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[P]
Some Questions & Comments About Firefox 3.5

By Trollaxor in Technology
Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 05:11:07 PM EST
Tags: Firefox, Open Source, Trollaxor (all tags)

I have to say that Firefox is getting a lot worse lately. The user experience is in serious need of improvement and development is the pits. I installed the latest "big deal" Firefox update on June 30th. (For some reason they skipped a full four secondary updates, but whatever.) Upon restarting, which took several minutes, I began using Firefox 3.5.

[Note: This story appears with proper formatting in canonical at http://www.trollaxor.com/2009/07/some-questions-comments-about-firefox.html.]


At first, Firefox seemed strangely familiar. I thought they had changed very little unnecessarily until I visited the Acid3 test. Lo and behold, I was still using Firefox 3.0.0.11. What the fuck? I manually invoked Check for Updates... and repeated my first attempt only to find, upon restarting, the same thing.

Finally in desperation I downloaded the installer manually from Mozilla. The install ran surprisingly quickly and, after a few minutes, I was launched with the new version. I had to check, though, because again I thought it looked like very little had changed.

In fact, did Mozilla bother changing anything beside the JavaScript? The new TraceMonkey is great and all, but they could have at least made it look like they were working on something else. When the most noticeable improvement is the "Know Your Rights" button (which everyone ignores) one really starts to wonder what the fuss was all about.

Well, after the three tries it took to upgrade, I found my profile wouldn't migrate. This was a mess, but I was able to eventually retrieve my bookmarks from a long, arcane file path in a hidden directory. But then upon visiting my bookmarked sites I found that almost none of my add-ons are compatible with it. Therefore my browser is almost entirely functionless.

The bookmark tool itself could use a polishing. It's a mess and has been since version 1.0. If a browser is meant to render and organize content, Firefox surely falls down in this area. Why does it take me several minutes to slosh through the GUI just to make a new folder and alphabetize some bookmarks in it? Not to mention the damned Bookmarks toolbar, which takes up too much damn space and can't be turned off.

And speaking of the GUI, it's slow as Hell slow--get rid of the proprietary XUL and just hardcode the damned interface already!

I also have to mention memory use. On my system, Firefox was swallowing an incredible 400 MB with only a simple HTML 4 table open. 400 MB?! I blame this on the Firefox team's use of C++, where memory management is about as easy as herding cats. Likewise Firefox is a slow, bloated nightmare. (For a contrast, there's Safari, which is written in Objective C and is very small and efficient.)

Most of the time I have heavy JavaScript sites open. I shudder to think how much Firefox eats then, and I'll be sure to check in the future. No wonder my system tends to slow down when I've left Firefox open for days on end with dynamically updating pages and RSS feeds. Clearly, Firefox leaks memory like a cracked sieve in a waterfall.

With Firefox smelling more and more like crapware, I started to dig a little, first on Wikipedia and then on the Mozilla Development Forums. It turns out that my observations are part of a larger pattern of Firefox quality issues and development customs. The Mozilla developers are a bunch of arrogant, abusive shitheads.

For starters, they're still running all tabs in the same process. This is something IE7 and Safari 3 have had right for years. So if a plugin crashes or a page takes forever to finish rendering, everything's stuck. You can't even switch tabs to another page! And Firefox 3.5 is a "milestone" release? Firefox 3.6 and 4 are milestones too, and process-per-tab isn't scheduled for either.

Developer interaction with Firefox users is stilted too. Sometimes Bugzilla reports are dismissed out of hand, only to be reopened when something goes terribly wrong later. I also saw instances of reported security flaws sitting years before being patched. In one case, someone released an exploit to point out the deep holes in Firefox before anyone did anything.

One time, a user with some programming experience suggested a way to circumvent a bug to the wishlist. One programmer, whom I will not publicly name, suggested the user submit patches "once his balls dropped," if he were even male. If this were a real company and not a bunch of arrogant hacker hippies, user antagonism and sexism would never be acceptable. When I read this particular incident I uninstalled Firefox for good.

