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Help with high-tech car building

By japhar81 in Technology
Fri Nov 16, 2001 at 06:20:03 PM EST
Tags: Help! (Ask Kuro5hin) (all tags)
Help! (Ask Kuro5hin)

In my efforts to turn my new 2001 Jeep Wrangler into my dream car, I've come up with some things I want to do, and have seen done, but can't find a shred of info about online.

So, where does a geek turn to make his car geeky? Having no other alternatives left (usenet, google, all useless), and considering I'm sick of reading about politics, I hope you guys (and gals) can help.


Let me first describe what I have. Essentially, right now, it's a stock 2001 Jeep Wrangler SE, that I just added an Alpine IVA-C800 fold-out screen and an Alpine NVE-N851A navigation system [ed: look under "mobile multimedia" and "navigation"], both mounted under the rear seat. I left the speakers stock for now, because, frankly, I don't care, it sounds good enough for what I'm doing. I'll be installing the Alpine DHA-S680 6 DVD changer as soon as it comes in next week.

I apologize if that sounded like bragging, but it may be useful for what I'm about to ask.

I have four specific goals in mind that I want to accomplish, and money is pretty irrelevant for this project, so any info on any of these would be greatly appreciated.
  1. I want to either tie into the C800 screen, or do a custom glove-box solution, a car monitor/control setup. Basically, something that ties into the onboard diagnostics and gives me real-time sensor data, preferably with graphs. I've seen this done a number of times, but I can't find it anywhere.

  2. This one is mostly for anyone that already has a C800 or something similar, if you dont, feel free to skip. The alpine units ship with a parking brake lead to make sure you can't watch DVDs while driving (its illegal in all 50 states). The irritating thing is, you have to do a weird thing of holding down the brake, engaging, releasing, and re-engaging the parking brake, and then releasing the brake. A pain to say the least. I know ebay sells override kits for $90, but I'd like to know what they do, I hate wiring random ebay things in to a thousand dollar setup. I know a momentary switch and a 12V power source are involved. If anyone's done this/has details, please, let me know.

  3. I want a night-vision infra-red overlay, like most cadilacs(sp) have, except I want it to cover the entire windshield, I'd guess it'll take two projectors.

  4. This probably extends #3, or would run off the same system. I'd like to do a HUD on my windshield, preferably one I can control the display of from an on-board laptop (how do I wire one in if I need one?). Basically, the driver's half of the windshield I want to turn in to a digital dash, with maybe a map overlay from the nav unit if possible.
I hope you guys can help with this, I dont know where else to look. I've got the EE/CS expertese to know how to connect things, and can probably do alot of custom stuff myself, but I'm not adverse to getting it installed. Any tips, pointers, advice on this sort of rig would be greatly appreciated. At the least, maybe this will start an interesting thread on where car technology stands today.

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Poll
Am I going overboard?
o Yes 39%
o Naah 1%
o Probably, but if you get it done it'll be sweet 39%
o Where's the PS2? 10%
o Who drives anyway? That requires people-contact 8%

Votes: 58
Results | Other Polls

Related Links
o Google
o Alpine IVA-C800 fold-out screen
o Alpine NVE-N851A navigation system
o Alpine DHA-S680 6 DVD changer
o Also by japhar81


Display: Sort:
Help with high-tech car building | 56 comments (48 topical, 8 editorial, 0 hidden)
You're doing this to a Jeep? (4.33 / 3) (#1)
by wiredog on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 01:52:52 PM EST

Dude, no one with sense puts expensive components in a Jeep. All it's gonna take is one guy with a knife to cut the top open (not even that if you have the top down) and some basic tools to unmount the stuff. If you're running with a hardtop it'll be a bit more secure, until the day the top comes off. And if you're never going to run without the top, or with it down, why buy a Jeep? You are just asking to have $X,000 worth of equipment ripped off.

