (a country from South America, where we don't even speak Spanish).

Personally, I don't really care. People are just people, anywhere. IMHO, if we really need to describe people, I guess nationality does a better job, since it tends to reflect the culture of the individual better. However, when in the US, one has to know these "rules", at the very least to avoid gaffes or misunderstandings.

BTW, I wholeheartedly hope I did not offend any ethnic/diversity/minority groups. I just tried to present the outlook as I learned here from others and from observation, in a very practical and objective way. If I did mistakenly offend anyone or come across as racist (here you never know, people are very sensitive to those issues), I am deeply sorry.

---
"dude, you can't even spell your own name" -- Lode Runner
[ Parent ]

You missed the point. (none / 1) (#164)
by alsobrsp on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:01:44 AM EST

He should care about is family and things that effect him. But he doesn't expect you to care about his family.

[ Parent ]
What's important?! (none / 0) (#161)
by fijimingle on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:31:11 AM EST

Since when has news had anything to do with what's important? They're selling a product and they've got a lot of experience in what sells. If you don't like it, don't buy for it.

"You furnish the pictures and I'll furnish the war!" Remember the Maine?



Agree, almost completely. (none / 1) (#163)
by mindstrm on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:50:55 AM EST

The one reason, however, that this gets news is because it happened in Aruba, a place where this kind of thing simply never happens.

In the US, children are abducted all the time.


White girl missing (2.66 / 6) (#168)
by Cro Magnon on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 02:05:37 PM EST

I'll go one step farther. It's not enough that that the missing girls be white and pretty. They have to be white, pretty, and RICH! When was the last time you ever heard of a poor girl getting kidnapped?
Information wants to be beer.
well said (none / 1) (#250)
by little jackal on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 01:46:25 PM EST

To prove your point even more: when was the last time a poor kid vacationed to Aruba for their High School graduation. After I finished high school I was too busy looking for a job to be thinking of spending god-knows-how-much on a vacation to the Carribean islands!

the shared gravitational mass would create a supercluster of obese bodies with all the remaining fit bodies orbiting around it. -skewedtree
[ Parent ]
u, (none / 1) (#685)
by toot4u on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 02:50:35 PM EST

if you wanna do your senior trip bad enough, You'll get the money or save it. Even if your middle class. Not everyone sits around saying "i have no money, i cant do anything".. but there are other "missing white girls" in Carribean who are not rich. so...

[ Parent ]
Er... (none / 1) (#307)
by trhurler on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:34:57 PM EST

Actually, about two or three weeks ago. The girl who was kidnapped and held in a trailer? The one with trailer trash daddy crying on TV? Yeah.

--
'God dammit, your posts make me hard.' --LilDebbie

[ Parent ]
Absolutely Agree, And: (2.66 / 3) (#169)
by Western Infidels on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 02:27:08 PM EST

I think the same "Pretty White Girl Is Disproportionately Newsworthy" syndrome was at work in the insanity surrounding Terri Schiavo. I didn't see any news coverage of Schiavo that failed to include 16-year old photos from before her collapse.

One might (weakly) argue that publicizing pictures of Holloway could help with the search, in the unlikely chance that she is still alive. But the pictures of Schiavo were purely a distraction from the issue at hand, such as it was.

or that it continues (none / 0) (#173)
by Rhodes on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 07:21:08 PM EST

the schiavo matter seems to be under the defilibrator, if one pardons my double metaphor. Let the human die!

[ Parent ]
pretty? (none / 0) (#853)
by sickofit on Sun Jul 31, 2005 at 09:53:21 AM EST

With that big ugly nose of hers? Short, dumpy and the big nose. So tired of seeing those pix of her over and over. UGLY!!

[ Parent ]
Well (none / 0) (#886)
by Western Infidels on Tue Aug 02, 2005 at 02:32:52 PM EST

Well, taste is of course subjective. But I wonder if you're thinking of this whereas I was thinking of this or especially this, which I think is the one the TV news just could not stop showing.

Even if you still think she was dumpy with a big nose, well, lots of other poeple didn't think so, and that's really what's important here. There's actually a very large percentage of the population (of the male population, at least) who think a woman is attractive if she's 1) the right color 2) skinny and 3) paid some attention to her hair that morning.

[ Parent ]

Cute, innocent, white woman or child goes missing (2.88 / 18) (#170)
by slashcart on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 03:30:47 PM EST

I first heard of the missing girl (Natalee) yesterday afternoon during a July 4th party.

Woman at party: Isn't it just terrible to hear of that poor missing girl?

Me: Yes, yes. Terrible. Tragedy.

Woman: Have you been keeping up on the news? What's the latest news? Have they found any clues?

Me: They haven't found her yet.

Unfortunately, I'd never heard of the girl before. Indeed, for the prior few weeks I had neither seen the news, nor watched television.

Fortunately, the American television media is so tiringly repetitive that I can fill in the blanks and infer its contents without watching it. Jessica Lynch, JonBenet Ramsey, Elian Gonzales, Natalee Holloway, or some other cute, defenseless, pretty, innocent, WHITE (or white-looking) girl or child, has gone missing or will go missing. Something must be done about it. It's the top national priority. As a result, the military has been dispatched. The FBI has be informed. A new clue has been discovered. Because AMERICA protects its children/women (the cute white ones, anyway).

The few people in the country who are not idiots will complain. "Why does the news show 17 straight days of nonstop coverage of some white kid that fell down a well? What about {Iraq is falling apart, trade deficit unsustainable, economy melting down, nukes in Iran, Seoul destroyed, Putin gains absolute control, Ukranian nukes unsecured, Earth in danger, etc}.

...About 15-20 years ago, when I was in Minnesota, a small cute white kid accidentally shot a small duck with a bow and arrow. The duck was injured, and it flew to a neighboring lake. The cute white kid was sorry, almost in tears. The media in Minnesota latched onto this immediately. The baby duck is in peril! The cute white boy will be devastated! Fear not, the duck has been spotted! Attempts are being made to track the injured duck. Oh, that poor duck!

It's a FUCKING DUCK.

...I feel very sorry for Natalee. Honestly. But there are also 400,000,000 non-cute, non-white, non-vacationing-in-aruba, non-F/16-dispatched kids who survive on $0.01 per day, about whom we apparently don't give a fuck.

Somewhat aggree (none / 1) (#175)
by KEEPNATALEEINYOURPRAYERS on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 08:07:38 PM EST

Yeah they do have nonstop coverage on Natalee but all of it isn't just because she is WHITE or PRETTy it's mainly because it happenened in a different country and her mother is pushing the media... not just because shes WHITE OR PRETTY...

[ Parent ]
What, you seriously think if she wasn't pretty (none / 1) (#203)
by Have A Nice Day on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:40:24 AM EST

That the media would show her face day after day, and anyone would be interested? I hate to say it, but humanity really is that shallow (or seems to be these days).

--------------
Have A Nice Day may have reentered the building.
[ Parent ]
No, it's that shallow, alright. (none / 0) (#211)
by thankyougustad on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:15:31 PM EST

The whole thing is depressing.

No no thanks no
Je n'aime que le bourbon
no no thanks no
c'est une affaire de goût.

[ Parent ]
Pretty? (3.00 / 2) (#221)
by szo on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:43:33 PM EST

Pretty? PRETTY?!

If that girl counts as pretty, you're really in serious trouble. She's not the ugliest I've seen, but pretty is definetaly not the word I would use to describe her. Ugh, get a grip. That someone is not 50kg overweight doesn't mean she's pretty.
--
I guess it wasn't the dove...
[ Parent ]

Um Pretty? is my question too (none / 1) (#537)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 11:39:14 AM EST

Listen, it has nothing to do with her being white or pretty or rich. Her mom is pushing the issue just like your mom may have done for you, unless you are ugly? Anyway you and the other Liberals of this country need a quick reality check. Grow up.

[ Parent ]
It's just manufactured news (2.83 / 6) (#176)
by Krueger Industrial Smoothing on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 09:07:21 PM EST

Look at the case of Jon-Benet Ramsey.  I can remember in the early days of that case, there would be "breaking news" reports where the only thing they would report is that they had nothing new to report.
Seriously -- I actually saw that.

Every so often the news media picks a case, seemingly at random,  and then devotes an enormous amount of attention to it.

JonBenet Ramsey (none / 1) (#234)
by gbd on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 11:43:54 PM EST

I remember reading The Onion during the height of JonBenet frenzy. They had a headline that read: "Ugly Girl Killed: Nation Unshaken By Not-So-Tragic Death."

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]
google: made it to listing #3 (3.00 / 3) (#182)
by shm on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:26:19 PM EST

Link

The F word makes to #1.

bahahahah (none / 1) (#183)
by benna on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 10:55:54 PM EST

I love it!
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Amazing (none / 1) (#187)
by forgotten on Tue Jul 05, 2005 at 11:33:51 PM EST

especially when the two sites ahead are cnn and nataleeholloway.com


--

[ Parent ]

Badge of...Honor. (1.50 / 2) (#191)
by cribcage on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:56:02 AM EST

Well, here's something to be proud of -- a shining moment for K5, and a solid rebuttal to people who charge these stupid websites are filled with worthless, yammering children whose ineptitude is equaled only by their cowardice.

...Bunch of fucking morons.

Please don't read my journal.
[ Parent ]

So much for K5 is dead, eh? [nt] (3.00 / 2) (#198)
by LodeRunner on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 05:07:44 AM EST

no tquite.

---
"dude, you can't even spell your own name" -- Lode Runner
[ Parent ]

For Goodness Sake (none / 0) (#592)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:43:37 AM EST

He knows when you are sleeping and knows when you're awake. He knows when you've been bad or good. So many of these people on this website need to quit pouting about Natalie being white and wealthy, and be American enough to stand against individuals who commit crimes against American citizens who are vacationing in their countries.

[ Parent ]
Natalee (3.00 / 5) (#190)
by jeeber on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:07:07 AM EST

Besides the fact that millions upon millions of dollars are being spent to find this one missing person - money that would provide far more results if split into 100's or even 1000's of portions to search for other missing folk (or even in social programs - such as feeding the poor or scholarship programs!), there's also the issue of Natalee's mother. The following comments struck me as extremely selfish: Beth Holloway Twitty pleaded for other countries not to allow them entry, and for Aruban officials to notify the U.S. State Department, if the brothers decide to leave the Caribbean island. Her mother said she is convinced the Kalpoe brothers "were involved in a violent crime against my daughter," questioning how they could be allowed "to walk freely among the tourists and citizens of Aruba." --- Keep in mind that these two brothers have already been imprisoned for a month over a crime they quite possibly did not commit! If the evidence was there, they would still be in custody, or better yet: they would have actual charges entered against them. Speaking of which, family members kill or kidnap other members of their family quite often. Maybe Mrs. Holloway herself should be imprisoned in Aruba until all the facts are sorted out?

this reminds me of a Sherlock Holmes story n/t (none / 0) (#210)
by thankyougustad on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 12:12:46 PM EST



No no thanks no
Je n'aime que le bourbon
no no thanks no
c'est une affaire de goût.

[ Parent ]
Who is involved (none / 0) (#591)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:34:43 AM EST

We shall see.

[ Parent ]
Fuck Natalee (3.00 / 3) (#192)
by veasun on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:01:53 AM EST

I agree 100% with this posting by OP-ED. Has anyone else noticed that the chaperones cleared out without any questioning? Maybe they were all hand picked rich white friends of the Twitty's? And none of them or Nat's friends cared to check on her until she failed to show for the plane? Didn't anyone wonder why she never came in that night? Didn't she share a room with a classmate? And there has been a media blackout on her classmates and teachers? Lots of unasked and unanswered questions....most about digging for the real truth?

Golden age of intelligence (2.88 / 9) (#200)
by fenris on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:16:09 AM EST

On the previously mentioned Google search for Natalee Holloway, to our right you will see the traditional Sponsored Links area, under which there is a single advertisement...

Natalee Holloway Bands
100% Net Proceeds Benefit
Natalee Holloway Trust Fund
www.amazon.com

Because, of course, Natalle Holloway is in desperate need of trust fund money.

From Amazon:

Features:
  • Proceeds (85% Gross) Go to Natalee Holloway Fund.
  • Help Bring Natalee Home.
  • Top Quality. Ship in 24 Hours.
  • Lettering "One Nation". Fashionable Soft Red.
  • 10 Individually Packed Wristbands.

Currently ranked #11 in Amazons Top Sellers in the Everything Else category, and climbing.

Now #4 Top Seller in Everything Else (n/t) (none / 0) (#270)
by fenris on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 02:13:56 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Welcome to America... (2.75 / 4) (#204)
by God of Lemmings on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:48:53 AM EST

Where all major media news organizations read from the same news feed.

Where major media news organizations cant tell the difference between a real news feed, and government sponsored propaganda.

Where the major media corporations are all major republican and/or bush donators (prove me wrong)

Where one polital party or another whines/attempt to discredit/ or throw labels at journalists whenever it is disadvantageous to their party.

Look, the TV is no longer a viable source of national and international news. The internet itself is, assuming you actually cross-check your search results.

Lol, re: donations. Totally wrong. (none / 0) (#205)
by jeeber on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 08:05:37 AM EST

Nearly all the major media corporations donate heavily to Democrat candidates, not Republicans. No clue where you got that from, just about the only big-time Republican supporters of the lot are Rupert Murdoch and all the companies he owns. For example, in 2004: Time Warner (the #1 donator in TV/Movies/Music) donated $2,969,690. Dems received 79% of this, Republicans 21%. Viacom, Inc. (#2) $1,407,171, Dems 81%, Republicans 19%. Comcast, Corp (#3) $1,322,385, Dems 50%, Republicans 50%. National Cable & Telecommunications Assn. (#4) $1,306,992, Dems 44%, Republicans 56%. Walt Disney Co. (#5) $963,986, Dems 71%, Republicans 29%. Total contributions from that sector were $32,016,389, of which the Democrats received 69% and the Republicans received 31%. Now, if you go to Printing & Publishing ( you'll find that the total contributions for 2004 from that industry were $18,693,027. The Democrats receiving $12,829,809 (or 69%) vs. the Republicans receiving $5,734,773 (31%). Source: http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/contrib.asp?cycle=2004&ind=B02 http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/contrib.asp?cycle=2004&ind=B01 Most ppl know that the media has a liberal bias, I'm pretty shocked that someone would even suggest that they donated more to Repubs.

[ Parent ]
The Democrats aren't liberal - [n/t] (none / 0) (#282)
by destroy all monsters on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 07:51:15 AM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
So what? (none / 0) (#309)
by jeeber on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 11:11:00 PM EST

Uhm, they're more liberal than the Republicans, and very rarely will you get someone elected that isn't of one of the two major parties. Regardless, I'm sure any reasonable person would agree that the Democrats trend more liberal than the Republicans, therefore the media would have a liberal bias in regards to US politics if you reckon that the donations are indicative of this - which is something the original poster apparently believed, hence the reply.

[ Parent ]
For your statistics (none / 0) (#310)
by destroy all monsters on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 11:30:05 PM EST

to have any meaning we'd have to know to which Democrats and Republicans. Just giving the amounts doesn't tell the true story at all. I'm sure you're aware that there are Republicans that are more liberal than many Democrats.

While the original poster is wrong (and should have checked the facts before s/he typed them) s/he isn't wrong about the near-universality of the coverage. All the television news outlets cover the same things and none of them display any apparent desire to do investigative reporting or even basic facts checking in regards to anything coming from the government.

This quote "Look, the TV is no longer a viable source of national and international news. The internet itself is, assuming you actually cross-check your search results." is dead on.

I'd say there's a bias, but a corporate friendly bias. That said a corporation gives their money where they think they can get the most bang for it, it doesn't necessarily indicate its politics.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]

CSI (2.80 / 5) (#206)
by mahju on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 08:58:43 AM EST

Last night I watched CSI - Mimi (Death Grip Series 2 - Episode 4 of 24).

Interestingly in this episode a rich white girl goes missing and there is a huge response. She later found to be fine and just run away, while in their investigations they find the missing body of a hispanic girl, which went unmentioned in the press, and with little previous help by police.  Towards the end on of the cast says "if she had blonde hair and blue eyes, this wouldn't have happend".

Then I read this today at K5.  Werid.  I guess that's a life imitating art type moments


"art" [nt] (2.66 / 3) (#223)
by benna on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 04:34:23 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
reading my morning news ... (2.50 / 2) (#216)
by no carrier on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:30:19 PM EST

I came across this headline and it caught my attention. So I read the story and I agreed mostly and then brought it up for morning coffee discussion with my co-workers.

We all seem to agree and had various theories about why this one girl seemed to be getting all the attention while millions of other kids are ignored. One of my co-workers stated that it was how loudly the parents screamed and brought attention to the case. His arguement was that to get on the news you have to make a big fuss. Now, I disagreed, but this led to an idea, an all-american idea at that ... a lawsuit. Why don't the parents, or hell, anyone interested, sue the major news companies for predjudice (or whatever you can come up with)? You likely would not win, but you certainly would gain attention and that's really the point, to get more people to pay attention so that someone, somewhere might recognize one of these children.

This just seemed like such an excellent idea to draw attention to the other missing children that I thought I would post it and see what others thought. I think we would be much better served by news companies if, instead of the latest news of Jacko going to another country so he can fondle little boys in peace, every hour or so they ran pics from all the current Amber Alerts or something to that effect.

I know, it's a utopian idea, how would you force people to watch it? There are plenty of holes in this idea, but I'm really surprised that noone has tried it yet. When in doubt, sue ... actually, just sue anytime, it's the American Waytm

---
I stab people.
Why this one? (3.00 / 2) (#268)
by jeversol on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 11:40:46 PM EST

Earlier comments and the article itself talk about other young girls who have disappeared and never generated such media attention. It's clear why. MSNBC interviewed a journalist from Denmark, and asked her why she thought so much media attention was being given to this case. She said it was the perfect soap opera.

A young, attractive girl from "middle America" with long blonde hair and baby-blue eyes goes on vacation with her friends to a Caribbean island. They're celebrating their high school graduation. Hooray! They decide to hit the popular clubs and party away. There are lots of questions about what happened after that... Were drugs involved? Sex? We don't know, and that's why everyone is at the edge of their seat about it.

Why didn't the girl mentioned in the main article get all the attention? She was Hispanic. If Natalee was a young black girl, we wouldn't have heard about it. If she was less "perfect" looking, we wouldn't have heard anything about it. Welcome to America.

--je

[ Parent ]

Interesting theory, but (none / 1) (#339)
by livus on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 10:35:38 PM EST

the very people who could most likely sue are also the people that can't afford to, which is kind of why they're in that position in the first place.

---
HIREZ substitute.
be concrete asshole, or shut up. - CTS
I guess I skipped school or something to drink on the internet? - lonelyhobo
I'd like to hope that any impression you got about us from internet forums was incorrect. - debillitatus
I consider myself trolled more or less just by visiting the site. HollyHopDrive

[ Parent ]
Please (1.00 / 14) (#217)
by Polo555 on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 01:49:17 PM EST

I cannot believe you people. This is not the first time that a young girl from the United States has come up missing in Aruba while vacationing. Does Amy Bradley ring a bell? She went missing in 1995 and believed to have been sold. There is something odd going on in Aruba and thanks to the Holloway case getting so much attention it will come to a stop. I don't know about you but I don't want to be scared shitless every time I go on vacation. And do you really thank that she is getting so much attention because she is white and wealthy? This Case is not all about Natalee Holloway. She is just the tip of the iceberg.

Some Iceberg (3.00 / 4) (#222)
by Western Infidels on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:45:39 PM EST

Two disappearances over the course of 10 years constitutes an "iceberg" of disappearances?

Bradley disappeared from a ship, not from Aruba. Looks to me like she could simply have fallen off and drowned, but no one wants to believe that, for some reason.

How many millions of tourists make their way through the Carribbean without incident every year, anyway? I bet a Carribbean vacation is safer than visiting most of America.

[ Parent ]

Fact Check (3.00 / 3) (#224)
by aballen on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 04:43:27 PM EST

Amy Bradley was reported missing on March 24, 1998 during a family vacation cruise to the Caribbean. She went missing while her cruise ship was docking on the island of Curacao, Netherland Antilles, in the Caribbean.

[ Parent ]
Yes (none / 1) (#230)
by mindstrm on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 10:20:04 PM EST

Indeed, this happened at Curacao, not Aruba.. but you do realize that Curacao and Aruba are both islands in the Netherlands Antilles, in the Caribbean, very close to each other?

[ Parent ]
Are you just a troll? You can't be serious [nt] (none / 0) (#232)
by benna on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 10:40:36 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
"something odd going on in Aruba" (3.00 / 5) (#242)
by SlashDread on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 08:37:56 AM EST

Yes, its called mass hysteria by paranoid USsians.

[ Parent ]
you must be joking (3.00 / 5) (#277)
by jcarnelian on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 04:10:22 AM EST

Does Amy Bradley ring a bell? She went missing in 1995 and believed to have been sold. Do you have any idea how many people get killed in the US every year? The US has about 10 times more murders per capita than just about any other civilized nation. And because stupid and scared Americans believe the world has nothing better to do than to sell their brats into slavery, rather than facing the fact that US teens are as promiscuous as other teens and far more guilt-ridded about it, doesn't mean that that's actually what happens. I don't know about you but I don't want to be scared shitless every time I go on vacation. Then stay at home.

[ Parent ]
polo555 (none / 0) (#923)
by theprincessjjm on Tue Aug 09, 2005 at 09:47:33 PM EST

I just spent 8 wonderful days in Arbua. My boyfriend and I plan on spending two weeks there next summer. I have found the people wonderful and warm. Ever been to Nassau??? They do you a big favor letting you on their island. There have been 3 murders in Aruba in the past 10 years. Can you say the same thing about our country?

[ Parent ]
The Hidden Culprit (2.80 / 10) (#220)
by Cateland on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 03:32:40 PM EST

I dare say this... but very little has been said about the real culprit in this whole scenario and that is Natalee herself. Who in their right mind leaves a nightclub in the middle of the night with three strangers - alone - and on a strange island? Everyone is crying 'Poor Baby'. Poor stupid baby. It's not like she was abducted and thrown into a car. She went to party. Pure and simple. Her momma probably told her a thousand times about stranger danger. I can't see these three boys as murderous monsters - more like the party got out of hand and somebody panicked. Natalee put herself in harm's way and should have known better. Which leads me to my usual rant about how the rest of us end up paying for the stupidity of a few. I'm sorry the girl is gone. I've lived through the disappearance of a child. Believe me I know what her parents are going through but let's not glamorize the facts. Natalee and the media bear some responsibility in all this. Where are the news stories warning kids against this kind of reckless behavior? I hope they find her alive and I hope the real story gets told.


Read My Blog: Diary of a Mad White House Wife at www.cateland.com

And yet (1.00 / 8) (#225)
by saodl on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 05:09:09 PM EST

You waste my time with this article about her...

wow. (3.00 / 2) (#226)
by parqbench on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:39:55 PM EST

way to miss the point.

think hard and you won't have to have people screaming at you, telling you you're using the "i am rubber you are glue" argument.

[ Parent ]

Wrong. (3.00 / 3) (#255)
by Fon2d2 on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 03:48:09 PM EST

Ironically, you missed the point. The article is about the state of the media in this country, not Natalee Holloway.

[ Parent ]
+1 FP [nt] (2.00 / 2) (#227)
by guyjin on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 06:58:18 PM EST


-- 散弾銃でおうがいして ください
A little respect for those in pain? (1.50 / 6) (#229)
by jiuyen on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 09:34:08 PM EST

While I fully agree with the overall tone, tenor and message of this article, I can't help but wonder if "Fuck Natalee Holloway" was the best choice of titles. After all, neither she nor any member of her friends or family wanted to produce this type of media hype. I'd be willing to bet that their greatest wish is that none of this ever happened and that Ms. Holloway returned safe and sound from her vacation with nothing more serious than a sunburn.