If anyone else has complaints about Firefox, post them here. For a browser that's taken nearly a third of the market, it's doing so with an incredibly broken development model and backend. Just imagine if the Firefox team actually treated its users right or prioritized projects properly. Maybe then the web would move beyond the mess of incompatibile standards and site hacks it is today.

Until then, Firefox is just another out-of-control Open Source project that needs a good stiff slap in the face.

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Display: Sort:
Some Questions & Comments About Firefox 3.5 | 68 comments (55 topical, 13 editorial, 0 hidden)
x-box sux, ps3 rulz. (2.50 / 2) (#2)
by spooky wookie on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 06:02:24 AM EST



I love the Wii. (3.00 / 2) (#6)
by Trollaxor on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 09:12:34 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Wee /nt (3.00 / 2) (#7)
by spooky wookie on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 12:47:42 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Hay, Trolloxar! (3.00 / 11) (#3)
by Vampire Zombie Abu Musab al Zarqawi on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 08:30:21 AM EST

Looks like RMS has decided to join the good fight and is now trolling the open sores "community".

Thank for the interesting link. (3.00 / 6) (#4)
by Trollaxor on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 08:45:26 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Could you please explain (3.00 / 2) (#8)
by channel on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 06:59:57 PM EST

the psychology of two phallic letters placed next together and called a "wee?"

This is the signature line that appears underneath my comments on kuro5hin.org.
wait wtf (3.00 / 2) (#11)
by channel on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 08:04:37 PM EST

wasn't this a story about videogame consoles?

This is the signature line that appears underneath my comments on kuro5hin.org.
[ Parent ]
It was but it was rewritten (none / 1) (#15)
by Armstrong Hammer on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 08:53:39 PM EST

by Trollaxor. I guess he Trollaxored you then?
Learn about the true liberal agenda in the United States of America.

[ Parent ]
yes, i guess he did (3.00 / 2) (#16)
by channel on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 10:24:06 PM EST

something like that, anyway

This is the signature line that appears underneath my comments on kuro5hin.org.
[ Parent ]
Chrome wins (2.50 / 4) (#12)
by channel on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 08:08:10 PM EST



This is the signature line that appears underneath my comments on kuro5hin.org.
Opera {[nt (3.00 / 2) (#18)
by Stick Apart on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 12:10:50 AM EST


-------
JOIN THE RAY ECKSON CLUB
[ Parent ]
Topical comment? (3.00 / 4) (#17)
by errgh on Thu Jul 09, 2009 at 10:44:25 PM EST

I enjoy how the mozilla bug window will open at random times asking to quit or restart firefox in an effort to diagnose a bug - while I am still browsing. sure, let me stop what im doing so that you can fix this broken heap of a memory hog... what is this a public library???!?!

Clearly they're not serving their target market (3.00 / 4) (#19)
by MichaelCrawford on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 12:44:50 AM EST

They should have waited until Firefox was feature-complete and well-tested before releasing it.


--

Live your fucking life. Sue someone on the Internet. Write a fucking music player. Like the great man Michael David Crawford has shown us all: Hard work, a strong will to stalk, and a few fries short of a happy meal goes a long way. -- bride of spidy


i was down in chinatown (3.00 / 12) (#22)
by Empedocles on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 02:00:17 AM EST

searching for the freshest fish to be found several days ago. as i browsed the collection of fine edible flesh purveyed by this particularly odoriferous stablishment, i happened to glance down at a cooler located on the floor, next to the tilapia tank.

inside were dozens of frogs, wholly intact and possibly even alive. i kicked the tank to ascertain the status of the crowded amphibians, and upon seeing several of them move listlessly concluded that they were indeed alive.

as i gazed upon this green mass, i had a revelation: SEVERAL DOZEN FROGS COULD FINISH OGGFROG FASTER THAN CRAWFORD. i stopped to steep in my brilliance for a moment. i reminded myself that i went to caltech, had the mind of a genius, and that my father was in the navy.

i then purchased all the frogs extant and put them to work. they finished oggfrog the next day. smart little fuckers.