If there's a choice between performance and ease of use, Linux will go for performance every time. -- Jerry Pournelle
Not relevant, really (3.00 / 1) (#2)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 01:57:37 PM EST

This is my toy car, not the car I drive to work in or anything. It's always either in my garage or on the beach or someplace where I always see it. Its never out of sight when the top is down, and I run with a hard top, plus I have the tazer security system, you even touch the metal while its armed, and you'll have a hard time walking, much less stealing. Yeah, i know its not legal to install in the US, its legal to own though, and it was installed in canada.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Jeepers (4.00 / 3) (#7)
by treetops on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:09:25 PM EST

plus I have the tazer security system, you even touch the metal while its armed, and you'll have a hard time walking, much less stealing

While walking down the street, you sometimes bump into cars. If I ever got shocked by one, I would most likely locate several large rocks and shatter all the windows. Do you consider this a possible risk?
--tt
[ Parent ]

it warns first (none / 0) (#11)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:23:43 PM EST

The car warns you, it does the 'step away, blah blah' when youre within a foot, then it shocks you. As far as rocks, I shocked myself once by accident (battery in remote died, so it didnt disarm), I couldnt even go to work the next day, forget carrying a rock.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Do you know of an attorney? (none / 0) (#15)
by quam on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:48:43 PM EST

Let's say, hypothetically, a person with a heart condition or a pacemaker parks next to your car and accidently, while carrying a heavy bag or trying to navigate between your car and his, touches your car multiple times, only to receive a jolt from your car. Considering this hypothetical in addition to per se illegal use of the alarm, a judge may be very unhappy with you.

Each person cannot live life with a paranoia of lawsuits, but a person taking risks in society also entertains a significantly higher risk of being the subject of a lawsuit or criminal offense.

-- U.S. Patent 5443036 concerns a device for encouraging a cat to exercise by chasing a light spot.
[ Parent ]
uhh, whats illegal about it? (none / 0) (#16)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:52:22 PM EST

Use of tazer and, hell, flamethrower security systems is legal in the US. I went to a law library to double check. The law says, essentially, you can not install it here, if you can prove it wasnt installed here, youre free to use it. I had 2 years of law school before I went the IT route, Im not a lawyer, but I know enough to play one on TV and interpret statute.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Civil suits (5.00 / 1) (#17)
by wiredog on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 03:00:22 PM EST

Talk to a lawyer before you arm that thing. If some six year old, or even sixteen year old, kid decides to sit on your hood you'll be in court in a big hurry. And, unless you've gotten a rider on it, the insurance probably won't cover you. Assuming the police don't arrest you for assault, negligence, or whatever they can hang on you. You could spend more on legal fees than you would replacing the car.

If there's a choice between performance and ease of use, Linux will go for performance every time. -- Jerry Pournelle
[ Parent ]
my insurance covers it (none / 0) (#19)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 03:08:27 PM EST

In fact, they gave me a massive price brake for installing it. Besides, I have 500k of legal insurance, I think Im safe.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Laws and Laws (none / 0) (#20)
by MrAcheson on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 03:20:27 PM EST

Be very very careful with this thing. Its quite possible to be found guilty of something even if you didn't technically break the law. For instance its completely legal to shoot someone in Texas in order to protect some types of property like your car. This is true even if the theif is not armed. However this does not mean you won't be convicted of murder by a jury anyway, which has incidentally happened law or no. This is taught to all gun owners in Texas.

Beware of a similar possibility here. If someone actually gets hurt by your car especially for doing nothing more than crossing traffic near it, they can charge you both criminally and civilly. Just because you may technically legally be in the right doesn't mean they won't win. Also depending on the amount of injury, its damn easy to get more than a million dollars of pain and suffering. Keep in mind if a bystander does get shocked depending upon the situation they could be set up to be hit by another car seconds later. In which case you would probably bear primary legal responsibility again. Its just not a wise thing to do. I am very surprised that your insurance will cover your liability as this is a lawsuit waiting to happen.


These opinions do not represent those of the US Army, DoD, or US Government.


[ Parent ]
wow (none / 0) (#44)
by Tsuraan on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 07:17:36 PM EST

Will your insurance company also spring you out of prison when your car kills some kid, or old guy with a heart problem? I'd sure think twice before putting that kind of crap into any car that I own...

[ Parent ]
"Step away from the car"!? (5.00 / 1) (#22)
by davidduncanscott on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 04:17:12 PM EST

Wait a minute. I'm walking down the street, minding my own business, or perhaps climbing into my own car in the mall parking lot, and suddenly your car yells at me because I've violated its personal space?

Let me show you the public sidewalk, which often passes within 1 foot of parked cars. Let me emphasize the word "public".

You may not need to wait for someone to get shocked before they pitch a cinder block through your windshield. In fact...where do you live?