I imagine that the important message in your article would go much further if the anger and frustration were aimed at culprits rather than victims.

You misunderstand the title (3.00 / 2) (#231)
by benna on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 10:24:02 PM EST

It's not "fuck Natalee Holloway, she's a stupid cunt."  It's "fuck Natalee Holloway, I don't want to hear about her."
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
No, it's not even that (none / 1) (#327)
by SocratesGhost on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 03:59:27 PM EST

It's "Fuck the Natalee Holloway coverage". The problem is, the title directs his anger at an innocent when his complaint is really about the media.

The title is distasteful in comparison to the article which is well enough reasoned. I can understand the desire to be inflammatory early on in a story in order to encourage people to read and react, but I think the title does the story an injustice.

-Soc
I drank what?


[ Parent ]
"Fuck Natalee Holloway" (none / 0) (#233)
by gbd on Wed Jul 06, 2005 at 11:39:52 PM EST

While I fully agree with the overall tone, tenor and message of this article, I can't help but wonder if "Fuck Natalee Holloway" was the best choice of titles.

By "Fuck Natalee Holloway", I'm referring to the excessive media coverage of the Holloway story, not Holloway herself. (I went to pains to point this out in the first paragraph of the body.) "Fuck the Excessive Media Coverage of Natalee Holloway" would certainly have been less ambiguous, but it also would have carried less impact.

I'd be willing to bet that their greatest wish is that none of this ever happened and that Ms. Holloway returned safe and sound from her vacation with nothing more serious than a sunburn.

And I would repeat what I said in the body: If I were King of the World, I'd snap my fingers and instantly return Natalee (and all of the rest of the world's missing person) to their families safe and sound. Unfortunately, I don't possess that particular ability, so we have to play the hand we've been dealt. In this case, the hand results in much headscratching consternation wondering why in the hell this story is so important.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Natalee Holloway (1.00 / 2) (#386)
by AngelaJeep on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:21:06 PM EST

GDB, What goes around, comes around! Your mother obviously didn't raise you right, or maybe you don't have a mother at all? For you to say what you did about Natalee is pure mean! You obviously are DESPERATE for attention. Natalee's mother is doing everything in her power to find her daughter. More parents should be like her! You must not be a parent, and if you are, I feel very sorry for your children (or future children). I've been to Aruba; there are rough waters on one side of the Island and it is great that they have so many volunteers to try and find her. You are just JEALOUS because I see how much attention you are trying to get. Poor pathetic LOOSER!

[ Parent ]
You are the pathetic one (none / 0) (#394)
by benna on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 11:20:47 PM EST

Why don't you get a life.  Also, I don't know where all these people are getting the idea that the article is attacking the mother.  It is clearly an attack on the media.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Look Who's Talking (1.00 / 2) (#400)
by AngelaJeep on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 04:40:02 PM EST

Betcha I have much more of a life than you :-).

[ Parent ]
Perhaps but its an extremly superficial one n/t (none / 0) (#402)
by benna on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 06:18:13 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
WARNING: Boomerang will return! (none / 1) (#418)
by artis on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 05:03:18 PM EST

AngelaJeep, What goes around, comes around! Your mother probably didn't raise you right, she certainly didn't manage teach you empathy towards people who had to grow up without a mother. For you to say what you did about GDB is pure mean! You obviously are DESPERATE for feel good stories. Fox News do everything in their power to keep you glued to the TV! You might be a parent, and if you are, I will not judge your parenting by one K5 post (but might after future posts). I haven't been to Aruba so I don't know what rough waters on one side of the Island have to do with the story, but it is great if the volunteers rather stayed home and would look out for all the people who have gone missing near them. You are just UNREASONALBE because you attack the messenger. Poor impulsive FLAMER!
--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
You are right (none / 0) (#536)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 11:32:56 AM EST

Not only was it not the best choice of titles, but it makes the author appear to be a liberal (well now anarchist/atheist pig) who only wants to hear about gay marriages in Spain. I think he may be moving there or something.

[ Parent ]
The internet responds! (2.73 / 23) (#243)
by rusty on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 11:47:21 AM EST

Subject: your actionable website
From: John Fahs
Date: 07/06/2005 03:43 PM
To: Me

I am writing to inform you that i find your website,
specifically the "fuck natalee holloway" piece,
unacceptable. I request that you remove this horrible
travesty at once, as it is an affront to decent people
everywhere and totally unprotected by the first
amendment. I am so disgusted, I do not have the words
to tell you what a low opinion I have of you for
allowing this garbage. I think a formal complaint to
the FCC and other legal authorities is in order.

 


____
Not the real rusty
Seriously (3.00 / 5) (#244)
by aballen on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 12:22:51 PM EST

1. This is protected speech. The courts would not have a legitimate reason to block it. 2. The FCC does not regulate vulgar opinions on internet sites. 3. If you don't like it you shouldn't read it.

[ Parent ]
The FCC (3.00 / 13) (#246)
by rusty on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 12:41:32 PM EST

I've gotten this kind of "I'm gonna tell the FCC" threat before. I can say without a doubt that there is a general belief among the ignorant American populace that the FCC has jurisdiction and authority over all communication everywhere.

It would be funny if it weren't so depressing. What this belief actually means is that the general public has no idea from where the FCC derives its authority -- the public ownership of broadcast spectrum. When we forgot that, we almost automatically brought upon ourselves the media landscape we have now, where no broadcaster has any obligation to anything but profit.

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]

their definition of the FCC derives from j jackson (2.87 / 8) (#260)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 07:34:25 PM EST

"what's the fcc? um... they're the peoples that said janet shouldn't show her boobies. so um... they must like protect us from unamerican things! yeah"

seeing black boobies: unamerican

not crying over a white chick in jeopardy every 10 minutes: unamerican


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

[ Parent ]

People don't understand the first amendment (none / 1) (#305)
by Big Sexxy Joe on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:16:18 PM EST

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6888837/

Read it and weep.  Half of all high school students believe that the government can regulate content on the internet.  Three quarters think flag burning is illegal.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
Democracy Now! - your daily, uncensored, corporate-free grassroots news hour
[ Parent ]

Oh, no! (3.00 / 2) (#245)
by gbd on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 12:33:15 PM EST

I wonder why Mr. Fahs believes that this is "totally unprotected by the First Amendment?"

On the other hand, he was actually able to correctly spell "amendment", so I guess he can't be all bad.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Icidentally (3.00 / 6) (#247)
by rusty on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 12:44:57 PM EST

Have you seen Google lately?

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]
Google (none / 1) (#248)
by gbd on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 12:57:16 PM EST

Wow.  I checked yesterday afternoon when it was the #3 link. Now we've taken out both Fox and CNN. Ah, the power of Google.  You get the complete spectrum of opinion on an issue in the first two links alone! I suppose the fact that lots of sites like Metafilter are linking to the story using the article title is pushing it up Google's pecking order. An interesting side effect, to be sure.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]
wierd. (none / 0) (#256)
by aphrael on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 03:51:03 PM EST

i understood how that happened when k5 was at the peak of its size, but ... how the hell does that happen *now*?

[ Parent ]
k5 is always at its peak (none / 0) (#290)
by Delirium on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 04:33:47 PM EST

Do not believe lies that say otherwise!

[ Parent ]
Things are more like they are now... (3.00 / 6) (#312)
by rusty on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 11:39:08 PM EST

...than they ever have been before.

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (none / 1) (#259)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 07:29:37 PM EST

and what's more

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

[ Parent ]

expected (3.00 / 3) (#251)
by Polyxena on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 02:05:05 PM EST

Most people on the internet are sadly ignorant and misinformed when it comes to free speech and digital rights. Witness the incredibly furor over hoaxes like Bonsai Kitten or sites like rotten.com.

Thank god for the First Amendment.

[ Parent ]

Why unacceptable? (none / 1) (#258)
by elliot42 on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 05:04:52 PM EST

Doesn't even mention why he think the piece is unaccepted.

[ Parent ]
because it's not what he thinks (3.00 / 3) (#261)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 07:36:08 PM EST

so therefore the government should outlaw it

in the name of all things american

which is a country founded on a document protecting free speech

you can smack your forehead now


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

[ Parent ]

*Smack* [nt] (none / 0) (#347)
by BJH on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 08:09:32 AM EST


--
Roses are red, violets are blue.
I'm schizophrenic, and so am I.
-- Oscar Levant

[ Parent ]
Sweet Jesus (none / 1) (#287)
by undermyne on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 01:04:55 PM EST

Please, rusty, give us his email address. We promise to be good.


"Coffee makes me go poop." thekubrix
[ Parent ]
LOLLERSKATES!!!!!!!!one!1111!! /nt (none / 0) (#342)
by skyknight on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 01:38:01 AM EST



It's not much fun at the top. I envy the common people, their hearty meals and Bruce Springsteen and voting. --SIGNOR SPAGHETTI
[ Parent ]
PIAGET (none / 0) (#590)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:31:43 AM EST

I agree with you my friend. I think some people are stating things on this website because they lack empathy for others and want to find a scapegoat for their own perceptions of the way society has treated them. Some just seem to get thrills by offending others. These people never attained what Piaget refers to as the cognitive developmental stage known as formal operations. Either they are around the age of twelve or have yet to mature past that age. I also wish that this negativity would stop.

[ Parent ]
Agree entirely (2.33 / 3) (#253)
by wolrahnaes on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 02:31:26 PM EST

the media just doesn't have priorities. yes a life is important, but this one is not more important than the many others that do not get media attention, nor is it more important to the rest of the world (i.e. those not related to the girl) than many of those stories you listed that were nearly ignored.

-------------
fuckitall
media friendliness (3.00 / 10) (#254)
by Work on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 03:03:50 PM EST

A simple minded person might think it were simply because shes a pretty white girl. It has more to do with friendliness to the media. I'm a photojournalist, and people who get more attention from the media are the ones who make the media's lives easier to get information out. A time honored way to do this is of course the Press Conference. And if theres anything the holloway family has done alot of, is call press conferences. Although the mother is becoming increasing erratic and nutty I think and I think is at risk of becoming media unfriendly from that... But can just anyone call a press conference? Yes and no. Yes you can, but it doesnt mean anyone will show up. It helps to have connections, and I don't think the fact that most of these stories are centered around fairly well-to-do families hurts. So that most of these disappearing ladies happen to be white and pretty has more to do with the current social nature of wealth and power in the US than it does media bias. As for why is it national news? Eh, these things seem to take lives of their own after awhile. And undoubtedly its easier to report on a story that has press conferences than shady dealings in iraq where you know, you have to dig for clues and deal with uncooperative military and political entities. Now what causes that kind of laziness and ineptitude is a whole story unto itself.

exactly (3.00 / 5) (#273)
by insomnyuk on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:04:55 AM EST

I mean, who wants to be a journalist if you have to work hard to come up with real news with verifiable sources? That's just so 20th century!

---
"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken
[ Parent ]
Fox News vs. other media channels (3.00 / 5) (#257)
by Roland on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 04:59:51 PM EST

While my personal opinion mostly agrees with the author, the scary part is the Fox News angle. Now that Fox News is the most watched television news station, CNN, MSNBC etc. must run with the stories that Fox chooses to focus on. Call it a business decision; but it's a sad one in my opinion. Say what you will, but I think it's a matter of fact Fox News is the most one sided, agenda having, angled news channel in history. I have no issues with someone being Republican, but seriously Fox is one step down from Rush Limbaugh. They focus reporting on topics which align with Rupert Murdocks view of the world. If this biased station now leads the way, where is the US going to go for real news? Seems like the only intellectual, factual news coverage is on NPR these days. I'm sick of stations giving their opinions on whether or not the Iraq invasion was a good idea or not; or how peachy and wonderful our president is. Just report the news without an opinion; just the facts.

If anything (none / 1) (#316)
by destroy all monsters on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:10:48 AM EST

Fox has done a brilliant job of giving the masses what they want: completely biased and slanted news without pretension. Doesn't mean that the other side shouldn't partake of the same strategy.

"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
RE: Fox News vs. other media channels (none / 1) (#356)
by bret harder on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 04:51:26 PM EST

[
Roland:
I'm sick of stations giving their opinions on whether or not the Iraq invasion was a good idea or not;
or how peachy and wonderful our president is.
Just report the news without an opinion; just the facts.
]

If in some fantasy world the News stations only reported facts;
There would be very little discussion on current events,
because most people can not or will not form their own opinion.

Generally, people don't watch cable news to get facts.
They watch because they have a predisposition to either agree or disagree with the station's opinion,
and they want to know what they should think.

If Fox News gradually changed their stance on a debate;
Their viewer's opinion would change as well and they probably wouldn't even notice.

[ Parent ]

Do Not Fuck Natalee Holloway (1.08 / 12) (#262)
by mjfgates on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 07:59:38 PM EST

It's been... a LOT of years. Anyway, the cartoon featured this guy punching all of a granny's teeth out and then mouth-raping her, and then he goes and finds a funeral in progress... the phrase, "Gimme that dead head, baby!" is used... and at the end, he's screaming "I've got WORMS in my SCHWEEN!", complete with a closeup of the happy munching worms.

Anyway, don't let that happen to you.

And if anybody remembers the title or anything, say so; I completely forget.

k5 trolls the internet, bravo gbd (2.75 / 12) (#263)
by circletimessquare on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 08:38:32 PM EST

as mentioned in comments below, searching for "natalee holloway" on google turns up this story at number 2

likewise, kuro5hin usage statistics indicates an upsurge of traffic, driven to the natalee holloway story as the most visited k5 page after the homepage:

# Hits KBytes URL

  1. 96527 20.54% 4997631 16.39% /
  2. 27474 5.85% 4502419 14.77% /story/2005/7/3/491/18474    <------*
  3. 9422 2.00% 205911 0.68% /modsub
  4. 8660 1.84% 536446 1.76% /section/Diary
  5. 8613 1.83% 203577 0.67% /comments/2005/7/3/491/18474
and check this out:
Top 20 of 10361 Total Search Strings
# Hits Search String
  1. 2296 10.13% natalee holloway
  2. 350 1.54% kuro5hin
  3. 326 1.44% libby hoeler
  4. 306 1.35% how to make sushi
  5. 209 0.92% sex
  6. 142 0.63% wep cracker
  7. 119 0.53% nick berg
  8. 118 0.52% natalee
  9. 107 0.47% hieronymus bosch
  10. 100 0.44% fuck
  11. 94 0.41% stop credit card offers
  12. 93 0.41% k5
  13. 84 0.37% pimp my web page
  14. 80 0.35% kuroshin
  15. 74 0.33% g8
  16. 72 0.32% naked
  17. 72 0.32% optout
  18. 65 0.29% google print
  19. 63 0.28% brimful of asha
  20. 63 0.28% site:www.kuro5hin.org earn money
fabulous! fucking hilarious! bravo gbd! i salute you

while my personal feelings are cynical: that commercial new media has always been about yellow journalism and sensationalism, and always will be, people care about stupid shit, little birds like shiny objects, welcome to reality, move the fuck on... i still think gbd has crystallized something for us:

people are sick of the endlessly reborn poor little white girl in jeopardy story

how many examples of it can you think of this kind of story from just the last few months or years?

we're seriously fucking sick of it, it's just not fucking news

additionally, if this had happened to a black or asian chick, this would not be treated the same way, at all

find one example of a poor little black girl or poor little asian girl that got the same level of exposure as the poor little white girls in jeopardy from last few months or years

it's fucking racist

so i chime in with you gbd: "fuck natalee holloway"

clarified: that she's dead is tragedy, BUT THAT THE US NEWS MEDIA HAS BASHED US OVER THE HEAD WITH HER STORY AND EVERY VARIATION OF IT IS ANOTHER KIND OF TRAGEDY

bravo gbd, bravo!


The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

More important than that (2.83 / 6) (#279)
by it certainly is on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:45:48 AM EST

Firefox is edging out IE6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!

1 97500 16.85% Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.8) Gec
2 47891 8.28% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1; .NET


kur0shin.org -- it certainly is

Godwin's law [...] is impossible to violate except with an infinitely long thread that doesn't mention nazis.
[ Parent ]

This article is now #1 on Google (2.90 / 10) (#264)
by benna on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 09:49:45 PM EST

Bwahahahah
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
No offense to the submitter... (2.33 / 3) (#272)
by Sarcasmooo on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:04:53 AM EST

...but I really don't think the title was a good idea, and I don't think it's a good thing that this is the #1 result on google. I agree 100% with his criticism of the news coverage, but "Fuck Natalee Holloway" was, ironically, a sensationalist attempt at grabbing and holding eyes. I understand being frustrated with the poor state of television news, in fact on any given day you can find me yelling at and berating my TV because of the things that spew out of it. And if I ever found myself having to argue with the people responsible for it, or the people who watch and adore every minute of it, the phrase "Fuck Natalee Halloway" might come out of my own mouth. But that's not what this is. This is a gimmick, a hook. Geraldo Rivera would be proud. And more importantly, now that it's the 1st result on google, you have to acknowledge the very real possibility that a member of her family will run across it. And while I also can't really say that one missing person concerns me (I'd be willing to bet I know even less about this story than most of you) I can imagine that her family doesn't deserve to hear that kind of thing.

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
Man... (2.50 / 2) (#274)
by Sarcasmooo on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:16:55 AM EST

...I'm gonna look like some newbie who doesn't know his br's. (I've been lurking for a grand total of 3 or 4 years with only a few posts on my previous account, I swear I didn't get her by googling Natalee Holloway)

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
dont' worry (none / 0) (#302)
by WetherMan on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 07:34:08 PM EST

we can all tell by your UID. (mouseover username's in comments)
---
fluorescent lights make me look like old hot dogs
[ Parent ]
Geraldo Rivera wouldn't have the balls (3.00 / 3) (#275)
by insomnyuk on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:18:24 AM EST

To post a story with such a title.

Furthermore, I think this is great that it's near the top of Google's results.

Controversy can shake some people out of complacency.

It grabs people's attention and gets them to click the link. Even if it just infuriates them, simpletons will at minimum be made aware of the fact that there are people tha object to the importance of the Natalee Holloway meme dominating the media. Even with the London bombings, the G8 summit, the execution of the Egyptian diplomat to Baghdad, the stand down between the Chinese bank and the U.S. Senate, and many other issues relevant to millions of people, the Holloway story is still getting a ton of coverage.

I think that simply further validates the claims and questions raised in gdb's story, and the fact that this inflammatory title will get thousands more people to read it is a good thing.

Metafilter linked to it, for example, and it generated 121 comments on that site alone, not to mention comments here resulting from that link.

Flannery O'Connor said, and this is paraphrasing, "if you want to communicate with the blind, you must paint startling pictures, and in the world of the deaf, you have to shout."

---
"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken
[ Parent ]

Heh... (none / 1) (#276)
by Sarcasmooo on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 03:38:44 AM EST

I don't know how you could argue that 'complacent simpletons' (paraphrasing) won't simply do the complacent-simpleton thing by immediately being offended and using it as a reason to completely write off and ignore everything below the title. I mean Rusty has already posted an email from someone who did this.

Let me tell you what I see this tactic doing:

Reinforcing the opinions of some Metafilter/K5 readers.

Reinforcing the opinions of a good number of Daily Show viewers that get here through google.

Offending about one million random people who are both part of the problem and necessary to it's solution (changing their minds and having them complain to the editor is the only way anything will change)

And the real simpletons in that last group will just think that people who question whether or not a gruesome murder or a kidnapping are of nation-wide interest, are just heartless cynics.

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
Are you really blaming me .. (3.00 / 3) (#283)
by gbd on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 10:39:25 AM EST

.. for the fact that this story is a highly-rated Google result? (It's at #2 right now.) If you've got a problem with that, you might want to take it up with Google. As far as the title is concerned, I've explained the rationale behind it many more times than I cared to. It is what it is.

...you have to acknowledge the very real possibility that a member of her family will run across it.

And why would that be a problem? Look, the family can hardly be faulted for exploiting the media to its fullest in this situation, but I would guess that even they would be at a loss to explain why their daughter is worth more, as a person, than any other missing girl in the world.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

To respond to the subject line... (none / 0) (#326)
by Sarcasmooo on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 02:52:45 PM EST

...no.

Other than that I don't have much to say.

--

I'm Anti-Christ


[ Parent ]
gbd and k5 (none / 1) (#301)
by MotorMachineMercenary on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:59:39 PM EST

are attacking the media with their own tools. Fight fire with fire, and all that.

Or we could be just trolling all y'all. Which is it, bub?

--
"What's next, sigging a k5er quote about sigging someone on k5?"


[ Parent ]
things like this make or break tourism industry (none / 1) (#265)
by pocopoco on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 10:03:16 PM EST

Well first, I actually hadn't heard of her before seeing this article.  If you don't like how the news is reporting on things then why do you watch it?

Second, your comparison to someone who went missing in Georgia misses a huge difference.  Tourism.  Tourism is the life blood of many of these islands.  It can be the difference between subsistence living and civilization.

Airlines, hotels, boating, shopping, restaurants - if people start thinking tourism is dangerous all these businesses and the vitality they pour into the economy will suffer.

Amen, sister concerning willful partying... (2.00 / 2) (#266)
by Not to be confused with Dixie on Thu Jul 07, 2005 at 10:21:55 PM EST

In response to this article and the follow up comments posted by Cateland... I agree 100 percent, though it sounds as if we don't care about this girl if we acknowledge that she might have been responsible for her own disappearance. I do think that we are in denial if we don't acknowledge that her friends said she left with these guys...not that she was carried away kicking and screaming. Also, nothing baout this is funny, but I did think it was hilarious when I read another board with some comments about drugs and which ones make you "promiscuous" and all without being detected in a beverage. The insinuation was that she never would have left without being tricked and never would have voluntarily taken anything. I posted a similar opinion on another site and received this response, seriously, from the moderator, who, by the way, refused to include my post: "YOU ARE TRULY A SICK WOMAN!!! GET HELP!!!" Seriously, including the caps. People are in denial. I do wish they would find the poor girl, however, that leads me to another notion to ponder...
Girls who wear glasses have specs appeal...
That was awesome! (3.00 / 5) (#269)
by caseyscrib on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 01:37:42 AM EST

Way to kick some ass! Fuck the media!

DON'T FEED THIS TROLL. <nt> (1.06 / 16) (#278)
by b4b0 on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 05:54:24 AM EST


WHORING: http://www.chrakworld.com
Welcome, newbies (3.00 / 15) (#280)
by Kasreyn on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 07:21:12 AM EST

I get the feeling a lot of you created k5 accounts just so they could comment on this story. That's great, we needed some new blood.

Just a tip though. k5 is a forum for thoughtful discussion of complicated issues typically ignored by the mainstream media. It's also a zoo stocked cheek by jowl with every species of hatemonger, troll, and misanthrope known to man. Expect to meet the most brilliant, interesting people you've ever found on the internet, and expect to be viciously attacked and insulted by people more unpleasant than you ever imagined people could be.

If you don't think you can handle that sort of experience, I'd suggest you leave now. Otherwise: good luck. :)

Oh, and read the Site FAQ before making an ass out of yourself.