---
And I think it's gonna be a long long time
'Till touch down brings me 'round again to find
I'm not the man they think I am at home

[ Parent ]

-1 oggfrog is not about frogs (3.00 / 7) (#23)
by channel on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 02:09:55 AM EST

it's about playing oggvorbis audio files on your commodore 64.

This is the signature line that appears underneath my comments on kuro5hin.org.
[ Parent ]
I don't understand this k5 meme. (3.00 / 6) (#24)
by Trollaxor on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 02:18:46 AM EST



[ Parent ]
Apparently there is a lot you don't understand (1.50 / 2) (#53)
by Armstrong Hammer on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 08:27:51 PM EST

Ogg frog is the type of software that is developed to be ported to such platforms as the Commodore 64.

Because of the number of platforms that Ogg Frog supports, it will take a long time to reach the golden 1.0 RTM status and then be shipped for all supported platforms.

Learn about the true liberal agenda in the United States of America.

[ Parent ]
Impossible. (none / 1) (#55)
by Trollaxor on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 08:53:47 PM EST

Perhaps some of the underlying engine, but the "app" itself would not be portable between, say, Mac OS X or Windows and C64.

[ Parent ]
It is possible (none / 0) (#58)
by Armstrong Hammer on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 10:42:15 PM EST

Using the 6502 based C Compiler if Michael Crawford sticks to C based code in the C++ compiler and follows the rules of that web site for 6502 based C programs.

He'd need to port Z-Lib to the 6502 C based environment, which is not entirely impossible to do. Then he'd have to maintain a C based version of Ogg Frog for machines that don't have a C++ based compiler. Then he can develop Ogg Frog for any 6502 based technology including the Commodore 64, Apple II, Atari 800XL, etc.

Just keep in mind every platform he adds in support for will delay him two years for that Ogg Frog 1.0 public release.

The Commodore 64 is always being developed for including this Twitter Client for the C64 and Commodore 64 owners want modern programs for their aging platform and are well known to add on Ethernet and other devices to it.

Learn about the true liberal agenda in the United States of America.

[ Parent ]
6502 is way too slow for Vorbis (none / 1) (#64)
by pin0cchio on Sat Jul 25, 2009 at 09:38:24 PM EST

The 6502-family CPU in the C64 and Apple II is specified to run at 45/44 = 1.023 MHz, which means a Vorbis decoder would need to spit out a sample every 11.6 cycles in order to keep up with 44100 Hz stereo. A 6502, with no multiply instruction, just can't IDCT that fast. Speex at 8000 Hz mono would have 127 cycles per output sample, which is slightly less absurd.
lj65
[ Parent ]
lol c++ (3.00 / 5) (#20)
by anaesthetica on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 12:54:33 AM EST

invention of c++

—I'm the little engine that didn't.
k5: our trolls go to eleven
[A]S FAR AS A PERSON'S ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, IT IS NOT TRUE THAT NOTHING BUT GOOD COMES FROM GOOD AND NOTHING BUT EVIL COMES FROM EVIL, BUT RATHER QUITE FREQUENTLY THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT REALIZE THIS IS IN FACT A MERE CHILD IN POLITICAL MATTERS. max weber, politics as a vocation


rofl $ (none / 1) (#33)
by localroger on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 01:36:10 PM EST



And that is what is so great about the internet. It enables pompous blowhards to connect with other pompous blowhards in a vast circle jerk of pomposity. -- Bill Maher
[ Parent ]
Thank you for the interesting link, sir. (3.00 / 2) (#34)
by Trollaxor on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 03:45:13 PM EST



[ Parent ]
Actually Safari's HTML engine is C++ (3.00 / 2) (#21)
by MichaelCrawford on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 01:57:37 AM EST

... because it uses the KDE HTML widget, and KDE is based on Qt, which is C++.

Possibly the rest of the UI is Objective-C though.

Actually memory management in C++ is quite easy, largely automatic and painless - once you understand the way it needs to be done. Google for RAII.