[ Parent ]

You know.... (none / 0) (#13)
by finkployd on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:32:52 PM EST

The first little kid who accidently brushes up against your car is going to have his college education paid for.

Finkployd
Sig: (This will get posted after your comments)
[ Parent ]
Don't bet on it. (none / 0) (#18)
by wiredog on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 03:01:15 PM EST

The insurance company probably wouldn't cover that sort of thing.

If there's a choice between performance and ease of use, Linux will go for performance every time. -- Jerry Pournelle
[ Parent ]
Worse (none / 0) (#21)
by finkployd on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 03:41:10 PM EST

I'm not thinking insurance company, I'm thinking lawsuit.

Finkployd
Sig: (This will get posted after your comments)
[ Parent ]
Full of shit or nuts (none / 0) (#55)
by JonesBoy on Tue Nov 20, 2001 at 10:03:07 AM EST

Waitaminute... this thing electrifies the chassis with a couple thousand volts every time someone walks by, and you are gonna put several thousand dollars of sensitive electronics in it? Either you are lying, or you are stupid. Anyway, if you can afford all this crap, why don't you pay someone to do the install job? BTW, even if your car warned me, and incapacitated me momentarily, I would ENSURE distruction of some part of your vehicle. Really.

A HUD system requires reflective glass, or a section of reflective glass, lotsa optics, and lotsa money. Fudging it would look horrible at best. You might as well have an electric lowering movie screen from the top of the windshield. If you have the cash to spend on it, put a couple of grand into the stereo. If you are on the beach and are only looking for attention, a loud -high quality- stereo usually does the trick. Custom paint, wheels, etc would be my next mods.

The e-brake thing can probably be faked with two 556 chips wired as an asable and monostable mulitvibrators, to send a two shot pulse to the switch. Check the web, or just buy the e-bay stuff.


Speeding never killed anyone. Stopping did.
[ Parent ]
I second this (4.00 / 1) (#5)
by treetops on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:04:35 PM EST

Concentrate on making it look nice instead. Just as geeky, and much cheaper. There was a great article that I saw a while back on the subject. Maybe have a look through and see what you like.

Besides, lets face it, for young, single men, cars are really about one thing: chicks. And what will they like more, a killer paint job, or a GPS?
--tt
[ Parent ]

Already going (none / 0) (#8)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:10:59 PM EST

First, I'm not single, chicks arent an issue. Besides, I've never needed a car to pick up women. In any case, it's getting painted this weekend, and for looks I've got brushed aluminum running boards, bumpers, light guards, the spifty T-hood cover, fog lights, light bar, etc. The tech toys are more important to me:)

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Starting point (5.00 / 1) (#12)
by onyxruby on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:30:17 PM EST

A good starting point for a lot of what you want to do is a site called SoundDomain.com. Think of them as being the slashdot of the car audio world. They should defininitely have question 1 and 2 well covered there

As for the third one, well the Cadillac system was developed by Hughes Electronics for GM. I know at the start Cadillac had an exclusive contract for the civillian use of said technology. I don't recall when this expires, I want to say it was for three years, so it may well have expired by now. But they are the ones you'll need to contact if you want the infra-red setup. Cadillac dealers will not sell one to someone off the street. Cadillac wants this technology as a bragging point for their car, thus ensuring Mercedes', Lincolns, et al don't start showing up with this.

Having just owned a Pontiac Grand Prix GTP with a HUD (showed speed etc), I can say that it's a great safety device. I truly does help keep your eyes on the road and off the dashboard. I can also tell you from the time that my windshield was replaced on my Grand Prix that it requires a special kind of windshield to use said HUD display. You can't just use one on any kind of glass. When I asked the glass installer about this I was told that there is some kind of "coating" on the windshield that enables this (and cost my insurance co $800 more than the standard windshield).

You've stated you don't have much in the way of stereo components yet (for example you still have stock speakers). In my experience this has a high probability of changing sometime soon. Buying the components that you did w/o at least upgrading the speakers is kind of like playing a dvd on an old b/w tv. Yes it will function, but your only getting a fraction of the capability of your equipment. In other words, the stock speakers need to go. If you do start to install equipment like better speakers you'll also want to install at least one amplifier. It will make a world of difference on the sound and feel of your audio. Make sure you swap out the alternator with a heavy duty one if your amp requires 8 gauge or higher wire.