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
Natalee (1.07 / 14) (#284)
by Amber24 on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 12:04:23 PM EST

Look, I as an American young woman, know the dangers of going places with strangers, ecspecially ones in other countries, when I am under the influence of alcohol. Don't think that Natalee, who is "very very smart" didn't know what she was getting herself into. We are different than Arubans, and they find that desirable. She should have made a pact with a friend that they look out for each other, not letting her drive off with 3 boys she barely knew, only to be making out with one of them. I think it's possible that she either stumbled into the water and drowned or died of overdosing. There is a reason that Joran's dad was heard saying " no body, no case". I really hope they find her. But, I have to say that in the meantime, while they are making sure everyone knows her story and sees her face, there are other kids missing and still going missing everyday, ones we could help to find if the information was out there. I know what Natalee looks like and if I close my eyes, I can see her. However, that doesn't do me any good, as I am here and she is not. I can't look for her, but I could be on the lookout for someone who goes missing here. I think alot of the reason she is getting so much attention, is because her mom is making sure of it, doing her job as a parent and not giving up till her kid is found. Maybe other mothers could take a lesson from her. I think all people who go missing are equally important, unless they are my family and then they are more important, but only to me, as should be the case with anyone, we always think ours are more important. Anyway, I hope all the missing children come home soon, but I do think that with all the money that is being spent trying to find her and all the media that is being taken up, we could try to even it out and try to bring more of our kids home!!! Unless her family is paying for everything, than it is up to them. Remember Brooke Wilberger, the pretty blond who went missing from an apartment complex right her in the united states, and it was only on the news for 2 weeks and now you don't ever hear about it. She is just as important as Natalee and more apt to being found, as she is here in the states with the rest of us. Let's remember them all and know all their faces, for we, like the waitress in the Shasta Groene case, may be able to help in bringing a helpless child home. Peace!

[ Parent ]
well, she knows how to cut and paste (3.00 / 3) (#299)
by Abominable Abitur on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:24:48 PM EST

congratulations!!

"Terrorism is only a viable "political activist" method for marginalized nutjobs, bottom line. The backlash that it causes makes it intractable for any reasonable ideology. Which is why you don't generally see wild athiest suicide bombers in america's streets." - lonelyhobo
[ Parent ]
It's girls like you (3.00 / 6) (#300)
by MotorMachineMercenary on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:58:20 PM EST

who are always cramping my style and telling that only hot chick in your group not to go home with me since I could be a deranged rapist. After all, I only want to get to know her better and maybe (maybe!) get a good night's kiss. This of course after a good consensual rogering in the good ol' poopah.

--
"What's next, sigging a k5er quote about sigging someone on k5?"


[ Parent ]
re: html formatting (none / 0) (#311)
by Kasreyn on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 11:37:48 PM EST

Welcome to k5. Hope you enjoy it here! When you're posting in html formatted mode, you have to supply *everything*, line breaks included. You can use [p] tags or [br] tags, both work fine. (Use angle brackets instead of the square ones in my example). There are also two other formatting options in the little drag box below the comment entry area.


"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
missing people (1.07 / 14) (#285)
by Amber24 on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 12:07:33 PM EST

Look, I as an American young woman, know the dangers of going places with strangers, ecspecially ones in other countries, when I am under the influence of alcohol. Don't think that Natalee, who is "very very smart" didn't know what she was getting herself into. We are different than Arubans, and they find that desirable. She should have made a pact with a friend that they look out for each other, not letting her drive off with 3 boys she barely knew, only to be making out with one of them. I think it's possible that she either stumbled into the water and drowned or died of overdosing. There is a reason that Joran's dad was heard saying " no body, no case". I really hope they find her. But, I have to say that in the meantime, while they are making sure everyone knows her story and sees her face, there are other kids missing and still going missing everyday, ones we could help to find if the information was out there. I know what Natalee looks like and if I close my eyes, I can see her. However, that doesn't do me any good, as I am here and she is not. I can't look for her, but I could be on the lookout for someone who goes missing here. I think alot of the reason she is getting so much attention, is because her mom is making sure of it, doing her job as a parent and not giving up till her kid is found. Maybe other mothers could take a lesson from her. I think all people who go missing are equally important, unless they are my family and then they are more important, but only to me, as should be the case with anyone, we always think ours are more important. Anyway, I hope all the missing children come home soon, but I do think that with all the money that is being spent trying to find her and all the media that is being taken up, we could try to even it out and try to bring more of our kids home!!! Unless her family is paying for everything, than it is up to them. Remember Brooke Wilberger, the pretty blond who went missing from an apartment complex right her in the united states, and it was only on the news for 2 weeks and now you don't ever hear about it. She is just as important as Natalee and more apt to being found, as she is here in the states with the rest of us. Let's remember them all and know all their faces, for we, like the waitress in the Shasta Groene case, may be able to help in bringing a helpless child home. Peace!

Jesus H Christ (2.88 / 18) (#286)
by undermyne on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 01:00:51 PM EST

Were you drunk when you wrote this? Your engerish teacher back at basketweaving school would have a stroke reading this post. Given that you are a woman, you are obiviously familiar with a period. Try using one a bit more often kk omg.


"Coffee makes me go poop." thekubrix
[ Parent ]
son... (none / 1) (#295)
by thekubrix on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 05:43:47 PM EST

you make me proud

*sniff*

[ Parent ]

That was truly golden. -nt (none / 1) (#330)
by Kasreyn on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 05:25:01 PM EST

bravo.
"Extenuating circumstance to be mentioned on Judgement Day:
We never asked to be born in the first place."

R.I.P. Kurt. You will be missed.
[ Parent ]
Fantastic (none / 1) (#338)
by livus on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 10:25:34 PM EST

this has got to be one of the only posts with "as you are a woman" that I've ever +3.

---
HIREZ substitute.
be concrete asshole, or shut up. - CTS
I guess I skipped school or something to drink on the internet? - lonelyhobo
I'd like to hope that any impression you got about us from internet forums was incorrect. - debillitatus
I consider myself trolled more or less just by visiting the site. HollyHopDrive

[ Parent ]
Great, you just gave me OCD (none / 0) (#349)
by shm on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 11:28:43 AM EST

I just need to keep coming back to this line.

[ Parent ]
Sigh. (none / 1) (#346)
by BJH on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 08:06:36 AM EST


We are different than Arubans

Yeah, you're idiots.

and they find that desirable

No, just exploitable.

Remember Brooke Wilberger

No.

the pretty blond

For chrissakes, not another blond please.

She is just as important as Natalee

Because she's blond?

she is here in the states with the rest of us

Speak for yourself, lady.

Was the only method of exposition you learned at school stream-of-consciousness, or do you deliberately write that way?

--
Roses are red, violets are blue.
I'm schizophrenic, and so am I.
-- Oscar Levant

[ Parent ]

F*** the Idiot that Wrote this NOT Natalee!!! (1.03 / 29) (#291)
by postingresponsetoanidiot on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 04:39:39 PM EST

Let me just note the bottom line: *Who cares what you care about. Who the hell are you? Guess what, I don't care about you at all. Take your negative attitude and F*** IT! *Natalee's family is the reason she gets all this attention - they love her and are forcing the world to recognize the issue. Way to go, Love. *That other girl's family - well - not so good. Maybe if they cared enough, they would get the attention of the press. Just a thought. *Your rail of Bill O'Reilly - jealous much? His communication vehicle is world wide and yours is some rinky dink website no one has ever heard of. *You are incredibly insensitive to this issue. I am sure if that other girl got attention, you would find a way to rail her and her family. *Lastly, get a job you F*** Looser!

Jesus (3.00 / 9) (#292)
by gbd on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 05:02:10 PM EST

The ridiculousness of this situation just grows and grows.  Sending the FBI, the Navy, the Dutch marines, and a trio of F-16s to Aruba to hunt down one missing girl is bad enough, but now they have apparently given Internet access to patients of the Betty Ford Clinic.

Where, oh God, where will it end?

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Betty Ford Clinic? (3.00 / 11) (#313)
by rusty on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 11:42:21 PM EST

Much worse than that. Bill O'Reilly fans.

If that's the choice, please send us more drunks.

____
Not the real rusty
[ Parent ]

lmao (none / 0) (#370)
by uptownpimp on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 05:07:21 PM EST

this is the funniest thing I have ever heard.

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
Guess what (3.00 / 7) (#293)
by LilDebbie on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 05:03:11 PM EST

You don't have to us asterisks when you write the word "fuck". Furthermore, your last usage didn't even have enough, unless I am unaware of some new slang term "Fuck Looser".

My name is LilDebbie and I have a garden.
- hugin -

[ Parent ]
Excuse me... (2.60 / 5) (#306)
by trhurler on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:27:42 PM EST

Actually, nobody cares what YOU think, as it happens. And I do mean nobody. You're a semiliterate dillweed who can't spell or use punctuation or capitalization correctly. That rinky web site nobody has ever heard of is currently rather highly ranked on Google searches for Natalee Holloway, by the way, so clearly a lot of people DO care what the author thinks. :)

--
'God dammit, your posts make me hard.' --LilDebbie

[ Parent ]
Nice. (none / 0) (#345)
by BJH on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 07:59:51 AM EST

Maybe if they cared enough, they would get the attention of the press.

Non-white, non-rich family's child goes missing, and it's their fault that the disappearance doesn't receive the same sort of attention as Holloway's getting?

Of course, it couldn't possibly be that the mass media knows semi-pretty young white women being abducted by non-white young males will sell well to the mildly retarded people who enjoy programs like Bill Reilly's, could it?
--
Roses are red, violets are blue.
I'm schizophrenic, and so am I.
-- Oscar Levant

[ Parent ]

Bapudi Times (2.40 / 5) (#296)
by thekubrix on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 06:02:58 PM EST

As co-editor of the Bapudi Times, I apologize and will no longer support any further articles regarding Natalee Holloway. Besides, she was probably a pot smoker.

She was smoking something (3.00 / 2) (#315)
by ProfaneBaby on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 12:55:28 AM EST

But I think you typo'd "pot" when you meant "pole"



Webcam / Video Blogs. Free accounts for women who post topless. I'm only kidding.
[ Parent ]
LOOF TNELOSNI (none / 0) (#589)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:14:51 AM EST

I think I found a website dedicated to your name at bapudi.com. During this search, I came across a title page with the words "INSOLENT FOOL." How ironic bapudi. I am impressed.

[ Parent ]
Hooray. (2.00 / 4) (#303)
by nion on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:00:16 PM EST

Well put. I could not have said it better myself.
-- John Settino, "Nion"
What are they trying to divert attention from? (2.88 / 9) (#304)
by harrystottle on Fri Jul 08, 2005 at 08:03:15 PM EST

We haven't "enjoyed" the Natalee story over here in britland, though I have spotted a couple of mentions of it as I surfed past the Fox News channel on my way to Discovery, so its almost interesting to have it explained in such detail. The question one should ask of Fox coverage is "what is it that they're trying to distract your attention from?" The obvious item missing from your list of concurrent news items is the G8 meeting at which - historically - the Bush admin has finally accepted that Global Warming is a real problem and that human activity has contributed to it. I'd be interested to learn whether Fox has covered that issue or dealt with its implications.

Mostly harmless
Not only Americans (2.83 / 6) (#314)
by the enzyme on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 12:29:27 AM EST

The same imbalance of media coverage concerning kidnappings has been happening in international news as well. Countless Iraqi citizens have been kidnapped since the beginning of the occupation, mostly by certain extremists seeking money. However the television news channels have barely touched on this subject, opting instead to focus on the single missing teen in Aruba.
Considering that I have been watching American news programs, it makes sense that they would favor stories about Americans over those about Iraqis, but the scale and importance of the issues should be taken into account as well.
Also, thanks for sharing your opinion on this issue, I look forward to reading more of your writing.

nice thought (none / 0) (#369)
by uptownpimp on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 04:53:03 PM EST

notice that none of the people against this arcticle responded to this.

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
You want the truth? (2.66 / 12) (#320)
by Fredrick Doulton on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:53:42 AM EST

Okay, here's the truth. She's white. She's from a middle-class suburban family with a minivan and a dog. You know, wholesome American values and all that.

No one gives a shit about the runaways from broken homes, or the poor and downtrodden folks from the 'hood'. People would rather forget about those things. And so they do.

Bush/Cheney 2004! - "Because we've still got more people to kill"

What are you doing about it? (none / 0) (#382)
by philly34 on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 11:39:16 AM EST

What are you doing about any of those things that you mentioned? Why do you continue to watch it on tv or take an interest of her story on the web? I love how everyone is saying they're tired of hearing about her story but yet, they're on here writing about her. Get a life really. If all you do is run around bitching and complaining find somewhere else to do it. This is an innocent girl that just vanished and her family is going through their worse nightmare! Have some compassion! If this happened to you, your family member, any loved one, you would want everything possible done for people to find you or for your family member or loved one to be found. Think before you speak.

[ Parent ]
You have a grand total of 2 comments (3.00 / 2) (#388)
by benna on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:31:42 PM EST

Don't tell us to go find somewhere else to complain.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Didn't I?? (none / 0) (#398)
by philly34 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 11:21:19 AM EST

I am pretty sure that I already did.

[ Parent ]
what truth? (none / 1) (#408)
by bamagirl on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:04:04 AM EST

What is the truth about that. Do you know Natalee, her family, where she is from? Ok well I do! Maybe you should no the truth before you post comments stating you do.

[ Parent ]
It's the media, stupid (2.00 / 6) (#321)
by Yoopy on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 08:42:34 AM EST

We in the USA suffer greatly at the hands of the media, but you can be sure that if Natalie or her family knew that the media knew there was any chance of either her getting killed or the media abusing her memory by creating a media circus around her, she would have never gone to Aruba.

Key point: The media is CONSERVATIVE. Very much so. It has not been liberal for 50 years. As such, as a conservative media is has to run stories about unseen baddies and innocent damsels harmed by them. It used to obsess about black baddies and white damsels. Today the baddies can be foreign, homeless, what have you.

We should expect this, and we should condemn the media for what it is: conservative.

Natalee Holloway (1.02 / 35) (#322)
by texasvirgochick on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 10:54:35 AM EST

you have every right to your opinion but until you have a child missing you dont have an opinion asshole! Too bad it wasnt you instead of her that went missing! Fucking bastard!

Why are perople Zeroing this? (none / 1) (#329)
by LittleZephyr on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 04:32:44 PM EST

This kind of idiocy should be seen.
(\♥/) What if instead of posting that comment,
(0.-) you had actually taken a knife and stabbed
("_") me in the eye? You murderer. ~ Rusty

[ Parent ]
People don't understand... (none / 1) (#341)
by skyknight on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 01:31:29 AM EST

that this kind of comment should be one'd, not zero'd, but hey, people don't understand things that are much more important as well. Such is life.

It's not much fun at the top. I envy the common people, their hearty meals and Bruce Springsteen and voting. --SIGNOR SPAGHETTI
[ Parent ]
RE: Natalee Holloway (none / 0) (#332)
by tannhaus on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 05:44:26 PM EST

you have every right to your opinion but until you have a child missing you dont have an opinion asshole!

Obviously, he does have an opinion. You just read it.

But, even if his child did go missing, do you think some foreign country would be sending jets up to search for his child? Do you think it would be making the news daily? No. Well, why is Natalee Holloway more important than his child, or the millions of children that go missing the world over? Why not take these hundreds of millions that people are willing to spend to find her and instead use it to try and bring home ALL missing children, not just her?

What makes her more important than my child or yours?

[ Parent ]
Ugandan children (none / 0) (#333)
by tannhaus on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 06:08:03 PM EST

Tell me, why is Natalee Hollaway more important than thousands of ugandan children that are abducted, raped, and killed every year? http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4734951

[ Parent ]
Contradictions and Semantics (none / 1) (#336)
by buddhaseviltwin on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 08:26:11 PM EST

you have every right to your opinion but until you have a child missing you dont have an opinion asshole!

  Doesn't "you don't have an opinion" by default translate to "you don't have a right to an opinion"?  It obviously doesn't translate into it's literal meaning.

  Either way, it seems pretty obvious this girl doesn't thing gdb has the right to his opinion, but is too spineless to admit she's pro-censorship.

  I'm not sure which is worse, people who speak out of both sides of thier mouth when it comes to censorship, or people who are openly pro-censorship.

 

[ Parent ]

Save your bullshit for someone else (none / 0) (#404)
by Polo555 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 09:21:30 PM EST



[ Parent ]
The above post is for uptownpimp (none / 0) (#405)
by Polo555 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 09:24:32 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Stupid people (none / 0) (#368)
by uptownpimp on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 04:50:52 PM EST

Why doesnt he have a right? Who are you to tell him otherwise? What right does the media have to voice their opinion? These people are fucking republicans and christian extremist from texas.

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
Right on!!!! (none / 0) (#403)
by Polo555 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 09:20:12 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Sure it's tragic but... (2.50 / 4) (#323)
by Anonymous Hiro on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 01:04:31 PM EST

The US people and the US media seem to have very skewed priorities.

Sure Natalee's life is important. But so are the lives of your friends, family and relatives. Maybe you should pay them more attention while they are still alive rather than make such a big fuss about some stranger far away.

Also much of these seems to be a distraction (intentional?) from bigger problems. And there are so many bigger problems, some of which we can have influence over, and some which we don't, but might wish to better prepare for.

Like US Gov's behaviour over so many things ("WMD", linking 9/11 with Iraq etc), and the fact that they seem to be allowed to get away with most of it.

The US e-voting farce (and the lack of public awareness about it).

Like the recent Saudi Arabia warnings about long term oil probs. Sure we know they are running out of oil, but they're saying stuff like 10 years more and the world has to find 4.5 million barrels a day from some where else. For perspective 4.5m b/d is more than what Iran (the 2nd largest OPEC oil producer) produces.

The first and second relate to: "Who controls the most powerful nation in the world". That affects lots of lives AND deaths.

The third is: not enough energy in just 10-15 years = big trouble for everyone. The US and China sure don't want to cut energy consumption.

If countries get desperate very BAD things could happen.

Even if the heart aches, the mind still has to work.

Place (1.00 / 2) (#324)
by Xerio on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 02:46:17 PM EST

I don't know if it's been covered or not but she's not from Alabama. She's from Clinton, Mississippi.
Ein Engel singt uber meinem Grab.
forgot this... (2.00 / 2) (#325)
by Xerio on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 02:50:10 PM EST

oh yeah..go Spain on the gay marriage being legal thing!!
Ein Engel singt uber meinem Grab.
[ Parent ]
clinton, mississippsassess (2.00 / 3) (#375)
by veasun on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 01:17:55 AM EST

mississippi or alabama...what's the diff? more or less red on the neck? and like who cares.

[ Parent ]
clinton (1.00 / 2) (#472)
by alabama2 on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 02:49:03 PM EST

She moved to alabama from mississippi in 8th grade.

[ Parent ]
and like...... (1.14 / 7) (#512)
by Polo555 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 07:13:47 PM EST

And like your stupid. And like i could like understand if like natalee was like stupid like you. But like she's NOT.

[ Parent ]
No she is not!! (1.25 / 4) (#409)
by bamagirl on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:08:14 AM EST

Ok I don't know where you got that from, but Natalee is not from Clinton, MS. She is from Mountain Brook, AL (a suburb outside of Birmingham). I would know, I went to high school with Natalee.

[ Parent ]
Totally Sick of Natalee (2.90 / 10) (#331)
by borusredrum on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 05:36:57 PM EST

Natalee's mother is the one to blame. She sent her daughter on a trip with a bunch of other kids to a country where the drinking age is lower. Oh yes, the news hasn't reported THAT little tidbit, but that's why these Caribbean hotspots are so popular for "Senior Week" parties. Hell, most of the "Senior Week" trips aren't even chaperoned by adults, but rather 'adult siblings' of the kids going. Therefore, it's party and drink 24/7. Bottom Line: Natalee's big mouthed mother made a poor decision, and hopefully other parents will think twice before sending their spawn off to drink themselves silly in a foreign country. Also, Natalee herself is to blame. Being out alone, in a bar, drunk at 2AM and taking a ride from strangers? That yields no sympathy from me, honey.

"Sick Of Natalee!" (1.00 / 13) (#334)
by OneMoreMother on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 06:56:14 PM EST

If you are 'so totally sick' of Natalee, why do you continue to write the replies, responses and editorials filled with such disdain? I am sure that any child of yours must be above reproach and any parenting skills you possess are without a doubt set down by legends. Your lack of compassion and instantaneous judgement are appalling. Were you there? Did you chaperone the group? Have you arranged the senior activities? Did you see Natalee drinking? How did you become so knowledgeable on the subject of Aruba and it's tourist?

[ Parent ]
Shut up (none / 1) (#348)
by borusredrum on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 10:52:21 AM EST

Why do you continue to defend her and her mother? I know all this about Aruba because I happened to do a little research, and I've worked in a high school where one of these trips were planned by a group of parents. Drinking is the reason the kids go to another country. Why the fuck else would she be in a bar at 2AM? To get drunk and/or get laid. DUH.

[ Parent ]
"Sick Of Natalee!" (1.00 / 10) (#335)
by OneMoreMother on Sat Jul 09, 2005 at 07:01:58 PM EST

If you are 'so totally sick' of Natalee, why do you continue to write the replies, responses and editorials filled with such disdain? I am sure that any child of yours must be above reproach and any parenting skills you possess are without a doubt set down by legends. Your lack of compassion and instantaneous judgement are appalling. Were you there? Did you chaperone the group? Have you arranged the senior activities? Did you see Natalee drinking? How did you become so knowledgeable on the subject of Aruba and it's tourist?

[ Parent ]
FUCK ALL OF U!!!!!! (1.00 / 15) (#351)
by BostonGirl78 on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 02:41:44 PM EST

YOu know, I think it's pathetic how all these people are just talking shit about Natalee and her family! She didn't ask to go missing and maybe killed, this isn't her fault. Her mom didn't ask to have to go through this hell to find her daughter. Come on u r saying that kids only go to other countries so they can drink? Get real!!! First of all, I don't drink and I have been to Aruba, Mexico, and the Virgin Islands. I was 16-18 at the time of my trips. Second of all, if I was an underage drinker, I think I would rather have an older friend buy me alcohol at a local store than spend thousands of dollars to go to a foreign country just to drink!!! And no one knows if Natalee was even drunk. Oh but wait the suspects said she was so that must be correct right? I am also sick of people saying that she is getting all this media coverage cause she is white. Does anyone remember a few weeks ago when the little boys were found dead in the trunk of a car? They were hispanic and had tons of media coverage from the time they went missing till they were found. Personally I don't think it matters what color or race u r. I think it depends on the situation. Natalee is an American missing in a foreign country w/little crime. She basically just vanished, there is no sign of her being dead or alive so it's a mystery. How often does this happen. I mean, I know it has before but it doesn't happen that often. Her mom is also fighting to find her and is willing to always talk to the media. Come on people, wouldn't u do the same if it was your family member or if u thought your child was dead? Natalee's mom didn't "send" her to Aruba and it's not her fault, Natalee is 18 years old (an adult), I'm sure she would have went whether her mother let her or not, it was a senior trip. Why would her mom say no? I don't care, I say Fuck all of u who don't care about this story. If u don't like it, stop writing/reading about it and don't watch it on tv!!!! I don't care what anyone says, if my kid was missing I'd keep the story alive as much as possible and do whatever the hell I could to find my kid! No matter what anyone says!!! Ya'll need a life!

[ Parent ]
Netspeak = Idiot (none / 1) (#358)
by borusredrum on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 05:37:30 PM EST

I could almost take you seriously if you could form a sentence correctly. Please go back to high school, little girl.

[ Parent ]
Ya, u make sense!!!!!! (1.00 / 7) (#361)
by BostonGirl78 on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 10:40:55 PM EST

Ya, ok, u make sense!!!!