--

Live your fucking life. Sue someone on the Internet. Write a fucking music player. Like the great man Michael David Crawford has shown us all: Hard work, a strong will to stalk, and a few fries short of a happy meal goes a long way. -- bride of spidy


bull (3.00 / 4) (#26)
by boxed on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 04:30:08 AM EST

The part about memory management that is. The entire reason "memory leak" is in the common vocabulary is because of C and C++. Double deletes and memory leaks are rife in all code bases that are non-trivial, and people can't even understand how std::auto_ptr works, even after you explain it to them multiple times (not to mention the implementation in VC6 that is 100% broken, which confuses everyone even more).

[ Parent ]
RAII is the limp-wristed solution (3.00 / 3) (#31)
by ksandstr on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 11:31:35 AM EST

The actual thing that needs to be done to specify object lifetimes rigorously. "It'll be deleted at some time" just trades memory leaks for reference leaks -- which is the same bloody thing, just more difficult to debug in a prototype.

Java faggots will obviously disagree, but they are limp-wristed people whose balls touch other balls on a regular basis, so I'll categorically disregard that bull.

Fin.
[ Parent ]

why do you disparage homosexual programmers? (3.00 / 3) (#36)
by lostincali on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 05:29:09 PM EST

if you weren't such an ignorant prick, you'd know that almost the entire linux kernel and userland were written by desperate, cock-lusting homosexuals.

"The least busy day [at McDonalds] is Monday, and then sales increase throughout the week, I guess as enthusiasm for life dwindles."
[ Parent ]

Because they take it up the bum /nt (3.00 / 2) (#38)
by ksandstr on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 06:08:30 PM EST



Fin.
[ Parent ]
Finnish bigot (3.00 / 2) (#41)
by tetsuwan on Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 01:58:16 AM EST


Njal's Saga: Just like Romeo & Juliet without the romance
[ Parent ]

so are you one of those self-hating swedes? (none / 0) (#46)
by lostincali on Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 12:44:07 PM EST


"The least busy day [at McDonalds] is Monday, and then sales increase throughout the week, I guess as enthusiasm for life dwindles."
[ Parent ]

So does your Girlfriend.... (none / 0) (#57)
by cs668 on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 10:40:11 PM EST



[ Parent ]
No. (3.00 / 2) (#32)
by Trollaxor on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 12:22:57 PM EST

Apple rewrote it in Obj C, just like they did the Finder for Snow Leopard. I hear they're doing the kernel next.

[ Parent ]
not anymore (3.00 / 4) (#35)
by anaesthetica on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 05:06:15 PM EST

Now that brainfuck has a compiler written in brainfuck I hear they're migrating darwin code over and re-opening the source

—I'm the little engine that didn't.
k5: our trolls go to eleven
[A]S FAR AS A PERSON'S ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, IT IS NOT TRUE THAT NOTHING BUT GOOD COMES FROM GOOD AND NOTHING BUT EVIL COMES FROM EVIL, BUT RATHER QUITE FREQUENTLY THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT REALIZE THIS IS IN FACT A MERE CHILD IN POLITICAL MATTERS. max weber, politics as a vocation


[ Parent ]
Of course the way programs work (none / 0) (#54)
by Armstrong Hammer on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 08:29:44 PM EST

and are developed part of them can be in C++ while the rest is in Objective-C and then linked together by linkers from their OBJ object codes.

Safari is a floor wax and desert topping, it is both, two two two in one!

Learn about the true liberal agenda in the United States of America.

[ Parent ]
time to hand in your tech ID (2.80 / 5) (#28)
by ccdotnet on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 08:33:08 AM EST

Why is it if someone installs Vista within a week of its release they're an impatient moron, because they can't wait a few months for a patch likely to improve stability/security/performance, yet installing Firefox 3.5 the day it goes out the door makes you a genius?

It's 3.5(.0) - what did you expect? See the .11 at the end of 3.0.11? That means it works. How about sticking with that one for a month or two?

Yes, FF has been bloated and overly ram hungry for quite a while, but take a serious look at your alternatives and prove any of them are better.

Did you even read the whole article? (none / 1) (#40)
by lostincali on Fri Jul 10, 2009 at 06:46:56 PM EST

Yes, FF has been bloated and overly ram hungry for quite a while, but take a serious look at your alternatives and prove any of them are better.