There is one warning I will give you on your alarm. Make sure that it doesn't have the blinky lights (turn signals blink on and off upon arm / disarming). This is perhaps the easiest way to disable a car alarm. Remove lens cover, remove bulb, wrap buld with aluminum foil, reinsert bulb, make alarm go off, watch as alarm shorts itself out in half a second. If you do have them, make sure that they are all independently fused, trust me.

For insurance purposes you don't just want pictures of your equipment, you also want pictures of your equipments mounting and wiring. It will make a large difference if you ever have to file a claim, and is almost always required if you decide to ever enter a car audio competition. Good luck, and I'd be curious how it turns out.

The moon is covered with the results of astronomical odds.

Thanks (none / 0) (#14)
by japhar81 on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 02:36:38 PM EST

That was what basically what I was looking for, although I must say I'm depressed about my HUD dreams. The glass you refer to is 'fogged' glass. I worked for Lockheed for a while, and I have a few cans of fogging spray that will coat my windshield and make it HUD-capable, I'm actually looking for the damn projectors, theyre impossible to find.

The alarm advice is great, I'll double check the wiring when I get home. I'm pretty sure you'd get fried touching the grille to take out the bulb, but I'll make sure its fused anyway (it does blink).

Insurance-wise, does having the orginal box/manual cover me? I haven't taken any pictures or anything yet... That just got me thinking.

Also, can you suggest a good speaker/amp rig to go with what I have?

At any rate, thanks for the great info, off to sounddomain I go.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
Answers (none / 0) (#26)
by onyxruby on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 07:52:36 PM EST

On the insurance, what will be helpful are the following:
    Picture of components with the serial number showing, this is perhaps the most important, the box and manual might be sufficeint for some insurance companies, but I know many (like mine) require far more. Also make sure that you get them a list of all components, serials numbers, and save your receipts. If they have this before a loss, it will help your case immensely. In my case I have bought a special rider for my equipment that cost about $30 for 6 months to cover about 4 grand in components.
    Pictures of components with mounting method apparent (in other words, showing that the radio is properly secured and not just resting in place)
    Pictures showing that your wiring is properly grounded at all points (battery, alternator, inside car) and is soldered, not wire capped)
    Last, not a picture, but make up a wiring diagram of all components in the system. Not only is this required for many car audio competitions, but is also very useful to show your insurance company that things are done "professionaly", even if done by yourself. If your car caught on fire, and they discover that you were trying to run 60 amps over the factory wiring, your claim would be denied. Not only are these things good for insurance and competition, but they can be very useful to yourself for planning out your system.
Speakers, I like, really like, Orion. They got their start making circuit boards for the military and use the same standards for the car audio equipment. They are expensive compared to the crap you'll find in a place like best buy, but they are much higher quality. Take a look inside one of their amps and compare it against the newest shiny crap from Rockwell/Fosgate, and you'll see the differences I am talking about. Their equipment has a pretty decent warranty, and one of their amps has won more car stereo competitions than any other amp - ever.

The moon is covered with the results of astronomical odds.
[ Parent ]

HUD displays (4.00 / 1) (#23)
by strlen on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 04:21:30 PM EST

Nissan 240 SX coupes (not hatchbacks), and Corvettes have that feature.. If you're interested in an after market setup, there's an after market tuner company that has such a setup.. they specialized in water-cooled VW's and Audi's, so I do not know whether that's going to work on a Jeep.

--
[T]he strongest man in the world is he who stands most alone. - Henrik Ibsen.
Some starting points (4.00 / 1) (#24)
by djkimmel on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 04:38:34 PM EST

1. I want to either tie into the C800 screen, or do a custom glove-box solution, a car monitor/control setup. Basically, something that ties into the onboard diagnostics and gives me real-time sensor data, preferably with graphs. I've seen this done a number of times, but I can't find it anywhere.

I started to try to do something like this. Not nearly as elaborate as yours, since I didn't want an expensive screen or anything, but the idea was similar. I gotta say, its really too bad that you bought a DaimlerChrysler product for this. Now, I'm not gonna rag on you for this - I'm a Chrysler kinda guy myself and drive a 2000 Cirrus.