[ Parent ]
hey (none / 0) (#380)
by Jason the Mathematical Solo Guitarist on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 09:49:45 AM EST

a/s/l lol

i totally agree w/u about natalle, fuck these guys, these guys think there realy smart but we know they aren't

have ne pics online? ;-)

In a math sense this sig is just applied group theory: what we are talking about is the decomposition of the direct product of 2 irreducible representations of the rotation group into a direct sum of irreducible representations
[ Parent ]

Natalie Holloway Disappearance In Aruba (none / 0) (#519)
by Barney1938 on Sat Jul 23, 2005 at 11:05:47 PM EST

7-23-05 Jason: you fuckin nerd, this aint about math, or about complex mathematical solutions, theories etc. its about life, which you obviously know nothing about. Get you dick outa ya hand and the weed outa ya mouth, and if possible, you head outa a book, please, before its too late. Dixie

[ Parent ]
Natalie Holloway Disappearance In Aruba (none / 1) (#520)
by Barney1938 on Sat Jul 23, 2005 at 11:12:39 PM EST

7-23-05 You go girl. I liked your blog, and the way you told all these fuckin bloggers that dont give a damned about Natalie, or her family, to go fuck themselves. I like that attitude a lot. I have to catch myself from time to time, saying it when and where I shouldnt. I see up there in Boston, you all are having you share of grief, bad priests, gay marriages, you name its a societal problem. Drop me a line now and again, when you have the spare time. Barney 1938 here or www.blogger.com Dixie Ramblins

[ Parent ]
16-18 yo in Aruba, Mexico and Virgin Islands? (none / 0) (#650)
by MotorMachineMercenary on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 07:36:39 AM EST

Couldn't get dick in high school so you had to go get yourself de-virginized in the Caribbean, eh? Several times.

Don't insult me with any excuses. We know why white girls go to the Caribbean and Mediterranean countries. It's the same reason why white guys go to Thailand and Brazil. The only difference is guys don't pretend to go there for "the beaches, scenery and culture," when in fact they are going there to get laid by exotic women.

--
"What's next, sigging a k5er quote about sigging someone on k5?"


[ Parent ]
Pointing finger (none / 0) (#588)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:06:15 AM EST

How many more stones do you have in your pocket?

[ Parent ]
WHY IS EVERYONE BLAMING NATALEE AND HER MOM???? (1.17 / 17) (#352)
by BostonGirl78 on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 02:43:18 PM EST

YOu know, I think it's pathetic how all these people are just talking shit about Natalee and her family! She didn't ask to go missing and maybe killed, this isn't her fault. Her mom didn't ask to have to go through this hell to find her daughter. Come on u r saying that kids only go to other countries so they can drink? Get real!!! First of all, I don't drink and I have been to Aruba, Mexico, and the Virgin Islands. I was 16-18 at the time of my trips. Second of all, if I was an underage drinker, I think I would rather have an older friend buy me alcohol at a local store than spend thousands of dollars to go to a foreign country just to drink!!! And no one knows if Natalee was even drunk. Oh but wait the suspects said she was so that must be correct right? I am also sick of people saying that she is getting all this media coverage cause she is white. Does anyone remember a few weeks ago when the little boys were found dead in the trunk of a car? They were hispanic and had tons of media coverage from the time they went missing till they were found. Personally I don't think it matters what color or race u r. I think it depends on the situation. Natalee is an American missing in a foreign country w/little crime. She basically just vanished, there is no sign of her being dead or alive so it's a mystery. How often does this happen. I mean, I know it has before but it doesn't happen that often. Her mom is also fighting to find her and is willing to always talk to the media. Come on people, wouldn't u do the same if it was your family member or if u thought your child was dead? Natalee's mom didn't "send" her to Aruba and it's not her fault, Natalee is 18 years old (an adult), I'm sure she would have went whether her mother let her or not, it was a senior trip. Why would her mom say no? I don't care, I say Fuck all of u who don't care about this story. If u don't like it, stop writing/reading about it and don't watch it on tv!!!! I don't care what anyone says, if my kid was missing I'd keep the story alive as much as possible and do whatever the hell I could to find my kid! No matter what anyone says!!! Ya'll need a life!

i have only given you a +3 (none / 0) (#353)
by s4f50k on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 04:01:46 PM EST

because you must be a troll.

[ Parent ]
Are you for real??? [nt] (none / 0) (#359)
by Razitshakra on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 05:53:24 PM EST



--
Lets ride / You and I / In the midnight ambulance
- The Northern Territories
[ Parent ]
So what! (1.00 / 2) (#362)
by BostonGirl78 on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 10:43:30 PM EST

I don't know what the hell giving me a 3 means because I'm new out here. I could care less. Wow, don't scare me.

[ Parent ]
More often than you think (1.20 / 5) (#377)
by VeruccaAsault on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:04:32 AM EST

----------Quoted from BostonGirl78 there is no sign of her being dead or alive so it's a mystery. How often does this happen. I mean, I know it has before but it doesn't happen that often.------------ Amy Bradley anyone?? http://www.tggweb.com/amybradley/amy-story.htm FOUL PLAY is suspected in the March 24, 1998, mysterious disappearance of AMY LYNN BRADLEY...a vibrant, beautiful and intelligent 23 years young girl who recently graduated college and has a very promising future. She was on a vacation cruise with her family in the Caribbean at the time of her disappearance. AMY is an American citizen who 'vanished' while aboard a foreign vessel in international waters. She was leisurely traveling with her mother, father and younger brother aboard the cruise ship Rhapsody of the Seas (a Norwegian Flag Ship) which is owned and operated by Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines of Miami, Florida. The cruise ship was near docking procedures into port in the island of Curacao, Netherlands Antilles, the Caribbean. It is known that Amy left her Cabin in the wee hours of the morning of March 24, 1998, with her cigarettes and lighter...predictably she was not wearing shoes because where she thought she was going, she would not be gone long and would not need her shoes. This is where the mystery begins! Who was Amy going to meet at this time of the morning? Why would she take her cigarettes and lighter? There are many questions here that need answering, but unfortunately neither Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines nor any Government authorities are providing any answers and, at this time, it appears that neither of these entities are making any inquiries at all regarding Amy's disappearance. It is known that the last person seen with Amy in the early hours of the morning was a cruise ship band member of a group known as 'Blue Orchid' by the name of 'Yellow'...and, there were other crew members who spent time with Amy, as well...Katalin (from Hungary); Eduardo Cabrito (a waiter); David Cato (a waiter); and, Patrick (a waiter). It is also known that Amy had no reason to run away...her background and her family's backgrounds have been checked thoroughly by the FBI and Amy shows no signs of a 'runaway profile' nor are any of the Bradley family members suspect. One scenario suggests that Amy may have willingly met with a crew member who she had come to trust who then put her in a position of coercion, or even more probable, Amy may have observed an illegal activity and become a liability. There are many unanswered questions that require answers. Why would a multi-million cruise line not help in the search for Amy? To this date Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines, owners of the cruise ship, have not cooperated at all with the Bradley family by way of information or assistance or cooperation. Mainstream media is taking a very close look at Amy Bradley's disappearance. The bottom line is that Ron and Iva Bradley went on the Rhapsody of the Seas cruise ship to the Caribbean in March of 1998 and came back to their home in Virginia WITHOUT their daughter, Amy. Brother Brad came home to Virginia WITHOUT his sister, Amy. Amy Bradley's disappearance is indeed a mystery! As to what has happened to Amy...it is believed that there are certain individuals in the Caribbean and possibly even South America who have knowledge of Amy's whereabouts. If you have information or know someone who knows something, PLEASE contact us by the telephone, fax or e-mail listed below. If you are having difficulties with e-mail, please try our submission form. THERE IS A $250,000.00 (QUARTER OF A MILLION US DOLLARS) REWARD FOR INFORMATION LEADING TO AMY'S SAFE RETURN. THERE IS ALSO A $50,000.00 (FIFTY THOUSAND US DOLLARS) REWARD FOR INFORMATION LEADING TO HER VERIFIABLE LOCATION. So Yeah, it happens more often than you think!

[ Parent ]
I did not read this post /nt (none / 0) (#395)
by destroy all monsters on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 06:54:44 AM EST



"My opinion: You're gay, a troll, a gay troll, or in serious need of antidepressants." - horny smurf to Lemon Juice
[ Parent ]
I know it happens (1.00 / 2) (#429)
by BostonGirl78 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 09:11:27 PM EST

I know it does happen and I have heard of Amy's story and there was also a man from Conn. who went missing from a cruise ship last week while on his honeymoon and he has still not been found. My point is that it's just so mean for people out here to be saying all these bad things about Natalee and her family just because the news is constantly covering her story. Shouldn't everyone be mad at the media and take it out on them for the constant attention on the case? Why talk shit about the family?

[ Parent ]
I approve. (2.42 / 7) (#354)
by UCF BullitNutz on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 04:22:11 PM EST

Fuck Natalee.

To me, she represents everything about my generation I have tried to separate myself from. Went on a trip to some Caribbean island, more than likely got excessively drunk, then shacked up with guys she probably met at a bar, or near a bar. Given, they probably didn't kill her and hide the pieces. Dumb broad probably walked off the end of a dock, knocked herself out on the way down, and was carried out to sea. However, the point still stands. Binge drinking isn't always a good thing.
----------
" It ain't a successful troll until the admin shuts off new user registration for half a year." - godix

CONGRATULATIONS! (1.28 / 21) (#355)
by HollyHopDrive on Sun Jul 10, 2005 at 04:38:24 PM EST

Sensational, dramatic and unnecessarily inflammatory and provocative headline? Check!

Biased copy designed to influence the reader into taking the author's view rather than present simple facts clearly and objectively? Check!

Delight taken in horrified responses and immense publicity in the form of Google hits? Check!

Congratulations! You have proved yourself to be on the same level, morally and professionally, as the very journalists and media outlets you criticise! Takes one to know one, indeed. You should have no trouble finding a job as a tabloid editor. Your papers will fly off the shelves!


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.

Wrong (none / 0) (#365)
by gbd on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 03:32:02 PM EST

Sensational, dramatic and unnecessarily inflammatory and provocative headline? Check!

The headline has been sufficiently explained.

Biased copy designed to influence the reader into taking the author's view rather than present simple facts clearly and objectively? Check!

You castigate me for trying to "influence the reader" into taking my view in an op-ed piece?  Sweet Odin's Raven, woman, what precisely were you expecting?  Perhaps I should be trying to influence readers into taking somebody else's view?  This whole piece is pretty straightforward to begin with.  The brief passage where I engage in speculation is clearly labeled as such, which is more than can be expected from most sources.

Delight taken in horrified responses and immense publicity in the form of Google hits? Check!

Patently false.  Not only did I not write the followup story, I didn't even vote for it.  This being K5, the voting record is on display for all to see -- check for yourself, if you're so inclined.  I do not think that the hate mail should have been posted as a story.  I believe it should have been in a diary entry instead, and I made these feelings known in an editorial comment to the followup story.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

You're a natural (none / 1) (#372)
by HollyHopDrive on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 06:14:44 PM EST

You have to get an explosive headline because that's what grabs attention. And apparently, this is a tired story, so it needed a good kick. Well, you knew this. That's why you made the headline "Fuck Natalee Holloway". You must have realised this was potentially offensive and sensational. Certainly several people suggested you change it and you didn't. You could have said "Stupid Media" or "Missing White Girl Sensationalism", but you knew "Fuck Natalee Holloway" would get attention, and who cares if it was misleading? (Why, exactly, did you use that headline if the first thing you were going to say was "well, not really, of course"?) The point is, you grabbed attention. You did it damn well. Well done.

And yes, obviously it's your opinion - just as the tabloids are full of their own opinions, right? Just like they're all apparently telling you to put your life on hold until Miss Holloway is found. (I'm English and over here there's been barely a peep about her - a few brief reports when she went missing and nothing since. I bet the average Briton has no idea who she is.) You had a point you wanted to sell to your readers to get them to agree with you and to get a more interesting piece. And consequently, it sold like hot cakes, I mean it got voted to FP, overpowered Google and caused a storm of controversy. It's fantastic. Now do you see where sensational journalism gets its success?

You may not have written the follow up story, but I don't believe for a second you wrote this piece, with that headline - that several people suggested you change - expecting a mere murmur in response. You got exactly what you set out for - sensation, reaction and, while now there are many people who'd like to see you dead, you've got a strong, staunch following of fans. If you have no enemies, you have no character, after all. Your story and your name will stick in many minds for a long time. You've done brilliantly.

Hell, you're a natural. I'm serious - go into journalism, you've got the flair. You're even better at justifying it than I am.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

What's wrong w/being an attention whore? (none / 1) (#373)
by nlscb on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 06:35:22 PM EST

I'm I engaged in all of the same tactics you described.

I'm just jealous I didn't get more comments.

Comment Search has returned - Like a beaten wife, I am pathetically grateful. - mr strange
[ Parent ]

I'm not criticising his approach (none / 0) (#379)
by HollyHopDrive on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 04:55:07 AM EST

Hell, I'm a journalist myself. I'm just noting that he's used all the very tactics journalists and the meeja are usually criticised for. Inflammatory and misleading headlines, biased copy and, apparently, dull and overused subject matter.

Seriously, if I had written a story like this it would never have done so well. I would have headlined it something like: "Natalee Holloway - Disproportion, Coverage and the Meeja" or something like that. And my intro would have been something inoffensive and dull like, "You must have heard of Natalee Holloway. She's the young girl who went missing in Aruba in May and sparked a media frenzy, and consequently an enormous search party. Nobody can deny her family and friends must be going through hell. But exactly how much coverage is necessary to give this story due prominence and keep to your journalistic duties of reporting as much news as thoroughly as possible?"

Seriously, it would have been lucky to limp out of the queue and I can't imagine it would have made front page. And do you think it would have coshed Google and Natalee's official site, attracting dozens of new users? Even those who signed up just to denigrate k5 and the author still bought the paper, I mean signed up to k5.

If his paper and mine had been in competition over this story, he would have won and I'd be clearing my desk. That's my point. He used a deliberately inflammatory and offensive - and misleading headline, since he's quick to point out he doesn't really wish Natalee any harm. And passionate copy, which, by nature, can't be objective. As a result, he's a hit. I'm just surprised he didn't notice this is exactly what the media he's criticising have been doing.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Well (none / 0) (#389)
by gbd on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 05:57:39 PM EST

I'm just noting that he's used all the very tactics journalists and the meeja are usually criticised for. Inflammatory and misleading headlines, biased copy and, apparently, dull and overused subject matter.

You declined this invitation last time, so I'll ask again: Can you provide an example of this "biased copy" from the story? I'm not trying to be flippant here. I'm just trying to understand the objection to "biased copy" in a piece that is clearly labeled as opinion. If I had inserted a blatantly out-of-place political rant in a story that purported to be objective "hard news", then that would be one thing, but this is a complete editorial from start to finish, and I've done nothing to conceal that fact.

Incidentally, the fact that the subject matter is overused is, well, sort of the whole point.

He used a deliberately inflammatory and offensive - and misleading headline, since he's quick to point out he doesn't really wish Natalee any harm.

You're right; I don't wish Natalee any harm, nor did I intend to convey (through the headline) that I do. By "Natalee Holloway", I'm referring to the story of Natalee, not the person. If I were to ask 100 random Americans for their thoughts on Watergate, I would wager that virtually all of them would assume that I was talking about the story of Watergate, not the Watergate Hotel itself. Maybe this is difficult to conceptualize for somebody who hasn't been relentlessly bombarded with this story (as many Americans have) but that was the intent.

So inflammatory, yes, but misleading? I don't think so.

And passionate copy, which, by nature, can't be objective. As a result, he's a hit. I'm just surprised he didn't notice this is exactly what the media he's criticising have been doing.

I'm beginning to believe that I am being trolled here, for I have difficulty understanding why such a simple concept is (apparently) so difficult to grasp. So I'll explain this one more time, very slowly and succinctly. If this last explanation is not sufficient, then I fear that this dialogue can have no further purpose.

You will notice a pair of abbreviated words in parenthesis immediately following the title of this story. Those words are "Op-Ed." Expanding those abbreviation yields the words "opinion" and "editorial", respectively. You ceaselessly lambast me for being passionate, biased, and opinionated. These are three qualities I would expect out of an Op-Ed piece. The media I am criticising are running this story as hard news. Even as late as last night, they are giving this story more visibility than other mundane topics, such as terrorist bombings in London, and that's bullshit. (Oh, no! Passion! Opinion! There I go again!)

You say you're a journalist. Good for you! I'm not. I'm a systems engineer. I have no interest in journalism. Furthermore, while writing this piece, I had no interest in dispassion. I wanted to express an opinion, I did, and I never once claimed that it was anything but an opinion. My advice to you: If editorials routinely upset you so, you may want to refrain from reading them in the future.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

I know it's an opinion (none / 0) (#390)
by HollyHopDrive on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 06:40:50 PM EST

And it's a very valid one. Just as many tabloids carry valid opinions, even if they are handled a little too hardly or sensationally. Certainly a lot of people agree with you, and if I lived in America I'm sure I would as well.

My point is that you've used a lot of the same tactics you seem to criticise the meeja using. You could have written an objective, calm discursive essay about the meeja, which would have been intelligent and informed but dull as ditchwater. You could have made your point with the headline "Fuck the Natalee Holloway Story" or "Fuck the Media", or even "Fuck the Media As They've Fucked Natalee Holloway". But you didn't, despite suggestions that you should. And if you had taken a less explosive headline and less passionate tone, would your story have coshed Google, caused a storm, ranked up a list of comments as long as my arm and nabbed you dozens of eternally loyal fans? Probably not.

Isn't sensation fantastic?

For the record, editorials don't upset me. I'd be screwed if they did. Well, some of them anger me, but this wasn't one of them. I read your article and for the most part agreed with it. I just thought it was funny to criticise the meeja by taking on their tactics. I did think your headline was in poor taste and inappropriate, but then look at the success it achieved, and the huge fan base you've gathered now. This story has done a shedload better - in voting scores, comments and Google hits - than my short-short stories one.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Using F-16's (2.20 / 5) (#363)
by Confusion on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 07:38:31 AM EST

Actually, it's not uncommon for F-16's to assist in missing persons cases, at least in the Netherlands. From the sky, freshly dug graves are relatively easy to find.
--
Any resemblance between the above and reality is purely coincidental.
So why not use a Cessna-172? (none / 1) (#385)
by edremy on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:07:59 PM EST

You could fly a dozen or more for the cost of that single F-16. The Cessna does about 80 knots airpseed as opposed to 400, giving you lots more time to spot a grave. It's high-wing so you get an excellent down view. You can have a observer sit next to you with a pair of binoculars, unlike the single seat F-16. It can easily fly out of tiny airstrips.

Even better, helicopters. Even a A-10 would be a fair better choice, although I assume the Netherlands don't own any.

[ Parent ]

Low Altitude Navigation and Targeting Infrared for (2.00 / 2) (#396)
by nr1 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 11:17:32 AM EST

I'm sure many Cessnas have IR sensors mounted in them.

[ Parent ]
you don't need them, because (none / 0) (#585)
by vivelame on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:52:04 AM EST

in a cessna, you're not going at 400 knots at 200 feet from the ground.

--
Jonathan Simon: "When the autopsy of our democracy is performed, it is my belief that media silence will be given as the primary cause of death."
[ Parent ]
I think IR is the key here. (none / 0) (#645)
by SoupIsGoodFood on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 03:45:39 AM EST

Spotting a grave in a large area from a plane is probably very hard to do with normal light. It probably stands out a lot more in IR. I imagine it's something to do with the difference in soil temperature.

[ Parent ]
F-16s ? (none / 0) (#392)
by tuvock on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 10:59:54 PM EST

how can a F-16 deploy sonar from the air at 100 + knots ??????

[ Parent ]
gbd's story about Natalee Holloway (1.50 / 8) (#366)
by Pierre0302 on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 04:16:37 PM EST

I fully u/stand your way of thinking and I agree with your point. However, pls don't use the words 'fuck' coz it really sounds that you dont care about natalee or her family at all. Pierre

he doesnt (3.00 / 4) (#367)
by uptownpimp on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 04:43:02 PM EST

No one cares about her but her family and friends. Everyones tied up with its entertainment value. Skip the latest blockbuster, the news is more entertaining.

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
Media? (1.25 / 4) (#371)
by uptownpimp on Mon Jul 11, 2005 at 05:13:16 PM EST

Could this site be considered part of the media?

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
Only if we were dillusional (1.50 / 2) (#374)
by IceTitan on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 12:43:13 AM EST

about what we are, a community of trolls.
Which we are. What the MSM really is.
Nuke 'em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
[ Parent ]
en re media insanity (2.83 / 6) (#376)
by jmd2121 on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 01:23:28 AM EST

About a year ago I stopped watching TV.  Not only do I not miss it, I can't stand it having it near me.  TV is awful.  I do not own one.  Shows I enjoy I download.

I now turn the TV off in all public places that I can and avoid those I can't.  I leave the homes of people who keep it on.   TV is an insidious invasion into all sane human interactions.  I frown at people who drivel on about TV programs.  My friends don't mind at all.  Those who do mind aren't close friends any more.

The mass human stupidity associated generally with TV and very specifically with "news programs" on TV is now completely comical and sad to me.  

In short -- GOOD FOR YOU.  Those who would criticize you are still brainwashed.

Old Habits (none / 0) (#535)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 11:22:22 AM EST

Too bad this is not just a TV program. Good for you for kicking the habit and giving up such a nasty addiction. Do you at least read the paper? How do you get your news of the world? Or do you just live in a cave and eat with your fingers?

[ Parent ]
Way more often than you think... (1.00 / 15) (#378)
by VeruccaAsault on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:10:36 AM EST

FOUL PLAY is suspected in the March 24, 1998, mysterious disappearance of AMY LYNN BRADLEY...a vibrant, beautiful and intelligent 23 years young girl who recently graduated college and has a very promising future. She was on a vacation cruise with her family in the Caribbean at the time of her disappearance. AMY is an American citizen who 'vanished' while aboard a foreign vessel in international waters. She was leisurely traveling with her mother, father and younger brother aboard the cruise ship Rhapsody of the Seas (a Norwegian Flag Ship) which is owned and operated by Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines of Miami, Florida. The cruise ship was near docking procedures into port in the island of Curacao, Netherlands Antilles, the Caribbean. It is known that Amy left her Cabin in the wee hours of the morning of March 24, 1998, with her cigarettes and lighter...predictably she was not wearing shoes because where she thought she was going, she would not be gone long and would not need her shoes. This is where the mystery begins! Who was Amy going to meet at this time of the morning? Why would she take her cigarettes and lighter? There are many questions here that need answering, but unfortunately neither Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines nor any Government authorities are providing any answers and, at this time, it appears that neither of these entities are making any inquiries at all regarding Amy's disappearance. It is known that the last person seen with Amy in the early hours of the morning was a cruise ship band member of a group known as 'Blue Orchid' by the name of 'Yellow'...and, there were other crew members who spent time with Amy, as well...Katalin (from Hungary); Eduardo Cabrito (a waiter); David Cato (a waiter); and, Patrick (a waiter). It is also known that Amy had no reason to run away...her background and her family's backgrounds have been checked thoroughly by the FBI and Amy shows no signs of a 'runaway profile' nor are any of the Bradley family members suspect. One scenario suggests that Amy may have willingly met with a crew member who she had come to trust who then put her in a position of coercion, or even more probable, Amy may have observed an illegal activity and become a liability. There are many unanswered questions that require answers. Why would a multi-million cruise line not help in the search for Amy? To this date Royal Caribbean Cruise Lines, owners of the cruise ship, have not cooperated at all with the Bradley family by way of information or assistance or cooperation. Mainstream media is taking a very close look at Amy Bradley's disappearance. The bottom line is that Ron and Iva Bradley went on the Rhapsody of the Seas cruise ship to the Caribbean in March of 1998 and came back to their home in Virginia WITHOUT their daughter, Amy. Brother Brad came home to Virginia WITHOUT his sister, Amy. Amy Bradley's disappearance is indeed a mystery! As to what has happened to Amy...it is believed that there are certain individuals in the Caribbean and possibly even South America who have knowledge of Amy's whereabouts. If you have information or know someone who knows something, PLEASE contact us by the telephone, fax or e-mail listed below. If you are having difficulties with e-mail, please try our submission form. THERE IS A $250,000.00 (QUARTER OF A MILLION US DOLLARS) REWARD FOR INFORMATION LEADING TO AMY'S SAFE RETURN. THERE IS ALSO A $50,000.00 (FIFTY THOUSAND US DOLLARS) REWARD FOR INFORMATION LEADING TO HER VERIFIABLE LOCATION.