The author gave several specific examples of competing web browsers outperfoming Firefox, e.g., Safari (not written in C++, doesn't use the stupid monolithic process model).

"The least busy day [at McDonalds] is Monday, and then sales increase throughout the week, I guess as enthusiasm for life dwindles."
[ Parent ]

performance v. usability (none / 1) (#44)
by ccdotnet on Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 05:04:45 AM EST

Straight-line performance doesn't really compensate for a poor overall user experience though does it.

Are you actually saying Safari is a credible alternate browser, ie: do you actually use it all day every day as your primary browser? Didn't think so.

[ Parent ]

My boss is a Chrome fan (none / 0) (#65)
by pin0cchio on Sat Jul 25, 2009 at 09:46:13 PM EST

Are you actually saying Safari is a credible alternate browser, ie: do you actually use it all day every day as your primary browser?
No, but my boss at work uses Chrome as his primary browser. It uses a process for each open page to isolate it from plug-in crashes in another open page.
lj65
[ Parent ]
I have to say, it is a credible replacement for me (none / 0) (#67)
by anaesthetica on Tue Aug 04, 2009 at 11:59:52 AM EST

Safari 4 made Apple's offering competitive with Firefox 3.5.  There are only one or two areas that are still problematic in Safari.  Animated gifs are handled really poorly by Safari, whereas Firefox does a decent job with them.  The other really noticeable area is the extensions, obviously.  The one that I really miss is Linky, which makes browsing 4chan much easier.

Safari starts up much faster than Firefox. It also has the Top Sites feature, which I didn't give a crap about at first, but after playing around with the Safari 4 public beta (tabs on top version), I found that I had really gotten used to it.  Firefox's analogous feature is still in development, and makes opening new tabs unbearably slow.  Finally, Safari has full-text search through your history, which is an acceptable trade-off for not having Firefox's AwesomeBar.

—I'm the little engine that didn't.
k5: our trolls go to eleven
[A]S FAR AS A PERSON'S ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, IT IS NOT TRUE THAT NOTHING BUT GOOD COMES FROM GOOD AND NOTHING BUT EVIL COMES FROM EVIL, BUT RATHER QUITE FREQUENTLY THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT REALIZE THIS IS IN FACT A MERE CHILD IN POLITICAL MATTERS. max weber, politics as a vocation


[ Parent ]
There is like 500 extensions available (none / 1) (#42)
by Ron Paul on Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 04:09:44 AM EST

to do your bookmarks if you want to try another one.

This [Ron Paul] Diary! has brought Kuro5hin back to life! HUZZAH


That's true, but is not an excuse. (3.00 / 3) (#45)
by Trollaxor on Sat Jul 11, 2009 at 09:48:01 AM EST

Oh, hey, I'm GM and I'll just put shit engines in my smaller cars and when they blow their head gaskets in a few years, well, there are plenty of other engines out there you can install yourself so don't complain!

[ Parent ]
Um, engines aren't free. Firefox addons are. (none / 0) (#52)
by tweet on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 03:35:51 PM EST


_______________________________________________
Not everything in black and white makes sense.

[ Parent ]

fiefox 3.5 takes... (none / 0) (#47)
by mikelist on Sun Jul 12, 2009 at 10:22:01 AM EST

...5 minutes to open on my machine.i have never used internet explorer as it was the lesser of two browsers. that really could change, if it hasn't already. in order for it to be worse than the current firefox, it would have to go outside and flatten your tires, back in and unplug your refrigerator.


Slow Fx startup is probably bug 501605 (none / 0) (#66)
by pin0cchio on Sat Jul 25, 2009 at 09:54:41 PM EST

...5 minutes to open on my machine
The SSL implementation in some builds of Firefox plunders Windows Internet Explorer's cache for random number seeds. After 3.5.0, developers discovered that this can take a while (bug 501605). To speed it up, try clearing IE's cache. On my machine, it's in Start > Control Panel > Internet Options > General > Browsing history > Delete. Another is to run Disk Cleanup: Start > Run... type cleanmgr and press Enter.
i have never used internet explorer as it was the lesser of two browsers.
You might have used IE (and populated its cache) by using the browser built into some other app, or by using Windows Update.
lj65
[ Parent ]
Works like a charm here (none / 0) (#48)
by Peaker on Sun Jul 12, 2009 at 03:01:35 PM EST

Firefox 3.5 seems to not get stuck when any of the tabs get stuck, in contrast to older Firefox releases, so maybe they did fix the single-process issue?