I found some cheap chips that convert the ODB-II interface (the standard diagnostic connector and protocol for cars) to RS-232. However, standards are great because there are so many to choose from. Naturally, ODB-II says that you need a certain data protocol, but it says nothing about the ELECTRICAL protocol. In a nutshell, this means that Ford, GM, and Chrysler all use different electrical protocols to talk to the onboard computers. The chips I found can talk to Ford or GM vehicles (seperate chip for each), but not Chryslers. This chips are at Elm Electronics if you want to take a look anyway.

There are some more expensive devices for doing this though, and they do work with Chrysler vehicles. The things that the garages use to talk to your car's computer and figure out what's wrong are called "scan tools". Due the the previously mentioned electrical differences, there is generally one scan tool for each brand (Ford, GM, Chrysler, Imports) of car. Search on Google for "scan tools", check the newsgroup archives for the comp.arch.embedded and rec.autos.tech groups. Also, the data sheets for the Elm Electronics chips explain a bit about how the protocol works, so you might want to read them even though you can't use the chips.

If money isn't an issue, you could probably find a tool that translates between RS-232 and the ODB-II port on your Jeep. They usually come with Windows software to display everything nicely. I don't know how easily that would adapt to what you want to do, but its a start.
-- Dave

OBD-II (3.00 / 1) (#48)
by wiml on Sun Nov 18, 2001 at 10:39:10 PM EST

The October, 2000 (print) issue of Circuit Cellar INK has an article on building an OBD-II protocol converter, including some information on which variants of the interface are used by which manufacturers. The device in the article is fairly simple, just a microcontroller and some glue.

There's a huge amount of random engine data available through this interface, which would doubtless look impressive on the car's display, but please consider the things that other posters have been saying re driver distractions.

[ Parent ]

Yes, but... (4.50 / 2) (#50)
by fluffy grue on Mon Nov 19, 2001 at 12:32:03 AM EST

...can it speak the binary languages of moisture vaporators?
--
"Is not a quine" is not a quine.
I have a master's degree in science!

[ Hug Your Trikuare ]
[ Parent ]

FLIR Displays (4.00 / 1) (#25)
by wiredog on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 07:42:04 PM EST

The type of FLIR (Forward Looking Infra-Red) displays the caddies have are small sections of the window. One that covers the entire window would have problems. First, as has been noted already, you need special glass. You need a projector that is tuned for the curve of the windshield. The display may suffer from 'flare' if it gets hit with oncoming headlights. It sounds cool, but may not be anything near practical.

The idea of a global village is wrong, it's more like a gazillion pub bars.
Phage

dvd changer...why? (4.00 / 2) (#27)
by rebelcool on Thu Nov 15, 2001 at 11:22:31 PM EST

i could understand if you were trekking the family along the roads and you want to keep the kids entertained...however, the wrangler is no family vehicle...

Certainly, i dont want to be on the road with someone who watches movies and drives at the same time... why not chug a bottle of whiskey while you're at it.

COG. Build your own community. Free, easy, powerful. Demo site

I dont drink whiskey (none / 0) (#29)
by japhar81 on Fri Nov 16, 2001 at 09:32:54 AM EST

too weak... I'm all about the moonshine. Actually, I have the changer for the passengers to watch, its not a family vehicle, no, but there's 4 people in the car regularly. Headrest mounted LCDs for the rear seat, front head for my map, dash lcd for passenger.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
You might want to read this (5.00 / 5) (#28)
by wiredog on Fri Nov 16, 2001 at 07:51:58 AM EST

From Dr Dobbs. An article for embedded programmers (don't worry, there's no code here (but there is some algebra)) on how far your car moves while you're reading. Some quotes below.
You'll find highway speeds work out to 50 feet per word. Perhaps you have seen drivers in the other lane engrossed in the morning paper? A 24-word paragraph covers 1200 feet, about 1/4 mile.
So it takes 1/3 mile to read the previous sentence.
Reading speed decreases when the text appears on a monitor, drops drastically for small-screen text that's not aligned with your eyes, and falls further if you must first find the text on the screen. A few interesting science fair projects spring immediately to mind, don't they?

Pop Quiz: Experimentally determine how long it takes to read an SMS popup on a wireless PDA. Convert the result to feet and compare with your typical following distance. stopping distance goes up as the square of speed. If it takes 100 feet to stop at 40 mph, expect to cover 400 feet at 80 mph. That's why speed kills.