Amy (none / 1) (#587)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:03:03 AM EST

I keep Amy in my prayers for her safe return home.

[ Parent ]
Cannot believe how insensitive people can be (1.15 / 13) (#381)
by philly34 on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 11:27:10 AM EST

For you to title that story "F*ck Natalle Holloway" is probably the most insensitive thing that I've ever seen. Just because people and the media take interest in her story does not make us wrong or "brainwashed." The media still reports on it because people are interested about her and what is going on. It's not like the media has been reporting on this for two years, it's been less than two months. I'm sure if your kid or someone you love went missing you would do everything possible to make sure that everyone, everywhere knew her name, face and story and can you blame Natalee's mother for doing so, not me, not at all! I think she is doing a great job in keeping the attention on this case. She was there from the moment that she heard her daughter went missing and hasn't left since and I wish her and her family the best in helping solve this case. In no way is this her mother's fault that her child is missing. Natalee is 18 years old, I know that I can remember when I was 18 and how much I wanted to do things on my own, go places on my own, my parents were reluctant but I was able to go because I was 18 and did what I had to do to show that I was mature enough. It's not like she sent Natalee there with three guys and no adults, there were more than 100 students and chaperons. The only person(s) wrong in this case are those, if any, that had something to do with her disappearance. I wish her and her family the best. For you to say that us giving our attention to this case is wrong because there are other people missing is absurd, I believe Natalee's mother has A LOT to do with the attention that this case is getting and I commend her.

I don't blame her mother (none / 1) (#387)
by benna on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 03:24:24 PM EST

I don't blame her mother for pressuring the media to cover the story.  I'm sure that's what I would do.  I blame the editors (or the TV equivolent) for not making a decision not to cover it after the first day or two.  Two months is a long time.  Most stories live around three days tops.  The story doesn't really blame her mother, it blames the media.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Amen (1.16 / 6) (#391)
by Polo555 on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 08:07:49 PM EST

Amen!!!!! I also can't believe how insensitive people can be. Put them in Beth Holloway's shoes. I bet they would take every word back.

[ Parent ]
I think its pathetic you know the mother's name nt (3.00 / 5) (#393)
by benna on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 11:16:05 PM EST


-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
I think your pathetic (none / 1) (#406)
by Polo555 on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 09:27:31 PM EST



[ Parent ]
I don't care (2.50 / 4) (#383)
by nietsch on Tue Jul 12, 2005 at 01:08:16 PM EST

Although it is a sad loss for her parents/family/friends and the (probably late) Natalee herself, I really don't see any news about her if I don't go looking for it. Although you may have a point that the media you watch are hyped and biased, you fail to make the obvious conclusion: those media are not worth to be wached. There still is a switch on your tv, and you are clicking with that mouse.

The media - reporting to make the most profits (2.50 / 2) (#399)
by truthseeker on Wed Jul 13, 2005 at 03:07:59 PM EST

It appears that many comments on gbd's article on Natalee Holloway have compeletely missed his point - diverging from the extremes of boycotting the K5 site to doing gbd personal bodily harm. The points gbd makes in his article have been overshadowed by the poor choice for the first word in his title - a choice that leads one to beleive he is at best insensitive to the Holloway's plight. His point was why such disproportionate media coverage for an event that occurs (sadly) too often in North America. What makes Natalee so special to have F-16's from the Netherlands fly down to take part in the search or have the entire Aruban government shut down for half a day to partake in the SAR. I can understand it, though not accept it, for someone like JFK jr a few years back when his plane went down and most of the coast guard on the east coast took part in his search. There are a confluence of factors here (in no particular order): upper middle class wealth; popular tourist destination that desperately needs to protect that image - or else its sinks to third world economic status; relatively close proximity to USA; white attractive (popular?) female; strong willed, proactive, and very vocal mother. I beleive its the last two points that tipped the camel's back so to speak. But the point regarding CNN, Fox, MSNBC is that they're businesses seeking to make ratings and money. Period. They so distort the significance of events and put unabashed spin on stories that while 500,000 people can die in 4 weeks in Rwanda and most Americans can't locate Rwanda on a map, Americans can tell me the names of the inlets where sharks feed around the island of Aruba. The same media distortion occurs when a black man accused of killing his wife (OJ) is acquitted as opposed to a white man (Robert Blake) is acquitted for his. The stories that get attention on the infotainment outlets CNN, Fox, etc must appeal to that segment of the population to where advertiser's money will do the most good. The segment that has disposable income - i.e. middle class and up. It is to this segment, and what they value, consume, find important, that the media outlets cater to. Natalee was one of us, more so than Reyna Gabriella.

This is news to me (none / 1) (#454)
by uptownpimp on Sun Jul 17, 2005 at 08:29:55 PM EST

the media wants dollars? what!?

=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
Since Natalee can't defend herself, I will!!! (1.04 / 22) (#407)
by bamagirl on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:01:10 AM EST

I don't even know what to say. I happen to be from the same place as Natalee. My sister and her were good friends. I understand that everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but to lash out on a girl that is missing and her family and friends that are relentlessly trying to find her is insensitive. The title of this article is absurd. How can a person in his/her right mind use the title "f**k Natalee Holloway" when she is still missing and possibly dead. Do any of ya'll not have any respect for Natalee, her family, or friends? I wish all of ya'll that agree with this article felt half of what we are going through. I understand there are many communities that go through similar situations everyday. My heart goes out to them and I pray for them like I hope they are doing for us. It is not our fault that this story is getting as much attention as it is. We did not call the news stations, we did not ask PEOPLE magazine to write an article, we did not ask the Aruban government to take a day off from work to search for Natalee. Actually there are a lot of things that I have read that are entirely false! I would appreciate if before people posted messages about Natalee they knew the truth. When this story first started spreading, the media appeared on their own. They would call anybody that had connections to Natalee looking for an interview and for a while nobody would give them one. It wasn't until a week or so after her dissappearance when interviews were given in hope that if the story got out to the world then maybe it would help find Natalee. For all of you who claim to know what kind of person Natalee and her mother are...ya'll are wrong. Natalee was a straight A student who didn't drink or do drugs in high school. I was not personally on the trip, but I am good friends with people that were. Natalee was not on drugs, nor was she biligerently drunk. She did not just randomly get in the car with three strangers. Her friends and chaperones were at the bar with her. To call Natalee a rich, white, pot smoker is totally ignorant. This trip was not planned just to go and get drunk. Actually I would know because I went on the same exact trip last year and did not have one sip of alcohol. The chaperones were not just older siblings either. They were respected adults in the community who worked at the local high school (for the record this does not mean the trip was school sponsered!). Natalee's mother has done an excelent job, in my opinion. She is there with one goal in mind....to get her daughter home. She has had to put up with not only loosing her only daughter, but also the media, the debates, and criticism from people like ya'll. To call her "big mouthed" is irrelevant. If any of ya'lls children were missing and the media asked you for an interview you can not say that you would not do everything in your power to get him/her back. Now if I am wrong about that than you don't have a heart. I agree that there are many current events that get skipped over in the news. However, as long as there is the opportunity to keep Natalee in the news so that she won't get forgotten about and never found, Natalee's friends and family are going to take full advantage. For those of you who care, Natalee's community has put together several different fund-raisers to help not only Natalee's case but other missing person's cases. Please don't blame Natalee's family for any of this. You can blame whoever/whatever else you want , but leave the family and my community alone. We did not done anything to ya'll. We have not been rude, disrespectful, or condesending. We just want Natalee home. We love her and she is missed very much. I can respect the fact that you have a differing opinion than me on this whole issue, but some of you have taken the disagreeing to disrepecting. On behalf of Natalee, her family, friends, and community we thank everybody who supports us and we ask they ya'll continue to pray we bring her home. We are going to do everything it takes to bring her home even if that means being a headline on the national news. If you don't like it, don't watch! And please don't write anymore speculations. You just make your self look ignorant.

Did you read the article? (none / 1) (#410)
by benna on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 05:17:32 AM EST

I didn't think so.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Did you read her post? (2.40 / 5) (#411)
by HollyHopDrive on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:53:13 AM EST

I wouldn't blame you if you hadn't, the lack of formatting was painful, but I ploughed through. She is angry about the title of the piece and all the comments in the thread by self-congratulatory people who think they're being clever and funny by calling Natalee a rich white pothead slutty drunkard. She also makes some valid points about the family's relationship with the media. People might disagree but they're valid.

Of course, nobody wants to read this because k5 has now reached the point where it's basking delightedly in its notoriety over this, happily unaware it's caught up in the exact kind of disproportionate sensationalism the parent article was criticising. And of course, shocking people by telling everyone how much you don't care about a missing girl and insulting her is way cool and rebellious, everyone knows that.

I have to say that while I'm not foaming at the mouth with anger about this whole hoo-ha, neither am I particularly impressed with it.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

I read half of it (none / 0) (#412)
by benna on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 11:53:08 AM EST

And it seemed to me she was critisizing the article, more than the comments.  She might have had a more valid point with regard to some of the comments, though I don't think its worth getting that upset about.
-
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
[ Parent ]
Most of the people who seem upset (1.50 / 2) (#431)
by HollyHopDrive on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 06:52:52 AM EST

have more of a problem with the headline than anything else. I fully agree that the article itself was not about Natalee being a bitch, but about how wrong it was that other missing people weren't getting the same kind of attention she was. The article was passionate and at times a little close to the bone for people who know and love Natalee, but I did agree with its basic points.

But I'm not surprised so many people took umbrage with the title. This post, as well as many others, was angry more about the headline than the article - and this anger carried through.

The title was misleading, since gbd was quick to point out he wasn't actually wishing Natalee any harm. But I think "Fuck the Natalee Holloway Story" or "Fuck the Media" would have been more appriopriate. They would have been more respectful and less misleading. Of course, they would also have been less explosive and would not have coshed Google and caused a storm way beyond k5's borders. God bless sensationalism of the kind gbd was attacking.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

'Fuck the media?' (none / 1) (#433)
by artis on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 02:47:58 PM EST

That's misleading, not all are guilty here so:

'Fuck mainstream media'

That's misleading as well, some from the mainstream media have raised similar points as the article (example) so:

'Fuck most mainstream media'

But that isn't precise either, there are so many wrongs such article could be talking about so:

'Fuck most mainstream media for their uneven coverage of cases concerning missing people in the light of the "Natalee Holloway" story'

...is useless as a subject.

Yes the subject was misleading but expanding it might not be the most effective way, IMHO something like 'Fuck "Natalee Holloway"' would get the point across to those who care about what the story actualy says (it could be argued that they got the point anyway, after reading gdb's comments on the matter).
--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]

I love the way (none / 1) (#524)
by HollyHopDrive on Sun Jul 24, 2005 at 03:37:26 PM EST

you piss around, nitpicking with semantics to try to make a point that doesn't carry. It nearly works, but not quite. First of all "the media" simply means a plural of "medium", and does not necessarily include every radio frequency, television channel, website or news report in the world. gbd's complaint is with media, not Natalee on a personal level, and "Fuck the Media" would have been much more appropriate.

Second, it is obvious to anyone that "Fuck the Media" would have shown more respect and consideration to Natalee's family and been much more accurate to the article as a whole. It would also have caused less offence, less sensationalism and less glee among the k5 community who are of course rebellious and individual for making fun of a dead girl and her family.

I'm not up in arms about this whole thing - it's a storm in a teacup. But neither am I particularly impressed with it, or your childish whinging about generalisations when you know as well as I do what the real point is.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

ur absolutely right ,u sarcastic hooker u (none / 0) (#451)
by kbudha on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 07:34:01 PM EST

Cracking jokes on spoiled stupid girls isnt funny. Even if she watched too many Girls Gone Wild videos and just wanted to spend her high school graduation party in a foreign country where the legal drinking age is 18. Maybe we should crack on you instead.

[ Parent ]
At the very least (none / 1) (#525)
by HollyHopDrive on Sun Jul 24, 2005 at 04:33:05 PM EST

I'm alive and free to get back atcha.

Damn, you big hard man, making sick swipes at women who are probably raped and dead. Oh, the wit. Oh, the hard macho factor. Oh, the bravery and sheer utter masculinity people like you demonstrate. I bet you all have inordinately large penises.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

I wasn't talking to you. (3.00 / 2) (#553)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:05:35 AM EST

Typical woman. Why does it always have to be about you.

[ Parent ]
try to master the "reply to this" (none / 0) (#584)
by vivelame on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:47:29 AM EST

button, then, moron.

--
Jonathan Simon: "When the autopsy of our democracy is performed, it is my belief that media silence will be given as the primary cause of death."
[ Parent ]
master this (none / 1) (#599)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 11:08:05 AM EST

my dick in your mouth bitch

[ Parent ]
You're such an idiot. (none / 1) (#594)
by HollyHopDrive on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 07:54:18 AM EST

So, so, so stupid.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

I MASTERED THE REPLY TO THIS BUTTON YAY (none / 1) (#600)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 11:11:53 AM EST

I'm so so stupid but you're the one jumping my case.Ever wondered why I started harassing and annoying you, it started right here. Don't call the police now I'm not some rapist now, I promise. Girl power!Yay!

[ Parent ]
Couldn't care less why you harass me (none / 1) (#602)
by HollyHopDrive on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 11:44:37 AM EST

I rarely check names, to be honest. I just don't see how you can say crimes are lessened if the victim made them easy.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

never said that (none / 1) (#612)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 02:11:36 PM EST

just said I have no sympathy. There I'm done.

[ Parent ]
I also have no sympathy (none / 0) (#1067)
by HollyHopDrive on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:25:05 AM EST

for the pathetic life you lead. But I feel sorry for your parents. I'm sure they had the best intentions.


I make too much sense to be on the Internet.
[ Parent ]

Oh, that's her job. (none / 1) (#803)
by Egil Skallagrimson on Sat Jul 30, 2005 at 10:24:35 AM EST

Don't take it personally. She's a 700-pound shut-in with 46 cats. Imagine the smell......

----------------

Enterobacteria phage T2 is a virulent bacteriophage of the T4-like viruses genus, in the family Myoviridae. It infects E. coli and is the best known of the T-even phages. Its virion contains linear double-stranded DNA, terminally redundant and circularly permuted.
[ Parent ]

you piece of shit (1.00 / 19) (#416)
by southerngirl on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 03:45:04 PM EST

now you all want to go and talk about Natalle and her family about all the attention they are getting from her disapperance but did anyone complain when Lacy Peterson was missing? Was there ever a post like this one? maybe these other parents whose kids are missing needs to get on the ball like Natalle's family did to find their children. 1/2 the missing kids in this world are MISSING cause their piece of shit parents killed them and are getting away with it.I do not understand what the deal is with all you hateful people that are talking about her. what is it just cause she is from Alabama no one should care about her? I think that who ever posted this, is a heartless asshole and I hope someone kidnaps you and your family never hear/see's you again.

For the record (3.00 / 6) (#419)
by gbd on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 05:28:09 PM EST

did anyone complain when Lacy Peterson was missing?

You bet your ass I complained about the coverage of the Laci Peterson case; that was a Page 6 or 7 story at best. Like the Holloway case, the media coverage was incessant and there was a hidden political angle to the whole story (to wit: abortion.) Did I write a story about it? No, because if I wrote a story about every piece of "news" that the American media spends obscene amounts of time on, I would be sitting in front of my keyboard 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Since I have a day job and a social life outside of work, that's a luxury that I simply cannot afford.

You write as if I harbor some sort of personal animosity towards Natalee or her family. I don't, and if you had read for comprehension, this fact should have been abundantly clear. My animosity (if that's even the right word for it) is reserved exclusively for the news media. Furthermore, the disproportionate response of the American and Dutch/Aruban government has been outrageous. As I noted in the story, my resolve to keep quiet was melted away by the fiery exhaust of three warplanes sent halfway around the world to look for one missing woman.

maybe these other parents whose kids are missing needs to get on the ball like Natalle's family did to find their children.

Ahh, the old "maybe if you loved your kid more" card. This card has been played several times in responses to this story, and I've more or less ignored it, but no longer. This argument is fucking odious. If you'd like, I can hook you up with the home address of the family of Gaby Alvarado-Carrera. Perhaps you'd like to take a few minutes out of your day to write them a letter and chastise them for not loving their child more?

Honestly, you folks react with shock and outrage any time somebody dares to suggest that Natalee was irresponsible for getting in a car with three strange males on a strange island. "How dare you try to blame Natalee!" you say. "How dare you try to make this her fault!" (Incidentally, this is something that I would agree with you on completely; nobody deserves to be kidnapped and murdered.) But then when the subject of other missing persons is brought up, you immediately turn around and blame their families. "Maybe if they loved them a bit more!" you say. "Maybe if they were more committed to their child, they could get more media coverage!"

A couple of weeks ago, there was a story about an African-American woman (in Georgia, I believe) who was abducted on her way home from work. They recovered her car, but not her body. Her parents were numb with sorrow. They printed up posters. They had T-shirts made. They reached out to the media. And Fox News Channel actually gave them a 5-minute segment. Her family was crying the whole time and pleading with the public for help finding their daughter. And after the segment was over, that was it. Back to Natalee.

I'd like to provide more details about this case (such as the woman's name) but I can't. Do you know why? It's because I can't find any details about the case. If anybody remembers this story, I'd appreciate a refresher on it. But the point is that the media simply doesn't care, and then we get people like you crawling out of the woodwork and claiming that it's because the missing person's family doesn't love them enough.

You ought to be ashamed for making this argument.

Furthermore, y'all need to get your story straight. In the comment immediately below this one, "bamagirl" makes it abundantly clear that the media sought out the Holloway family, not the other way around. She also claims to be directly involved with the situation. So which is it? Did Natalee's family seek out the media for help, or is "bamagirl" lying through her teeth? Inquiring minds want to know.

1/2 the missing kids in this world are MISSING cause their piece of shit parents killed them and are getting away with it.

Provide a cite for this outrageous claim or retract it.

I think that who ever posted this, is a heartless asshole and I hope someone kidnaps you and your family never hear/see's you again.

Is this what they mean by "Southern hospitality?" I have not wished harm upon anybody. I have expressed my fondest desire that Natalee can be found and returned to the safety of her family. But I have also explained, in no uncertain terms, that I feel no more badly for Natalee Holloway than I do for the thousands of other people who are missing right now and don't get wall-to-wall media coverage. And your post has done nothing to explain why I should.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Rethink your title next time (1.33 / 3) (#423)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:08:04 PM EST

You gave such a horrible first impression by the title. Most (who don't agree with you, like myself) automatically think that you're an insensitive asshole before they even read the article. Which was totally uncalled for.

[ Parent ]
The "F*** Natalee Holloway" title (none / 1) (#426)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:38:27 PM EST



[ Parent ]
OT: Why do you censor fuck but not asshole? [nt] (none / 1) (#428)
by artis on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:44:57 PM EST


--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
Because .......... (none / 1) (#430)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 09:21:58 PM EST

I don't want to put such a word in front of the poor girls name!!!!

[ Parent ]
the warplanes... (1.28 / 7) (#439)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 05:10:14 PM EST

the warplanes that were sent are from holland. in case you didnt know, that is arubas mother country... they are obligated, i believe, to help with this as much as they possibly can, since aruba is theirs. if you dont think so then maybe you should go to holland and say "fuck natalee holloway!" just like you have done here and maybe youll get some media attention, because it seems like you crave attention for your idiocy about the subject. ><_><

[ Parent ]
way to totally miss the point.(nt) (3.00 / 2) (#583)
by vivelame on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:44:35 AM EST



--
Jonathan Simon: "When the autopsy of our democracy is performed, it is my belief that media silence will be given as the primary cause of death."
[ Parent ]
Shit is made up from the same atoms as you (2.00 / 2) (#420)
by artis on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 06:06:06 PM EST

Maybe these other parents whose kids are missing needs to get on the ball like Natalle's family did to find their children.
If parents get ignored by the media and no reports it did they really talk to the media?
1/2 the missing kids in this world are MISSING cause their piece of shit parents killed them and are getting away with it.
82.01% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
I do not understand what the deal is with all you hateful people that are talking about her.
I do not understand what the deal is with all you hateful people that are commenting on that.
I think that who ever posted this, is a heartless asshole and I hope someone kidnaps you and your family never hear/see's you again.
I don't wish you any ill.
--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
Rethink your title next time (none / 1) (#422)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:06:49 PM EST

You gave such a horrible first impression by the title. Most (who don't agree with you, like myself) automatically think that you're an insensitive asshole before they even read the article. Which was totally uncalled for.

[ Parent ]
Chemistry (none / 0) (#424)
by artis on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:23:37 PM EST

Chemistry isn't offensive per se, that is the twist of the subject; calling somone a "piece of shit" is beeing an asshole, I just pointed out that all of us are, in a sense, "pieces of shit". That can be read as an insult and if that's what somone is after they will not gain much from the post itself either way. But you are right, I should have replaced "you" with "us" to make that more clear.
--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
Sorry...that post was meant for gbd not U (none / 0) (#425)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:34:30 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Suspected that [nt] (none / 0) (#427)
by artis on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 08:42:03 PM EST


--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
To be fair (none / 0) (#818)
by Egil Skallagrimson on Sat Jul 30, 2005 at 01:20:48 PM EST

I actually did call for that.

----------------

Enterobacteria phage T2 is a virulent bacteriophage of the T4-like viruses genus, in the family Myoviridae. It infects E. coli and is the best known of the T-even phages. Its virion contains linear double-stranded DNA, terminally redundant and circularly permuted.
[ Parent ]

Excellent point. (1.20 / 5) (#421)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 14, 2005 at 07:57:20 PM EST



[ Parent ]
exactly.. (1.20 / 5) (#437)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 04:40:28 PM EST

youre exactly right because if mine were missing id want her face EVERYWHERE. on milk cartons, phone poles, postoffices, grocery stores, you name it. parents that dont care and others that dont care should go to hell.

[ Parent ]
MY daughter... (1.11 / 17) (#434)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 04:32:22 PM EST

as i sit and read this i am also watching my own daughter sleep in my bed. as i watch her, i think what a jackass all you people that down natalees mother and her family for CARING abot her. if this happened to my daughter i would be doing the exact same thing. i am from the birmingham area so this hits close to home. sure, there are some stories of missing persons that arent publicized like this but so what.they probably havent found them either. i fear for my child to grow up in a world that is so hate-driven that they criticize mothers for loving their children. think if it were your own child that was missing. this girl was not a party girl. shes straight As in school, honor roll, colorguard....she was more than likely drugged by these boys and left on the beach and the father of the one still in jail probably helped them cover up a horrible act. i commend all that have posted on here in favor of the family and hope you stand by your comments. if this was my daughter i would be most grateful of your anger towards all that think its wrong to love your children enough to stand against a whole government.

I should be eternally grateful .. (none / 1) (#438)
by gbd on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 04:55:52 PM EST

.. if you would point out the section of the story where I criticize Natalee's mother.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]
you ass (1.00 / 6) (#440)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 05:18:09 PM EST

you said it when you said fuck natalee holloway

[ Parent ]
Just out of curiosity (none / 1) (#441)
by gbd on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 05:26:32 PM EST

Did you even bother to read the story?

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]
yes actually... (1.16 / 6) (#442)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 05:37:45 PM EST

i did. even though you clearly are attacking the media, you still said that you didnt care.."Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men." ~Boondock Saints~

[ Parent ]
Well (3.00 / 2) (#443)
by gbd on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 06:39:54 PM EST

I feel bad for Natalee Holloway and her family, just as I do for the families of anybody who has been abducted (as I explained.) But the amount of media coverage this case has received implies that this is some kind of a major news story and we, as Americans, should somehow care more for Natalee than we would for somebody like Gaby Alvarado-Carrera. And I don't; I simply do not.