If there's a choice between performance and ease of use, Linux will go for performance every time. -- Jerry Pournelle
Been watching Knight Rider lately? (4.00 / 1) (#30)
by Spatula on Fri Nov 16, 2001 at 10:20:06 AM EST

Sounds like you want KITT on ritalin. I suggest you leave out the nitro and the annoying British accent.

Ever seen Cannonball Run? Check out the car that Jackie Chan is in. That is 1337 enough for you, I guess. However, if you get such a car working, post it. I'm really interested in what you can accomplish, especially with a Jeep.

My immediate suggestion: get a very good insurance plan, and someone who knows a hell of a lot about interior automotive renovation, as this will most definitely stress your available occupant space. Furthermore, I also suggest that you invest in a quality theft deterrent system. Mainly because honking horns and flashing lights don't mean shit to someone who's trying to gank your CD player. Think 'flamethrower'. ;)

Good luck.
--
someday I'll find something to put here.
security (none / 0) (#31)
by japhar81 on Fri Nov 16, 2001 at 12:24:58 PM EST

I think you missed my other post, I have a tazer security system, shocks the sh!t out of people. Apparently, not many approve.

<H6>Rome is always burning, and the younger generation never respects its elders. The time of your second coming, japhar81, is no exception. -- Aphasia</H6&gt
[ Parent ]
And rightly so... (3.00 / 1) (#38)
by lucius on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 12:54:36 PM EST

From what you described in the thread above it shocks people who brush against the car.

I almost hope the ridiculous featurama you're trying to build into it causes you to hit a tree, damaging the tazer system which will then stop you from getting out of the car and calling for help.

You, sir, are worse than Hitler

[ Parent ]

Hitler = person who values property? (none / 0) (#40)
by Redemption042 on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 02:36:01 PM EST

Hitler? okay now... See, I understand you're trying to make a point by overemphazing his evilness, but hitler? For god sakes, the man slaughtered 6 million people like cattle! You're comparing someone who has a different value system then your own to a person who started world war two? For god sakes...

[ Parent ]
Godwin's Law invoked (none / 0) (#41)
by kubalaa on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 03:15:15 PM EST

;)

[ Parent ]
Please forgive this question (none / 0) (#42)
by Redemption042 on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 05:47:19 PM EST

Is that the one where hitler or nazis will inevitably be brought up in an argument? Like in office space? Also, please forgive me my earlier rant. I think it bears mentioning that I was just woken up involuntarily after only three hours of sleep :-P

[ Parent ]
what is Godwin's Law (none / 0) (#47)
by kubalaa on Sun Nov 18, 2001 at 05:28:51 AM EST

As usual the jargon file provides a helpful explanation.

[ Parent ]
Calm down.... (none / 0) (#51)
by lucius on Mon Nov 19, 2001 at 05:13:43 AM EST

It's a line from the Simpsons.

Just a little innocent hyperbole. But I stand by my assesment of this man as a selfish threat to society.

And yes, I'm sure it's a man.

[ Parent ]
Sorry. (none / 0) (#53)
by Redemption042 on Mon Nov 19, 2001 at 04:54:59 PM EST

Wow... A simpson quote and I didn't recognize it. Yeah, once again I over reacted. And I gues I could see how you could view someone who cares more about property then human life as a selfish person. But let me ask you a question. Do you view all human life sacred?

[ Parent ]
here's an idea (2.66 / 3) (#34)
by tarsand on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 01:33:05 AM EST

Why don't you do something useful with that money instead of wasting it on a vehicle? If you've already managed to fufill all of your needs with the blood of the workers, try giving some back.


"Oh, no, I agree with tarsand!" -- trhurler
heh. (4.00 / 1) (#37)
by session on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 12:15:32 PM EST

just when i thought it was possible for kuro5hin to actually have a decent tech-related article that didn't involve "oppressing the workers" or "fuck foreign governments" or [insert retarded and uninformed political propoganda here], you have to come in and fuck it up. it's people like you that make me not read kuro5hin anymore. the only reason i caught this article was the sidebar from freshmeat.

furthermore... since all wealth is obviously obtained "with the blood of the workers", shouldn't you be giving something back as well? oh that's right, you probably consider yourself "one of the workers". poor baby. here, let me give you $5 so you can buy a sandwich. it's a shame that employers hire people and pay them in return for their productivity. damn shame.