If that makes me evil in your eyes, then so be it.  At least I can say I'm being consistent.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Ironically Enough (1.00 / 3) (#534)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 11:11:02 AM EST

You are the simple reason that the media covers the story so much!! Wow, wake up! Too funny how you sit here and reply and make all of these remarks, and yet this is what keeps the story going!!!!

[ Parent ]
no (2.00 / 2) (#552)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:02:28 AM EST

we're keeping the thread going. Its fun watching turds like you get all enraged.Personally Im waiting for death threats from anyone of you pussy motherfuckers.That shit would be hilarious

[ Parent ]
Fun fun (1.66 / 3) (#556)
by mbridge007619 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:45:21 AM EST

Not psycho enough to make death threats over political views. It's all fun and games.

[ Parent ]
only true rebels would wait for a cyber attack! (none / 0) (#1303)
by USAWINS on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 04:02:28 PM EST

Hes waiting for someone to send him death threats, perhaps he's just looking for some attention. "WAR IS HELL" bold statement as you set in your cozy desk chair and use your keyboard as fists. WAIT, you slap and bite people don't you? Don't hit your head to hard against the monitor as you try to teleport into a different world, where cyber-fights actually produce a winner.

[ Parent ]
Dude, (none / 0) (#1304)
by Aurochs on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 04:05:48 PM EST

you don't know the first thing about K5. If you want to keep your sheltered view of a happy-go-lucky Internet, I suggest you to MySpace now.
--
you can skullfuck yourself to death for FREE
--cDiss
[ Parent ]
Anytime you're in the neighborhood (none / 0) (#1423)
by kbudha on Fri Feb 09, 2007 at 12:18:36 PM EST

Give me a holler man. We can discuss how war is hell.

We can also have some intense negotiations as to the validity of my "attacks", cyber or otherwise.
.

[ Parent ]

as mentioned (none / 0) (#1301)
by USAWINS on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 03:53:31 PM EST

you are keeping the story alive, even if it is in strange context. I saw an article about "fuck natalie holloway" in some online Dutch article. Be careful, you could perhaps be walking a thin line. It's just bad karma if you ask me. Any bad things happened to you lately? Just curous.

[ Parent ]
With more than 6 billion people on this planet (3.00 / 3) (#444)
by artis on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 06:56:10 PM EST

What makes her more important than all the millons who suffer each and every day?
--
Can you know that you are omniscient?
[ Parent ]
OMG (2.00 / 2) (#450)
by kbudha on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 07:26:38 PM EST

ur quoting the Boondock Saints STFU

[ Parent ]
problem? (none / 1) (#914)
by pissedyoungmother on Mon Aug 08, 2005 at 02:24:11 PM EST

whats wrong with that? its the best way to describe the story...the indifference of  "possibly" good men on this site

[ Parent ]
ummm hello, i think the title does a good of that! (none / 0) (#1302)
by USAWINS on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 03:58:13 PM EST

The title of the damn article, geeeeez....you are intentionally hurting her family, but masking it by attacking the media. Your stupid title is misleading then, if you are not trying to hurt her family, or crticize her mother. Should have picked a better title, instead you placed a welcome mat for ridicule upon yourself by creating the title.

[ Parent ]
What the hell? (3.00 / 2) (#729)
by Zeptillian on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 07:23:28 AM EST

Did you see that the point of the article was to suggest that the news media should be covering more important stories than an old kidnapping? Just because it used the word Fuck in the title hordes of people flock here and taunt the usual readers for being faggots, liberals or otherwise generally bad people. What's your Fucking point?

"Don't watch." or "Other people care, so shut up?"

This is just someone writing their opinion that the news should be covering other equally important or more important stories. You people came here to bitch at us. Why don't you just go somewhere else?

You expect to interrupt someone else's discussion with mean posts advising them to turn the channel when they feel like the press is declining in the significance of the news it chooses to show. You think nothing of sticking around just to criticize and hate people who want to write stories or discuss issue of the press. It has nothing to do with the girl, her family, some foreign country or anyone or anything other than the bias of the press.

Do you understand that the press is an important part of a free society, one so important it's protected by the Constitution and uses a public resource (the airwaves) as a means of transmission? Fuck you for preventing other people from having a meaningful discussion of it on a website. Fuck you for getting all upset and trying to turn this into a discussion about family or politics.


www.mediacasualty.com
[ Parent ]

pissed in the british sense? (none / 0) (#1062)
by shm on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 01:41:48 PM EST

You do appear to be drunk.

[ Parent ]
drunk? (none / 0) (#1156)
by pissedyoungmother on Thu Sep 29, 2005 at 11:34:50 AM EST

yeah im drunk...sure  you think what you wanna. you obviously dont have children...

[ Parent ]
Were you pissed when you had children? (none / 0) (#1171)
by shm on Fri Oct 07, 2005 at 03:09:19 PM EST

Do they also have whatsit-alcohol-syndrome?

[ Parent ]
nonsense... (none / 0) (#1172)
by pissedyoungmother on Mon Oct 17, 2005 at 11:29:35 PM EST

thats all that is coming out of you at this point...

[ Parent ]
Great job on the Natalee Holloway story! (2.66 / 6) (#435)
by Grotto on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 04:33:51 PM EST

This has been the absolute best story I've seen on Natalee Holloway to date! The author is just tops -- my sentiments exactly. And that was a great job on presenting the facts and for exposing the superficial leeches in the media. Great op-eds like this one are few and far between. It's jsut a shame that the ignorant of our society are unable to appreciate the quality of the work.

ignorant?? (1.14 / 7) (#436)
by pissedyoungmother on Fri Jul 15, 2005 at 04:37:46 PM EST

we are ignorant, huh? you are for not looking at the whole picture here. do you have kids? i bet you dont. if you did, you would be looking at this as if she were your own and what you would be doing...

[ Parent ]
Except she isn't. (none / 1) (#446)
by quanta on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 01:37:52 AM EST

Natalee Holloway isn't his daughter, or related him, or a friend of a friend or anything. So why should he care beyond the simple general concern? And why should one story about one missing person essentially take over the media?

[ Parent ]
Holloway case solved! (1.87 / 8) (#445)
by Art Mooney on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 01:27:42 AM EST

After Much investigation into quite possibliy the most important news story of the decade, I have discovered evidence of a conspiricy invoving Aliens tampering with shipments of Zima and Captian Morgan to Aruba....thus leading to the drugging and possible Alien Abduction of Miss Holloway.....but the question remains....was vander sloot an alien himself? or just a willing or unwilling acomplice?

ha ha ....ur lame (2.00 / 2) (#449)
by kbudha on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 07:24:20 PM EST

really bad failed attempt at humor. You should have included Elvis and Charlamange. Then it woulda been HILARIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ Parent ]
forgot where i was sorry (1.33 / 3) (#452)
by Art Mooney on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 09:27:58 PM EST

oh sorry i forgot where i was futurama, family guy blah blah i am so cool blah blah.. there is that better?

[ Parent ]
uuuh (none / 1) (#460)
by kbudha on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 02:26:40 PM EST

You lost me man now ur lame again.No cool points for you.

[ Parent ]
go gbd! (1.25 / 4) (#448)
by kbudha on Sat Jul 16, 2005 at 07:08:55 PM EST

Had to get in on this one too. All you over sensitive turds need to get a sense of humor.You probably get psychological damage for years to come following getting your house burglarized or a near fatal car wreck. "you whine like a mule, you are still alive!" And I or people like me or like gbd are not insensitive. We're just not so dam uptight like you morons. And shut up cuz I'm a victim also. I've been robbed at gunpoint twice in my life and my house always got broken into when I was a kid. BUT YOU DON'T HEAR ME CRYING Whiny little biotches I swear. What the hell you upset about anyway. Be glad your ass(or your daughters ass, for all you outraged parents out there) aren't the ones who ended up for sharkbait. And bravo to Beth Halloway for all that effort.Its just sad that its wasted effort because they're never gonna find her do to Aruban police incompetence. If you wanna kill someone and walk, fly the friendly skies to Aruba. Where the police suck ass(this will piss off all the uptight Aruba supporters as well). And for all you anti-conspiracy,public masses,sheep out there, consider this. Our government was founded on stealing(from the indians),murder(the indians again, and the french and spanish)and revolt(the british: and over being taxed too much!!!). I don't put anything past Uncle Sam (not saying it is, just that its possible). I'm sure some religous nut will damn me for this post. How godly of you to curse others, well done.And if you think this ones a dozy, look on the other Natalie Halloway thread on this site.Peace out retards

god the indians...again?? (none / 1) (#453)
by Art Mooney on Sun Jul 17, 2005 at 03:25:45 AM EST

My God now we gotta start the liberal guilt trip indian crap again??? newsflash moron, goverment corruption is ETERNAL. RACES GET CONQUERED. this missing pretty girl alert deal has nothing to do with Foxs conservetive bias (which is real but not more real than CNNs or Msnbcs liberal bias) it has to do with their pandering this kind of pornography to the old people and houswives that love it. end of story. In closing, advice to all potential killers out there, for gods sake choose a either a fat or ugly person, you do not need the kind of hassle killing a pretty person will get you.

[ Parent ]
hah now you're funny (none / 1) (#458)
by kbudha on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 02:16:02 PM EST

and I'm not a liberal

[ Parent ]
Thanks ,now you have outed yourelf as A liberal (none / 1) (#461)
by Art Mooney on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 02:35:24 PM EST

just like every one of you panty wearing , self hating assholes, you actually believe you are thinking outside the hive. blah blah, fuck those christians, blah blah, those poor indians, blah blah. God the only thing you need to complete your post, is some deal about Karl Rove or about how awesome "Supersize This" was. Or maybe just complete it with how you are pissed off at your Dad because he won't let you smoke weed in the house. The original Fuck Natlee Holloway post by GBD was great AND insightful , but your shit sounds like 18 year old high school crap. get some new shit.

[ Parent ]
HOW? (none / 0) (#473)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 04:31:54 PM EST

Why is it everytime someone else doesn't agree with one of you Republican Douchebags, automatically they're a liberal. Is that the best insult you sheep can come up with.Let me set the record straight.Panty wearing-I could probably stomp your ass.Self hating-not more than I hate retards like you who think they're always right.The hive thinking- I CARE NOTHING of thinking inside,outside,or anywhere else involving the "hive".I think for myself, thank you. If you like following instead of leading yourself,by all means.As for political choice, I hate all you fuckers(dems,reps,libs,cons). You're tearing our great country apart with your endless prattling and arguing.Smoke weed- I work for the state, random piss tests. Dads house?!-I'm late 20s and have my own place.You- angry little man for zeroing your reply just to get rid of my short and sweet joke on you.Must've hit a nerve.

[ Parent ]
your own place ? (none / 0) (#481)
by tuvock on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 02:51:39 PM EST

did big daddy or mommy-dearest bankroll your purchase of your own place ?

[ Parent ]
uhhh no actually (none / 0) (#489)
by kbudha on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 08:28:19 AM EST

dads a loser with 2 DUIs mom borders on senility you've got about as much insight as Mr Art Mooney MIND YOUR OWN FUCKING BUSINESS

[ Parent ]
Actually... (none / 0) (#500)
by blues0022 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 02:50:07 AM EST

Actually the Americans revolted against the British not merely because we were taxed, but because we were being taxed and contributing to the British economy without having any word in the government(neither the Parliament in Britain nor the one set up for the colonies). Any state of the United States would certainly have a problem with paying the US but not receive its alotted Congressmen and Senators and the right to vote. I believe Americans revolted for just cause.

[ Parent ]
Why Natalee gets so much attention! (1.07 / 13) (#455)
by PBrown1968 on Sun Jul 17, 2005 at 09:25:48 PM EST

You people are just missing the Point! The reason this story is soooo damn big is because of Natalee's parents the parents who will never give up. Look at the types of people that get their kids exposure, it is the parents who do not nor will not EVER give up. Was Shasta's daddy out looking for her the day she was found?? No he was out of state celebrating the 4th of July! That story too had vanished out of the media. Ya know why??? because he wasn't looking for her anymore. He had given up. I have followed this story from the beginning and even held off on allowing my 17 year old daughter from going on a trip. I made her wait until I could go with her. Just made me feel a lot better. I would like to say something to the people out there that feel like Natalee has gotten way more attention then some of the other missing children here in the US. Natalee isn't missing here in the US and this case could have been solved from the beginning if this had happened here. It would have been a simple open shut case. That is not the way it is happening. The parents have to push this into the media. To try to get some answers out of the Arabian officials who try to make the world think they have the situation under control. That is why it seems like this has gotten more attention. Parents who give up don't get on the front page the ones who fight and make sure it happens do. So please everyone stop putting the Holloways down for this. They are doing what I would do and most parents would do. The ones that just don't give up anyway. I pray for Natalees family daily. I hope Natalee is in a better place and not being held captive. I pray for closure for everyone the entire world because Beth hasn't given up and for that very reason Natalee has become "everyone's little girl" So to the Jerk who started writing Fuck Natalee, I am really sure you care, but you know if you took the time to write such harsh words you must have some interest. I am sure you are looking to get your own attention in someone. And by you trying to "shock" everyone into noticing you, you really have shown your ass and everyone will sure remember your legacy. We are so very proud of you Jack ASS !!!

Why Natalee doesn't deserve so much attention! (3.00 / 3) (#456)
by fucknataleeholloway on Sun Jul 17, 2005 at 10:14:13 PM EST

This is complete and utter bullshit. Do you honestly think that most of the parents of the missing children haven't done every possible thing to find them? No one is putting the Holloways down. We are putting the media down.

People have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on ONE person. Priorities! "Hmm, here's a pretty girl who disappeared in a foreign country! Let's go have a media bash over it for ratings!" The people commenting against this story are mostly skimming it and not seeing the real message: the mainstream media channels are shortsighted corporations who only care about ratings.

Oh yes, I'm sure gbd's looking for attention. And I'm sure the 125 people who voted this article up and made comments are all looking for attention too. There are people getting kidnapped right here. There's a war in Iraq. There were bombings in London. There was a G8 summit. Natalee is insignificant compared to these events.

And by you trying to "persuade" everyone into noticing Natalee, you really have shown your ass and everyone will sure remember your legacy. We are so very proud of you Jack ASS !!!

(yeah yeah, bad translation.)

[ Parent ]
oh yeah ? well fuck you too (1.00 / 3) (#457)
by Art Mooney on Sun Jul 17, 2005 at 11:38:26 PM EST

see subject

[ Parent ]
And the point is yet missed again! (none / 1) (#464)
by PBrown1968 on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 06:46:44 PM EST

No Beth Holloway is not giving up. My point about Shastas father was that he was not in the same place waiting for her to come home. I know there will come a point when Beth Holloway has to come to terms and get on with life, but as far as I can tell, Elizabeth Smarts family and Natalee Holloway's family are the only ones that didn't just give up and go on with life. They are the ones that have kept this in the media, and to be honest I haven't heard anything about Natalee except for what I go looking for.

[ Parent ]
think about it (2.00 / 2) (#465)
by okiloki on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 07:29:07 PM EST

I'm the mother of a murdered child and won't put Shasta and Dylan's dad down. My son was missing for almost two weeks before his body washed out of a drain pipe and, never once, did we give up and I doubt thier dad did either. You have no idea what you would do and how you react in such a situation. And as far as 'moving on with your life' goes .... it's never the same. I do wish my son's case had gotten more attention but this was 12 years ago and the media didn't stay on stories like they do now. I'm glad that Shasta was found and the pervert is in custody. Unfortunately, some of us never know who the perp was and we just have to hope that there is a deathbed confession in our lifetimes. Please, think about the rest of us that never gave up but didn't get in front of a camara everyday.

[ Parent ]
timeline (none / 0) (#459)
by kbudha on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 02:21:11 PM EST

shasta dissappeared end of may.skip to 4th of july. 6-7 weeks. same time Beth Halloway has been searching. And she's about to give up as well. Tell me all knowing do you know Shasta Groene's father?!

[ Parent ]
Thank you (none / 0) (#533)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 11:01:12 AM EST

Thanks for re-iterating everything I have been saying. These idiot liberals are crying racism in this investigation! HA, some people will cry racism over almost anything. Seriously, your comments are well taken, and it appears that you "get it"

[ Parent ]
goddamn (none / 0) (#551)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:57:23 AM EST

What you gotta reply to all my shit you obsessed twit.You probably wish I was a "gay liberal" so I would let you suck my cock you fuckin, nut-riding closet case.And I never even mentioned racism.In fact neither did this post or any of its replies MORON!!!!!!!!

[ Parent ]
Relax (none / 0) (#555)
by mbridge007619 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:43:40 AM EST

Don't take it personal, and I wasn't totally referring to you. Not obsessed, just making comments. Wow. Most of the idiots who reply on this site act like WHITE (the word white seems rather racial to me) girls get all the attention in the media. It turns out, its not really the media, its the public. Have a beer on me.

[ Parent ]
I agree with your story (2.33 / 3) (#462)
by lsmo on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 02:43:53 PM EST

But not the title. My heart goes out to the Holloway family, but it's my guess if Natalee was not a rich, white girl, this story would not be worth 2 cents to the media. Let's see if we can break up the air time spent on Natalee and devote it to the thousands of other missing children who were not born into rich families.

Reply (2.57 / 7) (#463)
by okiloki on Mon Jul 18, 2005 at 05:24:51 PM EST

I have to agree with you but it's from experience. My 24 year old son didn't come home for spring break in 1993 so we tried to make a police report. We were told to come back on Monday, 3 days later. because he was prob just out having fun. No matter that we all had plans together and this was out of the norm for him. Nothing was done until my son's friends found his car in the Irving,Texas police impound, same Irving Texas Police Dept that we reported his disappearance to. They still did nothing to look for him or tell us where they found his car because they had more important things to do. Eleven days after he didn't come home,someone ran out of gas and was walking along the highway and happened to see something in a drainage ditch. This happened to be my son who had washed out of a drain pipe after a heavy rain. I grant you that he was not a wealthy young man but we are not poor and he was attending Baylor University in Waco studying law. He could have at least gotten some mention so that we could have been spared that wait to find him. Don't you think? After all these years and the lack of attention of the Irving PD, this is a cold case. They will not talk to us, tell us why and how they had his car and why they never investigated. All we know is that his money was gone and his body had been beaten and stuffed in a pipe. I feel for Natalee's family but not like most do because there will never be closure for our family and no blame can be placed on anyone but the Irving PD for lack of assistance.

[ Parent ]
To all you whinging newbies (UID < 62,000) (1.88 / 9) (#466)
by Talez on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 12:07:44 AM EST

I've zeroed your comments where approriate.

I may not have posted in a long time or accessed my account but I still lurk.

The noise you have added to this conversation from your emotional ranting and raving actually drove me to log back into my account and take the effort to zero each and every one of you. Now at least half of you will be hidden when I log back out.

Si in Googlis non est, ergo non est

Natalee Holloway (1.08 / 12) (#467)
by destiny12092003 on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 09:35:18 AM EST

I've read your article and to tell you the truth I can't believe you said some of these things. You are right that society picks and chooses who they show interest in, but instead of saying FUCK NATALEE why not say SOCIETY NEEDS TO CHANGE. I am not from Natalees home town and I dont know her but her story touches my heart. I look for stories about her daily to see if there are any new leads. I feel for her and her family and pray she is okay. Do I do that with any missing person???? Yes - I dont care where they are from or how much money I feel for them all. Now I might not get to see all the stories on all of these missing people, but when I do I feel for them and follow their stories. I agree that each and every legit missing person should be national news and should have that same coverage, but that is not Natalee or her families fault. If anything this should be a reminder for families to push and push until coverage is given to them in the way they deserve. You should really consider the message you are sending out by the title you have given this article. Although you have some valid points I think you have crossed a very hateful line by stating that.

Natalee (1.14 / 14) (#468)
by alabama2 on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 09:59:38 AM EST

I am from Natalee's hometown and went to high school with her. How dare you try and blame media attention on her and her family. It is not her fault that the media has taken to this story in the way that it has. As long as people continue to talk about it she will not be forgotten. How can you take your aggression toward the media out on an innocent girl and her family? If you yourself or a member of your family were missing wouldn't you want as much media coverage as possible? Wouldn't you want every measure taken to ensure that they were found alive and unharmed? God forbid if one day you yourself go missing - may you be as lucky as Natalee and have as many people concerned for your well being as she does. Maybe if you ventured down to Mountain Brook, AL you would see that no one cares about how much Fox News covers the story. Maybe you would see the yellow ribbons on almost every mailbox and then you would understand that the main concern is that she is safe not that Geraldo Rivera gets a good story.

Huh? (none / 0) (#469)
by gbd on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 01:28:20 PM EST

How dare you try and blame media attention on her and her family.

Could you please point out where I blame the media attention on Natalee and her family?

Thank you.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

fuck Natalee? no fuck you (1.20 / 10) (#471)
by alabama2 on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 02:36:36 PM EST

There are hundreds of other stories that are followed too closely by the media. Why do you feel the neeed to draw negative attention to Natalee? It's not anyone's fault but your own that you sit around watching fox news all day and have nothing else to bitch about. Here's a tip - change the channel!

[ Parent ]
Golden sir/miss, (none / 0) (#488)
by Kurosawa Nagaya on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 07:37:28 AM EST

Just golden.

You have missed the point completely and then swung back in an even more ridiculous direction.

You are truly an american icon... Or something.

The reason for this is simple: we're all full of shit ~ circletimessquare
[ Parent ]

Make sure you read everything (2.00 / 2) (#475)
by Callisandra on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 07:02:38 PM EST

I don't care for gbd's chosen vehicle to express - even though I completely respect his feelings and well deserved frustration. GBD - You knew when you posted you'd take HEAVY artillery. Southern girl - blonde - Christian - comm'on man. Pick your platforms more carefully. Vent your frustrations - but not standing on the backs of parents who clearly know how to use connections and the media - who love their daughter more than life itself - I have one too and I'd move Aruba to the Artic Circle to find her. Would not sleep until I knew all about my precious one. I totally get your points - I hate news reporting today from every, and I do mean EVERY source - just think though - a family member, friend or tender hearted southern girl read your commentary - think of how it would feel - emotions do not make good reading edits - we're all entitled to our opinions - but we must -- somewhere - draw the line of expressing our pain in a way that doesn't inflict pain to others. Simply signed - Sweet Home Alabama. *Before you load your gun - read every word - really read every word by GBD - you'll get it if you take your heart out of it.

[ Parent ]
I agree with you (none / 1) (#498)
by blues0022 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 02:43:28 AM EST

I also know Natalee. Before they moved to Birmingham (Mountain Brook), i was best friends with her younger brother. Though the main article here did not clearly blame Natalee, the title of his post did suggest such ideas. There are a few people who have posted that do however discredit Natalee, and that i do not like. I am with you 100% in defending Natalee against anyone who tries to say anything negative about Natalee, especially a person that does not know her personally in any way.

[ Parent ]
if it's hot and blonde, it leads (3.00 / 3) (#470)
by mmm good on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 02:22:02 PM EST

saturation coverage of holloway's story is happening for the same reason saturation coverage of debra lafave happened -- human's basic instinct to treat beautiful people better than ugly ones. which means they would also prefer to watch stories about beautiful people than ugly ones, so the ratings of the 24 hour cablers reflect this.