"I don't know, Marge. I was raised on the TV and I turned out pretty TV." --homer.
[ Parent ]

drumroll please (none / 0) (#39)
by tarsand on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 02:11:51 PM EST

I used that wording just to catch idiots such as yourself. I think it's a waste of money personally, but oh well. YHBT.


"Oh, no, I agree with tarsand!" -- trhurler
[ Parent ]
HUDs are not really safe (4.00 / 1) (#36)
by neophile on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 07:57:18 AM EST

that's probably why you cannot find one easily. They may have looked good in 80's movies, but they go against everything in human factors design. (I took a course on this in college, but don't recall all the details right now) They divide your attention and compromise visibility. Would your insurance company even let you have one? Something to check in to...

Factory-installed HUDs (none / 0) (#56)
by csmacd on Fri Dec 28, 2001 at 10:24:41 AM EST

Several Pontiac cars have HUDs in them. As I recall, it is available on the Bonneville, Grand Prix, and Firebird models.

I've got one on my Grand Prix, and have had no problems with it. It is small, just showing speed, turn signal, and cd track/radio station.

The real problem I see with this kind of HUD is that you get hooked - I find myself looking for the HUD whenever I drive a car that doesn't have one...

[ Parent ]
OT: Geek, Geek, Geek, Geek, Geek, Geek, Geek! (1.00 / 1) (#43)
by br284 on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 06:30:29 PM EST

I doubt that the people who read and frequent sports and football sites talk about where they can get the jockiest equipment and how would a jock throw a ball. Why do the geeks need to do something analogous? It (the geek chic) was humorous, say around 1998, but since then it has gotten annoying.

:-P

-Chris

Info (none / 0) (#45)
by Phillip Asheo on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 09:29:22 PM EST

For logging performance data from your vehicle you might want to check out PI Research It can record all kinds of telemetry data, including lateral G.

A lot of club racers use this kind of equipment. It isn't cheap though.

And if I were you, I would disarm that tazer tonight. I can cite plenty of case law, but I suspect you wouldn't listen. Trust me, you will live to regret it, if anyone ever hurts themselves on that vehicle.

--
"Never say what you can grunt. Never grunt what you can wink. Never wink what you can nod, never nod what you can shrug, and don't shrug when it ain't necessary"
-Earl Long

And another one. (none / 0) (#46)
by Phillip Asheo on Sat Nov 17, 2001 at 09:31:58 PM EST

I forgot to mention Stack Instruments. They also do similar stuff to PI

--
"Never say what you can grunt. Never grunt what you can wink. Never wink what you can nod, never nod what you can shrug, and don't shrug when it ain't necessary"
-Earl Long

An inspiring link for y'all (none / 0) (#49)
by rehan on Sun Nov 18, 2001 at 11:17:29 PM EST

This person has done an amazing job with their car. And what's even cooler is that it's a self-build.

Also, for people with a tad less wonga than this chap, you can get much cheaper lcds for mounting in headrests and the like


Stay Frosty and Alert


Suggested add-on to your car (4.00 / 1) (#52)
by jd on Mon Nov 19, 2001 at 12:24:12 PM EST

If you have a computer with enough spare cycles, then have it sample the car's sound, under different conditions. Then recall those sounds, using the sensor data, and play them back at 180' out of phase, from the same points you did the recording(s) at.

The car will now be completely silent. With enough data points, inside and out, nobody could tell the car was even running. Well, apart from the fact that it was moving.

As an extension to this, test-drive some utterly different vehicle. A motor-bike would be great for this! Or a lawn-mower. Place microphones as close to the same positions on this other vehicle. These can then be used as a "substitute" sound for your dream car.

Interesting but no? (none / 0) (#54)
by mesh on Tue Nov 20, 2001 at 04:53:33 AM EST

Interesting idea, but I don't think it would work. A large amount of a car's "noise" is just that, noise, so it will be random. Hence playing it out of phase isn't really going to assist, as the sound coming out of the car won't be the same as the inverse of what's coming out of the speakers. With certain less random sounds (lower frequency perhaps?) it might be possible.

You'll also have problems with positioning if you're having more than one passenger. Still, a kind of cool idea.

[ Parent ]
Help with high-tech car building | 56 comments (48 topical, 8 editorial, 0 hidden)
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