I couldnt agree with you more GBD (3.00 / 2) (#474)
by staagrounded on Tue Jul 19, 2005 at 06:36:08 PM EST

I have had the same thoughts and concerns that you share GBD. the reyna child didnt get any attention because shes hispanic and natalee is white. end of story. shes been missing for what 1289 years now? i really, really dont care. someone posted a coment asking "what if it would happen to you? wouldnt you want the same media coverage?" hell no. are you crazy? just because you live in a rich white suburban area and dont see shit like this happen everyday doesnt mean that we all want the same media attention. fuck media. its the worst now-a-days. they are all rich white ceos looking to make money that run everyhing anyway, so there goes little chance of minorities making "noise" in the media. unless some black male portrays negative behavior. then and only then do they get coverage. i live in a place where stuff like this is common. you dont hear about an 18 year old hispanic male that was kidnapped and murdered. its ridiculous.

hmmm (none / 0) (#482)
by alabama2 on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 03:38:49 PM EST

Look - my main point was that it is not Natalee's fault that all of this has happened. As far as living in a rich, white suburban neighborhood goes - I am glad that i don't have to see things like this happen everyday. Also, if you disappear you want no one to take notice or care? According to you know no one would notice anyway since you probably aren't a rich, young, white girl so - I guess you really don't have to worry about too much media attention.

[ Parent ]
what? (none / 0) (#484)
by staagrounded on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 04:46:56 PM EST

what? do u even read the whole thing. reread what i wrote honey. i didnt make remarks that i didnt or did want media to have coverage on me. i dont even mention myself. i hate stupid people. do i sound like a rich young white girl?.... i sure would kill myself before i became one.

[ Parent ]
whatever (none / 0) (#490)
by alabama2 on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 09:37:54 AM EST

You know what? The world is an unfair place and her story got more air time than a hispanic girl's. Too bad - deal with it. It may not be right or fair, but that's how it is. You can call me stupid and a snob all day long, but that really won't change anything.

[ Parent ]
youre a racist (none / 0) (#491)
by staagrounded on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 11:27:25 AM EST

youre a racist, deal with it

[ Parent ]
so are you (none / 0) (#503)
by alabama2 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 09:51:55 AM EST

"do i sound like a rich young white girl?.... i sure would kill myself before i became one." and I'm a racist? Please point out where I made a racist comment more blatant than this one.

[ Parent ]
Staagrounded's QUOTE (none / 0) (#493)
by Polo555 on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 07:33:52 PM EST

Staagrounded's quote: " Someone posted a comment asking "what if it would happen to you? wouldnt you want the same media coverage?" hell no. are you crazy? just because you live in a rich white suburban area and dont see shit like this happen everyday doesnt mean that we all want the same media attention. fuck media. " SO it seems that you in fact did make a comment about whether or not you would want the media to help your family find you if you turned up missing. Just wanted to point that out because in this post u stated "what? do u even read the whole thing. reread what i wrote honey. i didnt make remarks that i didnt or did want media to have coverage on me. i dont even mention myself. i hate stupid people. do i sound like a rich young white girl?.... i sure would kill myself before i became one."

[ Parent ]
Reyna (none / 0) (#586)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:53:25 AM EST

I would like to know more about Reyna with a capital "R" and the investigation involving this case. Since you are advocating for her, would you please give me a web address where you participate in discussions on her behalf? I would like to visit that discussion and learn more. Thanks

[ Parent ]
Why is it? (note*the author hates ALL politics) (2.20 / 5) (#478)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 08:56:51 AM EST

why is it that the majority of haters on this post are republican conservative.why is it that republican conservatives ridicule anyone who disagrees with them, usually calling them a liberal."If ur not with us, ur against us"-right? NEWS FLASH-you are human just like like everyone else,you are fallible and can't be right all the time. why is it said people make fun of anyone sticking up for rights of others(minorities). Said others could whip your spoiled sheltered ass and so could I.Personally I think its a lack of empathy.The same empathy that republicans preach about for their own political gain or to win an arguement.How would you feel if it happened to you? This question is like a logic fault, its beyond their comprehension. Why is it that reps don't see the level of bias on fox news. 2 weeks ago shortly after Shasta Groene was found, I saw an interview between Bill(asshole)O Reily and some woman talking about how there were drugs involved in the case. Possibly a crystal meth lab. Almost implying that Shastas family asked for this to happen and that it was drug related(probably to calm the masses,"NOOO, our countrys nice and safe. don't worry.HERE look over here. IRAQ, now you should worry.") SINCE then I've heard nothing else of this bullshit story.And rant about the "liberal" news channels all u want, they never even played an angle like this.Any comment from Mr O Reily. No way, he hasn't even mentioned it again. The mighty Bill O Reily is never wrong.IN CLOSING-why don't all you political followers, REPUBLICANS and DEMOCRATS(gotta add that one in there so I don't get accused of being a "liberal") go throw yourself off a FUCKING CLIFF. YOU FUCKING LEMMINGS

You might find Natalie if you chose an Arubancliff (none / 0) (#479)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 08:59:53 AM EST



[ Parent ]
News Flash for you (none / 1) (#530)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:42:49 AM EST

Most republican watch ONLY Fox News, the only news that is not slanted. Your views seem to be shifting around, so I could not help but reply to this too. You now appear to be an Anarchist with sympathy for the whole ordeal. When in your initial commentary, you made yourself appear to be a gay liberal. Maybe you should go over to Iraq, or somewhere else, since your disgust for American politics is eminent. It's not going away, so maybe you should. :)

[ Parent ]
news flash (none / 0) (#548)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:41:41 AM EST

Fox news is slanted. you're not just stupid you're also blind. If you think I'm an anarchist then you're also naive.But at least thats an original insult than "gay liberal". Take your ass over to Iraq and fight for your president and political party whose asses you so much kiss.Don't worry about my views shifting.Worry about me tracking your IP.

[ Parent ]
they never miss a chance (none / 0) (#851)
by sickofit on Sun Jul 31, 2005 at 08:18:00 AM EST

The southern red state bubba's republicans are the most bias hypocrites. So to terribly moral and they are loving this media coverage of a southern irresponsible woman who puts on the southern drawl as heavy as she can in that gutteral shrill voice of hers. I admire the northern wonderful women who have TRUE morals and some are even republicans like it or not. The northern midwestern women are the GREATEST in the world they have more morals and intelligence in their little fingers than all the southern bubbas women hope to have. The southern missy;s are all pathetic wannabes. The wish they could be as intelligent as the northeners but they cant and never will be!!

[ Parent ]
Shock and Appall (2.83 / 6) (#480)
by Kilea829 on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 01:09:12 PM EST

What I want to know is whether or not all the people who sent hail mail to K5 about this artical, actually read it? All of the hate mail is focused on the choice of words in the title, and GOD FORBID that someone whould actually read something they think they disagree with. Personally, I find this artical very intelligent and a fascinating read. And so I ask gbd to continue to shock and appall the american public, because it is my beliefe that americans are too comfortable in their own way of life. Thank you, gbd, for doing a wonder job of it so far.

im with you brotha /nt (none / 0) (#483)
by uptownpimp on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 04:02:29 PM EST



=========================
My name is actmodern and I approve of this message.
[ Parent ]
Reaction (2.33 / 6) (#485)
by PR1013 on Wed Jul 20, 2005 at 06:09:03 PM EST

While I was initally shocked at your harshness about this case, I fully agree with you that her case definitely has had substantial air time while others do not.

I have a few questions that ANY news program has yet to broach:
1) Why did she LEAVE A BAR with 3 men ???? Who in their right mind does that anyway, let alone in a foreign country?? I am not inferring that she deserves what has probably befallen her, but I can't help but wonder why someone touted to be so intelligent would leave a bar with 3 men she may have only known for a week.

2) Why didn't her "friends" stop her from leaving??? Or at the very least, go with her? This leads me to think that she may have had a habit of leaving bars with guys before Aruba. Otherwise, her friends leave a lot to be desired. Perhaps her life is so sheltered life that she doesn't know any better. Whatever the case, she's gone and we all are subject to the daily non-updates and arguments over Aruba's joke of law enforcement.

My heart goes out to her family and I hope she is found soon.

well... (none / 0) (#532)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:48:54 AM EST

Good questions, which could only mean one thing, she was probably heavily drugged. There is a date rape drug out there that will cloud a girl's better judgement.

[ Parent ]
stfu (none / 0) (#549)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:46:52 AM EST

yeah and date rape drugs usually knock you the fuck out. No witnesses saw her being carried out of that club.Once again you demonstrate your brilliance.And for someone who makes fun of guys, saying "someone sounds bitter and didnt get any attention", You sure spend alot of time posting instead of having a life yourself.

[ Parent ]
My Bad (none / 0) (#554)
by mbridge007619 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:39:07 AM EST

As for tracking IP's...okay psycho. As for witnesses, well they are just now coming forward with info, so we shall see. Sorry never taken a date rape drug, just know some loser who drugged my friend, she didn't have to be carried out either. ( My brilliance shines through.) Now as for having a life, it's called down time.

[ Parent ]
Actually... (none / 1) (#660)
by kate740 on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 09:03:03 AM EST

You are blaming Natalee Holloway. She is young, and I don't know about you, but when I was 18, I didn't always make the wisest decisions either. You're doing what the majority of society does when something like this happens. "I feel bad that this happened, but why would she put herself in this situation?" Just because someone is drunk or impaired does not give anyone the right to take advantage of him/her. Why not put the full blame and the responsibility on those deserve it?

[ Parent ]
Blame (none / 0) (#716)
by PR1013 on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 07:38:08 PM EST

I am not blaming her...directly. Van der sloot (helmet head) and the Kalpoe brothers are GUILTY!! But looking at this from all aspects, her friends are accountable as well. Yes, we have all made stupid mistakes as teenagers. I can attest to that having been there myself, but for FRIENDS to sit back and let her leave a bar with 3 men, well..it makes me crazy.She made a silly and immature mistake and by no means deserves to be raped, killed, kidnapped...my God no.

This case highlights that young people today haven't any clue as to the dangers that are out there. Children need to be taught that sometimes bad things happen to good people. Danger comes in many forms and is often in the form of someone who is "good looking" and "nice". I believe Natalee and her supposed friends did not have any concept of this, otherwise she would be back in Alabama now preparing for college.

She made a mistake. A young, stupid, foolish mistake that may have unfortunately cost her life.

[ Parent ]

Natalee (2.66 / 3) (#486)
by PavonisMons on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 07:33:46 AM EST

I dont care about Natalee Holloway, and i dont know why anyone else should. The only reason people care is because she's a pretty, rich white girl, who looks like some kind of angel (i dont think she's that attractive). The fact is, that she's a lecherous little harlet and no one seems to see that. I used to know alot of girls like her at my highschool. They pretend to be good, get involved in all kinds of school and church related activities, all efforts to hide their non-innocence from their parents. The fact is, that she was high on extascy, forgot to drink enough water, and died, and it's all her fault.

You do not and have never known Natalee Holloway (none / 1) (#496)
by blues0022 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 02:21:00 AM EST

I am a friend of the Holloway family. Before they moved to Birmingham, I was best friends with Natalee's brother. Put yourself in the position of that family. If you had a missing sister or daughter, how would you like people posting comments about how she was just high on drugs. Especially people who did not even know her. If heartlessness were a crime, you would be locked up. What you are saying is slander, and nothing more. I hope that you never have to experience what Natalee or her family is going through. But maybe you won't mind if you believe it is simple enough to make cruel comments about.

[ Parent ]
Slander? (none / 0) (#510)
by Willy G on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 05:19:56 PM EST

Seems everything here has been typed so slander seems to be a poor way to defend an argument when what you should be aiming for is libel. And even then, your case is shaky at best since no one has been directly harmed by the rantings of the few inconsiderates that have decided to troll this editorial. I agree with the author but these trolls take it too far.

[ Parent ]
You can't play it both ways (none / 1) (#518)
by The Diary Section on Sat Jul 23, 2005 at 06:55:46 PM EST

When the media onslaught began we were forced to listen to people talking about her from noon til night. I don't see you complaining to FOX and MSNBC who were practically slavering at the thought she'd been raped or sexually abused. That was just as much speculation as the above but apparently A-OK with the Holloway family.

So, either its a private issue to you and your family friends (slightly reminded of the fact the entire population of the US suddenly had a "best friend" working in the WTC on 9/11 but I'll let that pass) in which case they could have shut up and not spoken to the media, or its a public matter. If its a public matter people will feel free to speculate and you'll have to accept that as part of the Faustian pact with the media for publicity. Again, the speculation here is nothing to what the big networks did with it (for money I might add, all contributors here do it for nothing).

The degree of heartlessness is again subjective. To you, with your private concerns it may seem that way. To me, with wider concerns, the amount of time Ms. Holloway gunged up the media for obscuring dozens of far more important stories is in itself a form of heartlessness on the part of those who wanted their story at the top of every broadcast. I understand why, but again, you have to understand most people aren't going to feel that way.
Spend 10 minutes in the company of an American and you end up feeling like a Keats or a Shelley: Thin, brilliant, suave, and desperate for industrial-scale quantities of opium.
[ Parent ]

YOU SOLVED THE CASE!! (none / 0) (#531)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:45:23 AM EST

Wow, you solved it!!! Way to go! Actually sounds like you are bitter from your high school days, never really got enough attention from girls did ya?

[ Parent ]
I hope the bitch is dead. (none / 0) (#574)
by mamalama on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 09:12:35 PM EST

Stupid fucking slutty bitch! Its her fault shes dead and I hope she's burning in hell. There's only this much coverage on her, because she is white and rich. If she was black and poor, nobody would give a fuck about her. I can't beleive they sent 3 fucking jets to search for this whore!

[ Parent ]
For those of you who feel the right to cast stones (none / 1) (#593)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 05:47:39 AM EST

Be sure to say hi to Beezlebub for me the next time you hang out with him.

[ Parent ]
Get over yourself (none / 1) (#658)
by kate740 on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 08:52:34 AM EST

Did you know Natalee Holloway? Did you know she was a "slutty whore?" Way to judge her without EVER talking to her. And I hate to break it to you but this is not a race issue. The reason she is getting so much coverage is because her parents are doing everything they can to get their daughter back.

[ Parent ]
Wow PavonisMons (none / 0) (#625)
by CuriousGoose on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 06:08:32 PM EST

It is absolutely all right not to care about Natalee Holloway. Nobody is forcing you to care or even cares how you view her and her situation. What is funny to read in your comments is the underlying theme. You have not produced any real commentary about the missing person case. Rather, your statements point to the contempt with which you stereotypically view certain people. Who cares if you think she is attractive? Although, you DID describe her as pretty and Angelic in the sentence before. Next in your post, you describe her as a "lecherous little harlet" and claim that her characteristics are consistent with goody-two-shoe fakes similar to those you knew in high school. How could you possibly know that or if she was on drugs? Did you come to this decision through careful research of her character and habits? It is obvious that you have projected your own disgruntled feelings that were developed in high school where (please forgive my own inferences)you were probably ignored by girls you saw in a similar light. By the way, if you don't know that something is a fact, you probably should not call it a fact.
goose
[ Parent ]
What about the others? (1.33 / 3) (#487)
by JayLee on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 07:33:57 AM EST

Really I don't blame Natalee and her family, I feel really sorry for them and I hope that she will be found soon. But I do blame the American Media and so on. What makes Natalee so more important than the other missing persons? Tell me please! Just because it happend in Aruba? I am just giving a voice now for the missing children and persons who don't get attention. The American Media (and other Americans) believes the investigation is taking to long....really? They all try very hard to find Natalee and evidence! If you think you can do better, please help them, instead of giving your comments!
A good heart these days is heart to find
Fuck? (1.50 / 4) (#494)
by rubyseeds on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 09:20:14 PM EST

Using the word "fuck" in your title was good in the way that it generated a lot of publicity for you -- whether they be bad or good. I personally think it might have been too harsh, but you got your point across and I agree with it wholeheartedly.

NATALEE HOLLOWAY (1.00 / 17) (#495)
by jerkyjack on Thu Jul 21, 2005 at 11:50:19 PM EST

HOW MANY OF YOU WITH THESE COMMENTS LIVE IN A TRAILER? WE CALL YOU WHITE TRAILER TRASH. YOUR JEALOUS, OBNOXIOUS AND YOU HAVE BODY ODOR. WHEN THE COPS COME TO BREAK UP YOUR SICK RELATIONSHIPS THEY LAUGH RIGHT IN YOUR FACE AND YOUR TOO STUPID TO GET IT. KEEP TALKING, NOBODY HAS EVER LISTENED TO YOU AND THEY NEVER WILL. YOU GET OUR TAXES LOSER AND THAT'S ALL YOU'LL EVER BE, A WHITE TRASH LOSER! SMOKE ON THAT FOR AWHILE IDIOT.

Natalee Holloway (none / 0) (#499)
by AlafairHunter on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 02:44:41 AM EST

Indeed, I am also absolutely sickened by the response to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Horribly enough, it mirrors the abduction of Elizabeth Smart: an American BLONDE girl, from a family with money, makes International news. However, on the very same day that Elizabeth Smart disappeared, a young Hispanic girl was also kidnapped from her bedroom. What did the media make of this? It is horrifying that the fate of white BLONDE girls becomes the Top Story, while the fates of others less, shall we say, privileged, receives no attention whatsoever. And I am a Caucasian fair-haired woman of European and wealthy descent myself, so no bias exists as to my heritage.... I have come to the conclusion that if Natalee Holloway had not had the financial resources to dye her hair blonde, her disappearance would not be Headline News. Because, face it folks:Natalee Holloway is UGLY. At least Elizabeth Smart had a loveliness that would not be diminished without the allure of blonde hair-take away Miss Holloway's expensive single-process dye-job, and you have a dumpy, short-legged girl, with a repulsive nose, flaps of repulsive flesh when she smiled, bad skin, and a masculine face-shape that rendered the poor girl UGLY. And the photos of her friends! Good Lord, girls from Alabama are nothing short of repulsive! These facts notwithstanding, the Hideous Miss Holloway did not deserve the fate that befell her. Her spoiled, pampered, nothing will happen to pretty little me attitude did not serve her well. All parents in the world should now realize that this 'Girls Are Everything" attitude does not create the strong women we think it will-it simply creates simpering, self-entitled, self-important little bitches who think that they are able to mince prettily through life simply because they are female. The reason I refuse to have children is because the odds of my giving birth to a useless, non-name-carrying-on selfish, useless, menstruating, smelly, spoiled, worthless female are too great. I feel for the family of Miss Holloway, but little bitches reap what they sow.

[ Parent ]
Thanks for not reproducing (none / 0) (#529)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:35:51 AM EST

First off, thank you for not having children. Some people just should not breed. The fact that Elizabeth Smart was blonde, was a PURE coincidence. What about Lacy Peterson? Now you should say something about brunettes. Secondly, the "Girls are everything attitude" is ridulous. I can't even believe anyone out of grade school would actually think that way. Stop whining.

[ Parent ]
nice name, real classy (none / 0) (#508)
by kbudha on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 04:16:06 PM EST

I'm surprised you can even spell trailer trash Jimbo.You sure as hell don't know how to turn off the FUCKING CAPSLOCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ Parent ]
CAPS LOCK is two words. (none / 0) (#528)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:26:09 AM EST

:)

[ Parent ]
you're so clever (none / 0) (#550)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:49:02 AM EST



[ Parent ]
This is sad. (1.25 / 8) (#497)
by blues0022 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 02:33:45 AM EST

First of all - the title of this article is quite misleading. It is not the fault of Natalee Holloway that she is being put all over the news, nor is it the fault of her family. Her family merely wants to find her, and if being on the news can help that, they will use it as a tool. I'll admit the bias the news has to "beautiful people" over the less ideal. But that is no fault of Natalee Holloway. Second of all - if you people would spend your time bettering yourselves instead of commenting on such a topic, then our society may be better. I can only guess how many of you have gone and commented on how bad things are. Look to yourselves as the reason. My prayers are with Natalee and her family. If you have anything to say to me, please email me at blues0022@hotmail.com.

The title (none / 0) (#501)
by gbd on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 03:41:51 AM EST

At no point do I blame Natalee or her family for the media coverage. "Fuck Natalee Holloway" is an admittedly provocative title, but it refers to the news story of Natalee, not Natalee herself. The example that I've used before is Watergate; when I say the word "Watergate", people will assume I'm talking about the story and scandal of Watergate, not about the actual Washington hotel itself. "Fuck The Way That The American Media Has Covered The Natalee Holloway Story" may have been a more accurate and targeted title, but it doesn't work (from a perspective of economy and practicality.)

Look, nobody can blame the Holloway family for using the media to keep this story alive. Any one of us would do the same thing, given a compliant media. I have no beef with Natalee's family, and I don't think that anything I wrote would imply otherwise. My ire is reserved for the media and its willingness to put this story on a pedestal, ignoring other events of actual import to ordinary Americans.

I can certainly understand why Natalee's friends and family would want to keep this story alive, but even they have been unable to explain why she is more important and more worthy of news coverage than any of the rest of us. Only in my darkest dreams can I imagine how the parents of missing children that the media doesn't care about must be feeling right about now.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

Good comment (none / 0) (#560)
by kate740 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 04:34:02 PM EST

Although I don't necessarily agree with you, I respect what you're saying and where you're coming from. However, SO many people are commenting with "yeah, fuck Natalee Holloway...she deserved it. She put herself in that situaion...etc." It's very concerning to me because society as a whole tends to blame victims of crime rather than those who are committing those crimes. I appreciate this comment and hope that others will read it and understand the point of your article.

[ Parent ]
then change the title - or post a new one. (none / 0) (#1300)
by USAWINS on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 03:50:43 PM EST

Only you can make this right gbd, I personally couldn't sleep at night knowing that when some caring person googles for natalie holloway info, that the first thing they see if "fuck natalie holloway" come on now. you're hurting people.

[ Parent ]
Not how this site works. (none / 1) (#1308)
by akostic on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 04:22:55 PM EST

Write a counter article and watch it be dumped in flames!
--
"After an indeterminate amount of time trading insane laughter with the retards, I grew curious and tapped on the window." - osm
[ Parent ]
RE: ggle (none / 0) (#1309)
by akostic on Wed Apr 19, 2006 at 04:24:20 PM EST

when some caring person googles for natalie holloway info, that the first thing they see if "fuck natalie holloway"

Read up on how pagerank works and then start your larger campaign to get people to stop linking here.
The more attention you give it, the more likely it is to stay up top :)
--
"After an indeterminate amount of time trading insane laughter with the retards, I grew curious and tapped on the window." - osm
[ Parent ]

Natalie Holloway Disappearance In Aruba (none / 0) (#515)
by Barney1938 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 08:21:56 PM EST

7/22/05 Friday Folks, due to the media blitz, we are all in overload with news not only of Natalie, but a lot of other even less important stories and issues. We all feel for this tired, stressed family, who have been maligned, as has their kidnapped and probably murdered or prostitued daughter. Put your family in the same position, walk a mile in their shoes and if will hurt. We need to stay focused on what we can all here in the US Of A can do to help out. We can donate funds to help find her, help her family stay in Aruba to keep after the Dutch authorities to make something happen. AmSouth Bank in B'ham,Alabama has a trust fund set up for this purpose. We can and I have written to President George W.Bush, asking for his and Sec. of State Condy Rice's help with the Aruban police and justice dept.by our using the vast fed. govt. resources of the FBI to either find Natalie alive, or dead, if there are any remains to be found. This family needs and deserves some kind of closure in this case, one way or the other, no matter how sad or hard it may become. We can contact our Senators in Washington DC, to ask for their help in urging our govt. to become more pro-actively involved in this investigation, tho it is way late. Lastly, we can pray for this family and for poor Natalie whether she be alive or deceased, God Knows Where She and the Rest of US Are. Barney1938

[ Parent ]
Why is Natalee Holloway so important? (none / 0) (#564)
by Razitshakra on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 05:50:29 PM EST

There must be at least thousands, if not tens of thousands of missing persons in the USA. Why is Natalee Holloway more important than those others?

That is the point of the "Fuck Natalee Holloway" story. So why Barney?

--
Lets ride / You and I / In the midnight ambulance
- The Northern Territories
[ Parent ]
You're right (2.00 / 4) (#502)
by JulioCruz on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 04:06:56 AM EST

you're right in what you're saying, good comment the title is just a bit harsh.

In Natalee's Defense (1.14 / 14) (#504)
by mbridge007619 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 10:11:41 AM EST

First of all, I made this account just so I could reply to you losers about Natalee Holloway. The fact that there is so much attention focused on her is not because she is WHITE assholes. Get over it. This is America and racism is becoming a thing of the past, except for the few poor idiot losers who feel sorry for themselves and think they got where they are because of their color. HA! Her parents and friends are the ones who prompted the extensive search. And who gives a fuck if we are sending 3 F-16 war planes to look?? Holy %^$#$ THREE OF THEM?!!! Military people are used to the bare minimum, so money to "equip these 3 planes" is hardly anything to sneeze at. Really, who really cares? Have you noticed that her MOM is in Aruba?? Probably not. Well yeah, her mom is there, and is the one who will not give up. The money that is being spent is being done through what they call..get this...FUND RAISERS. Yeah new concept. There are some political issues revolving around the case/investigation, just as there are with everything in life. You are lucky that you live in this country and an investigation if ever done on you, would be done in haste, not as with Aruba's Government. Hence the politics. And by the looks of those "SLUGS," would you trust them?! Yeah okay, probably not. And do you think her family is proud of the "airtime" Natalee gets? NO, but they are on top of their game and doing what they can. Oh yeah they are now offering rewards to for tips leading to her safe return.. So get off your ass and start looking. I guess the legalization of gay marriage in Spain is what you want to hear about...Liberals. Grow up.

YOU LIBERAL!!!!!!! (none / 0) (#507)
by kbudha on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 04:14:00 PM EST

I wonder if I could fund raise that much money for needy people who are still alive and productive. Or any other kidnapped person. Don't think so. And you can shove the name calling you know where. I can get alot more creative. I'd probably hurt your feelings.

[ Parent ]
None taken! (none / 0) (#526)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 09:44:14 AM EST

Don't worry about hurt feelings, no clue who you are or what you stand for, so no worries. Other than fund raisers, trust funds are set up in an effort to raise money. And in case you have lived in a bubble, there have been plenty of people that went missing, that have had just as much attention, trust funds, etc. As for the people that are alive, and starving or whatever you said, maybe they should raise their own money by means of a JOB. Kind of hard for missing people to raise their own money, ya know?! And actually its her family that is keeping it going. Relax, don't watch the news if you can't take it.

[ Parent ]
prove it (none / 0) (#546)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:27:04 AM EST

stop fuckin lying.Name the other children. Provide details.It should be easy since you watch the news so much and you're so informed. And if you think fundraising and family support can get get the approved usage of the FBI plus 3 F-16s, then you're the buggest sucker walking. Just as stupid as Ms Natalie for jumping in that car with Mr date-rapist and the Habib Twins.Speaking of jobs where you work Burger King? No you're just between jobs right. Don't know what kinda job you have but I bet its a dozy, what with you existing in Dreamland and all. Hey how about you fund raise some money for a labotomy you stupid fuck.

[ Parent ]
do a spell check (none / 0) (#571)
by mbridge007619 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 07:28:35 PM EST

before you start going off on someone. It's spelled lobotomy, so maybe you are the one who needs it. And Real Estate is a very luctritive industry, that Burger King comment was lame. So yeah maybe I am in dreamland all day, sorry that you are so bitter and want more attention and money spent on you rather than on Natalee. I never said fund raisers can raise the money to fly an F-16, but they have raised quite a bit. Those planes are designed to fly to find shallow graves. And I do watch the news alot, thanks for noticing. As for the FBI, well that's their job, right? And like I said in my other comment, dumb fuck (the intelligent name you chose), I was in the military. Here's a tid bit of info on F-16: The F-16 Fighting Falcon is a compact, multi-role fighter aircraft. It is highly maneuverable and has proven itself in air-to-air combat and air-to-surface attack. It provides a relatively low-cost, high-performance weapon system for the United States and allied nations. The F-16 was built under an unusual agreement creating a consortium between the United States and four NATO countries: Belgium, Denmark, the Netherlands and Norway. Did you catch LOW COST first sentence in that sentence??????

[ Parent ]
stfu (none / 0) (#598)
by kbudha on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 11:05:33 AM EST

Nice quote you got outta of a book you checked out at the library.F-16s are designed to find shallow graves!!!!!!!!!!!What are you smoking. That statement makes me doubt you were in the military.Seriously.Don't care if I misspelled lobotomy, you still obviouly got annoyed."Attention and money spent on me",yeah okay.And you still didn't give details from this threads parent comment.I'm gonna be nice to you now even though you started it by insulting me just because I pointed out that "liberal" is such a lame labeling for so many different people by an obvious conservative republican majority.And I'll even give you the chance to prove me wrong for judging you.Tell me about real estate. I've had an idea for awhile I'd be willing to discuss with you if we could put aside our differences.

[ Parent ]
I do my research.. (none / 0) (#618)
by mbridge007619 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:22:09 PM EST

so that I may argue intelligently. Also have smoked some good stuff in my time, but never had any hallucinations about F-16's...that I know of.;) They have the ability to locate shallow graves because they are equipped with infrared and sonar-scanning capacity. (not to mention these planes came from Holland,not U.S.) Sorry if you don't believe me, but its true. And if you also don't believe that I was in the military, that is fine too, I am trying to forget those days. :) I have not replied to parent threads, and here's why: Natalee's case is very unique in the way that she is a symbol. A symbol of American youth that we must protect and not let another country walk all over us. We should feel proud that as Americans, and as young Americans we have the freedom to do whatever we wish, to go on vacations where we want and return home safely. This is our right and it should be protected, and should be made an example out of. Those idiots will get what is coming to them, that I am sure of. As I have previously stated, her parents are the ones who are pushing the issue, speaking to prime ministers, etc. So aside from all of that, I am in Resort Real Estate (not time shares). Whole ownership, pre-construction condos world-wide. I work for a developer based out of Canada....bounce your idea off of me and I would be happy to give some input...

[ Parent ]
Wow (none / 0) (#673)
by kbudha on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 11:59:03 AM EST

You actually proved me wrong by not telling me to go to hell.You're alright, even though you sounded like the typical rep-conservative know-it-all.My idea is to buy land and have "quad-pods"(what I nicknamed them)built for rental property.To me rentals are the easiest small business. They run themselves, you just have to keep up on their maintenance. Oh and do background checks to ensure you rent to descent clients. A "quad-pod" is a basic apartment building, 4 apts, 2 downstairs-2 upstairs, mostly 2 bedroom units.I've done estimates and you can fit a quadpod with reasonable parking space on .5 acres(tight fit)to 1 acre(roomy parking,backyards, and sideyards). About how much would it cost to contract build one of these would you say.Ball-park figure. I can figure out land pricing myself. Also would you have any suggestions on getting funding. I have ideas for a portfolio(business plan) to take to the bank. I have awesome credit but very little colateral so this is probably nothing but a pipe dream anyways.

[ Parent ]
Sounds like a plan... (none / 0) (#771)
by mbridge007619 on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 02:24:33 PM EST

Sounds like you want to be an investor. Most of our buyers start that way, and it can generate mucho dinero. I do not know how much it would cost to build something like that, our condos start in the high $500's to purchase, but probably a fraction to build. Since we do preconstruction, we start out with about $1 Billion budget and work from there. But these are high end properties. Wish I could help, but there is alot of leg work and research you would need to do to figure how much it costs to build.

[ Parent ]
Funding... (none / 0) (#776)
by mbridge007619 on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 02:33:07 PM EST

sorry but funding would have to be done through a lender of some sort. I work for a major developer and we get funding, so its hard for me to speculate...

[ Parent ]
meant to say (none / 0) (#777)
by mbridge007619 on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 02:36:13 PM EST

sorry I cannot type today...meant to say we do not get funding....they provide us with a marketing/sales budget for each project, and we take it from there...

[ Parent ]
military knowledge (none / 0) (#547)
by kbudha on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 08:32:46 AM EST

By the way you don't know shit about the military. The only people that get "bare minimum" are the grunts. Not F-16s or their pilots moron.And you definitely don't know JACKSHIT about the Dutch military.STFU

[ Parent ]
um ok (none / 0) (#568)
by mbridge007619 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 07:14:04 PM EST

I was in the military jackass.

[ Parent ]
becareful what you wish for....third party comment (none / 1) (#505)
by mbridge007619 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 10:39:31 AM EST

well i would say yeah he's right that Nat. is getting more coverage than the Alvarado chick, but its because people are watching the Nat. story and its getting tons of air time because people are watching it and ratings are sky rocketing. Hence the money, funraisers, you name it. The guy needs to get over it, i do think he is gay because the last news bleep he tossed in there had nothing to do with the other three and i think he felt guilty if he didnt mention something about gay news. The whole story about a high school grad taking a trip that was supposed to be fun and never returned was something crazy and plenty news worthy, do you mean to tell me that if it was his daughter he would be complaining about the coverage. HELL NO. wonder also why he didnt have anything to say about the missing honeymooners.

This: (none / 0) (#506)
by gbd on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 10:58:44 AM EST

The guy needs to get over it, i do think he is gay because the last news bleep he tossed in there had nothing to do with the other three and i think he felt guilty if he didnt mention something about gay news.

This is the best comment in the whole thread.

--
Gunter glieben glauchen globen.
[ Parent ]

You must admit (2.50 / 2) (#509)
by blues0022 on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 04:42:44 PM EST

You must admit that this is an interesting story though. The Natalee Holloway story is something many people across the country can relate to. Someone's daughter goes away on a graduation trip and does not return. Millions of adults in the United States have children, many of who are still yet to go through graduation and the graduation trip. This means that this is a story that millions of people can relate to. You cannot really blame the news for covering a story that would get so much attention. After all, attention is ratings, and ratings are what pay the bills. How many people really care about a robotic bullet being fired at a comet? Possibly some astronomers could relate but im sure most of the country would rather have updates on a US grown girl gone missing in Aruba.

FUCK NATALIE HOLLOWAY (2.00 / 3) (#511)
by beaverlaker on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 06:09:32 PM EST

enough is enough, if you play with fire you will get burned, how could there be no physical evidence, even if they ran her through a wood chipper something would turn up, most especially with all of the eyes looking in aruba, aruba ain't exactly australia

idiot (none / 1) (#514)
by buckster on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 08:19:47 PM EST

No shit there would be more evidence if you put her through a wood chipper. What college did you go to, to know that aruba is not australia?

[ Parent ]
back door hillbilly (1.00 / 10) (#513)
by buckster on Fri Jul 22, 2005 at 08:15:44 PM EST

You back door licking hillbilly. As someone else said, Go back in your trailer and smoke whatever it is that you some, you stupid f%#@ head.

People are just selfish (1.14 / 7) (#517)
by skatermom13 on Sat Jul 23, 2005 at 04:41:01 PM EST

I think that the fact that people are talking bad about the Holloway family is hateful. Everyone should support what her family and friends are doing for her. I would do the same for my child. I feel her parents have showed how a parents love should be for a child. So all you selfish inconsiderate people just find something else to do with your time and shutup. If you don't like the attention this missing persons case is getting, then just don't watch it on T.V.
skatermom13
[ Parent ]
about the title.... (2.33 / 3) (#516)
by krazyblonde on Sat Jul 23, 2005 at 12:47:01 AM EST

Well, basically I just want to comment on all the COMMENTING that is going on here about the title of the article. Although I agree it is rather immature, there was reasoning here. All of you people who are complaining about the title, well, it got you to read it, right? That is the point behind it. I don't believe the author is INTENTIONALLY disrespecting Miss Holloway and her family by the title. Rather, as with any good book, song, speech, you start it off with a bang to get people's attention, and it has clearly succeeded in doing that. It is most def. offensive, but that lies in the eyes of the beholder, if people choose to become offended by something, I pity them. It is simply an attention getter, and if you let it bother you beyond that, again, that is completely up to you. Don't take things so personally people! Chill out! In this society you must learn to not become so offended and let other people's actions upset you so. :P

I AGREE. I agree. I agree. ... (2.33 / 3) (#521)
by wishfulthinking on Sun Jul 24, 2005 at 02:22:19 AM EST

I am from Birmingham and just this past March a man told me I did my job poorly because I am black. When I go into the Mountain Brook area people look at me with surprise and marvel at my ability to articulate!! All my life I have tried to convince myself that people don't see the color of my skin first. However, this Natalee Holloway circus just confirms my greatest fears that the color of my skin really does matter, it evidently greatly matters. And I can't help but wonder if I had ever met Natalee would she see me as a person first and a black person later. I doubt it. And I wonder if I went on vacation and drank on a senior trip in Aruba would people care if I disappeared? I don't know. I don't think so, unfortunately. My anger brews, and I try not to hate. I have traveled the world and followed dreams all the way to NYC, I have been blessed to live an extraordinary life, yet I wish I didn't have to be perfect to be seen as equal. I wish I could be flawed and party and have fighter jets come to my rescue when I make a mistake and get lost, but no it's just wishful thinking. Mountain Brook: A Tiny Kingdom? No, a fortress to shut out me and others with my skin color, so as not to ruin the view of their rose-colored world. Natalee Holloway: A heroine in peril worthy of all the USA's adulation?No, more like a girl just like me who deserves no more and no less attention.

USA-Melting Pot (none / 0) (#527)
by mbridge007619 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 10:16:28 AM EST

Sir, I am sorry to say, but your color having anything to do with anything these days (its not the 1960's) has little to do with you getting a job, etc. I have a very pretty WHITE girlfriend, who has been looking for a job for months. She is very skilled and talented. It's the JOB market and the way the economy is today. It's people like you that keep racism alive, but thinking so simple mindedly. Hard work and ambition pays off, REGARDLESS OF WHAT RACE YOU ARE.

[ Parent ]
Stop feeling sorry for yourself. This story has... (none / 0) (#541)
by Polo555 on Mon Jul 25, 2005 at 07:38:08 PM EST

NOTHING to do with the color of your skin.

[ Parent ]
Mountain Brook (none / 0) (#565)
by alabama2 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 05:51:48 PM EST

I am from Mountain Brook. While it might not be the most diverse place on earth it is certainly not anything like you described. I can assure you that it is not "a fortress to shut out me and others with my skin color, so as not to ruin the view of their rose-colored world." That is a little dramatic. Neither racism nor the color of your skin have anything to do with Natalee's disappearance.

[ Parent ]
I AGREE!! (none / 0) (#578)
by tarnesha321 on Wed Jul 27, 2005 at 04:00:17 AM EST

I lived in Mountain Brook for two years while attending college, and never once did I feel like an outcast because of my color. I did not see rednecks there either. Actually, the Birmingham area is a pretty nice place and it is not at all back woods redneck. In my opinion, those who harbor a negative attitude to begin with only sabatoge themselves and become narrow minded. I am sure there are still some white people who are prejudiced just as that "newyork who wants to own the south" person is about how he or she hates white people. Today, I believe most of this generation is less concerned about race and more judgemental towards deadbeats of any color. Those who do not let life stop them from gaining an education leading to a good job will be respected no matter what race they may be as long as they prove to be a good, dependable employee. I wish some people on this board would quit the "waa waa" and stop using this Holloway case to vent their anger for what they have not acomplished with their own life. Natalie is just an American girl who disappeared in a forign country. Who cares that she is white and is getting a lot of media attention, she is missing under some very mysterious circumstances and Americans should be concerned as that could have been their daughter; we should be united and care about one another. Why do certain people have to turn this into a racial hate parade? All that does is divide a strong nation of people who could get things done if together. Instead, why don't people direct anger towards the individual(s) who had the audacity to think that they could get away with harming an American tourist on vacation in their country? I hope none of the hateful people on this board ever have a child that turns up missing in a forign country. Just remember, what comes around, goes around.

[ Parent ]
Racial Profiling Abounds 7/26/05 (none / 1) (#566)
by Barney1938 on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 06:11:31 PM EST

I agree, that everyone wishes to be accepeted by others, their race or otherwise, based upon what Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. stated," the content of their character." To my great surprise, being from Mississippi, I have seen enormous strides in racial reconciliation here. But, there is much more work to be done and some, those of my own generation primarily, will never accept people of other races as equals, no matter what race. For one thing, people of the white race here resent having to fund so much of the tax burden to finance govt. subsidy programs for black welfare citizens, when after 140 years, blacks should be capable, but dont seem able to support and take care of themselves, or act responsibly. Until the welfare, crime, and give away programs, set asides, and job discriminatry practices cease, I dont see the racial barriers being lifted anytime soon. One thing you must understand as well is this, there are those who want a race war, constant turmoil in the USA from racially motivated conflicts, as their motivation is to raise unpopular issues constantly, cause strife, fundraisers, etc. to get your and my money. These are Jews, who are the enemy of Whites, and Blacks, alike. Jews brought your people over here from Africa for slavery in the cotton fields, not some poor dumb ass white guy in the Deep South, who owned little land and could barely feed himself or his family, let alone buy slaves at $500 for a young child and $2500 for a young strong field hand. Land sold for $.50 to $1.00 per acre back then. Jews funded the Many sailing ships to Africa, owned the ships, paid for the goods aboard the ships to trade and sell to the slave traders, Black slavers, or as often Arab(Jew) slave traders along the African coast. Have you ever noticed that this known fact is not included in children's school books, wonder why?? Jews own and have owned the publishing business here and abroad forever, so why spill the beans on their own evil deeds when it can be blamed on others. Louis Farhhican(sp) of the Nation of Islam, is 110% right in his charges against the Jews abroad and here for their deeds. With a population of 3.0% they control the news media outlets, print media,financial institutions, govt. agencies as heads of depts., key govt. positions, the movie, tv, and recording industry.They sit at Presidents at 12 of the leading universities :Harvard,Yale, MIT, Stanford, Cornell, Princeton, and leading medical schools, AMA, drug mfg. companies, thus a death grip on this and other industrialized countries around the world. So, your enemy is not some dumbass white guy or gal, but you know who.

[ Parent ]
JEWS DID WTC (none / 0) (#646)
by A Bore on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 03:56:46 AM EST

Jews can kill anyone they want! Jews cut off heads ALL the time and don't even think twice about it. These guys are so crazy and awesome that they flip out ALL the time. I heard that there was this jew who was eating at a diner. And when some dude dropped a spoon the jew killed the whole town. My friend Mark said that he saw a jew totally uppercut some kid just because the kid opened a window.



And that's what I call REAL Ultimate Power!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



[ Parent ]
nice plagarism; bit of advice: (none / 0) (#647)
by billt on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 06:23:46 AM EST

get an imagination. or steal one if you have to.

[ Parent ]
here's some advice: (none / 1) (#648)
by A Bore on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 06:45:26 AM EST

don't be clever

[ Parent ]
That's good advice (none / 0) (#722)
by billt on Thu Jul 28, 2005 at 08:24:17 PM EST

but it doesn't apply to me.

[ Parent ]
No, that is true. /nt (none / 0) (#727)
by A Bore on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 02:57:34 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Lol (none / 0) (#734)
by billt on Fri Jul 29, 2005 at 09:11:43 AM EST

I win. HAND.

[ Parent ]
wishfulthinking are you fking insane???? (1.00 / 2) (#569)
by Newyorkownzthesouth on Tue Jul 26, 2005 at 07:18:34 PM EST

I'm a mixed race male(black/italian)and I am astounded at you wishful. The fact that you, a black woman are actually lowering yourself to live among such inbred,hick,white trash filth as the alabamians. Or southern caucasians in general for that matter. You need to move north with the civilized people. The folks who don't participate in family sex,beastiality,or any other freaky perverted southern nonsense. How can you sit there and complain about some guy saying you do your job poorly because you're black,when you're asking for it by living in the south? Honestly, no minority with the available money, and common sense,would lower themselves to living in the south. Same goes for northern caucasians.If you're living amongst sister and brother fucking rednecks, and you're not white, hey newsflash wishful, they are going to be racist towards you. Don't take offense to this post, it's what I call tough love. I hate to see anyone, black,(northern)white,creole,mixed,asian,latino,native american have to suffer by living in the south amongst such human garbage. Since you have traveled the world, I take it you have money. So do yourself a favor, get the hell out of the south woman lol. Move to cali, new york, pennsylvania,mass.,anywhere just leave the south and avoid the midwest at all costs. They're just as bad. Only fatter.*breathes*..NOW...with that being said, onto this Natalee Holloway story.I don't think her race has anything to do with it really. FOX news is a conservative news channel. So why not constantly run a story about a missing hillbilly girl when your audience is mainly from states that are rampant with hillbillies?AFter all, the red states voted Bush in, not the blue ones. FOX is just pandering to their audience.and CNN doesn't cover this as much when compared to FOX.Trust me I know.I personally hope Natalee is dead. The way I see it,southern whites (rednecks,hillbillies,whatever) are useless and handicap society with their incestual,racist,pig fucking ways. and Someone needs to wipe them out like hitler almost wiped out the jews. Only the jews didn't deserve it,southern whites do. Whos really gonna miss Natalee? Just another redneck hillbilly, who like a gang member or child molestor, means about this (holds up zero sign) much to society.Now look at this situation. The arubans have purposely screwed up this investigation and continue to release and retract info. Why? Because aruba is an island full of what we here in the U.S. would call minorities. You think they give a shit about a missing redneck? Trust me, they know just how bigoted southerners are, and frankly, they don't give a damn about this girl. and They shouldn't. The world would be better off without another junior klan member from the south.Plus being a trust fund brat myself, I'd hate to see a kid like van der sloot and the kalpoes who are going to become important people in their respective countries some day, go down for the murder of white trash scum like N. Holloway.Her future only consisted of working in some local diner like ROSCOS or JIMBOS STEAK (we really know its ROADKILL) AND GRITS or something.So whether they did it or not, I hope they don't get sent to prison.But the most hilarious thing about this whole thing, is that woman who got on her radio show in alabama and said she told the people in georgia,alabama,and mississippi not to visit aruba. LMAO? How much does the white trash that resides in those states pump into the aruban economy every year? Not nearly as much money as they spend on booze and shotgun shells.Oh and arent we forgetting that people who visit foreign lands A.Want to experience different cultures,and B. Have the money to do so? Does that sound like the M.O. of a southern white person? No.Anywhere outside of their redneck states is considered foreign land to those trashbags. Not to mention people in the united states dont even value southern whites as human beings,what makes her think the islanders in aruba give a shit? and Don't think for a second they don't know that southern whites are 7th class citizens in the u.s. If this girl had been from an important part of america,they'd have given a better effort to find her.Those ecusearch guys who showed up to help were from texas.White trash has to look out for white trash and all that jazz.On the subject of mississippi, Natalee is originally a mississippi native. That really makes her more of piece of trailor trash than she already was living in bama.I'm sure her mom had delusions of moving to the north with us superior educated people but knew they would NOT be accepted or wanted here. Not to mention theres too many nonwhites in the north for their liking. The reason why they won't ever find natalee is because of that woman who was on the radio. When you tell a country or island that you will put a dent in their visiting redneck population,if they don't find this missing hillbilly broad, thats more motivation for them not to find her. I'm sure the folks in aruba responded with *Good, keep the missipians,bama trash,and georgia losers off the island*.They're scaring away our upper middle class new york and cali visitors.To sum things up, Natalee is hopefully dead. and If she is, thats just one less redneck in the world.and Thats a cause for celebration. In fact,when they fish her body out of the waters of aruba, I'll most likely throw a party with all of my upper middle class friends (of all races)&family in new york. They hate southern whites just as much as I do.

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I'm a mixed race male(black/italian) (none / 1) (#908)