It is also reasonably fast, and Flash stuff seems nicer.

Also, the open video stuff in HTML5 is really really late and "Save Video as.." with properly functioning video is finally here.

Oh come on (3.00 / 3) (#49)
by the77x42 on Sun Jul 12, 2009 at 04:00:57 PM EST

This isn't even a good troll. I'm going to bite though since some people might actually take what you say to be true. Well, maybe it is a good troll then.

Upgrading is as easy as going to Help > Check for Updates... It works on the first try.

Bookmark organization is simple. Right-click to create folders and sort by name. What could be easier?

The bookmark toolbar can be hidden by going to View > Toolbars and unchecking Bookmarks Toolbar.

One HTML tab (your story) takes up only 37MB of RAM, which is 5MB less than the previous Firefox release.


"We're not here to educate. We're here to point and laugh." - creature
"You have some pretty stupid ideas." - indubitable ‮

view -> toolbars -> bookmarks toolbar .nt. (none / 0) (#50)
by DK4 Bloo on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 04:16:34 AM EST



chrome is on the rise (none / 1) (#51)
by totmacher on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 03:01:52 PM EST

brave to the carefully crafted troll

-- I'll sum it up for yo: You = Douche bag ~ Butthurtapotamus
Memory in Fx3.5 (none / 1) (#56)
by anaesthetica on Mon Jul 13, 2009 at 08:59:24 PM EST

Actually, the memory usage in Firefox 3.5 is significantly better than in Chrome, Opera, and Safari.

The "Firefox is a memory hog" troll is more and more obsolete with each release.

—I'm the little engine that didn't.
k5: our trolls go to eleven
[A]S FAR AS A PERSON'S ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, IT IS NOT TRUE THAT NOTHING BUT GOOD COMES FROM GOOD AND NOTHING BUT EVIL COMES FROM EVIL, BUT RATHER QUITE FREQUENTLY THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT REALIZE THIS IS IN FACT A MERE CHILD IN POLITICAL MATTERS. max weber, politics as a vocation


Bye (3.00 / 2) (#59)
by mfinn999 on Wed Jul 15, 2009 at 12:09:35 PM EST

...When I read this particular incident I uninstalled Firefox for good.

Good Riddance.

That's a really helpful attitude (3.00 / 3) (#60)
by lostincali on Wed Jul 15, 2009 at 07:23:14 PM EST

reminds me of all the "help" that I got from ubuntu people when I joined their IRC channel to ask a question about a bug in one of their xorg drivers. when users get frustrated after having their legitimate questions answered with calls of "RTFM n00b" and "why don't you google it?", the response is "good riddance!". it's really no mystery why Internet Explorer still holds a majority of the browser market.

"The least busy day [at McDonalds] is Monday, and then sales increase throughout the week, I guess as enthusiasm for life dwindles."
[ Parent ]

It's not about C++ (none / 0) (#61)
by m50d on Thu Jul 16, 2009 at 10:44:42 AM EST

Konqueror is beautifully fast, written in C++. Likewise I believe for opera. The fundamental problem is simply bad code (four different ways of allocating memory, so I hear, left over from the netscape days), which is caused by the developer arrogance you mention and too much emphasis on adding new features (compare seamonkey, which has had time to mature and clean up the code, and performs a lot better), and the design mistakes you mention - the XUL UI (observe that e.g. Epiphany and Galeon, using exactly the same rendering engine, are much faster), and the emphasis on extensions (which impede security and lead to memory leaks).

YET ANOTHER OPEN SORES FAILURE (none / 1) (#62)
by I Did It All For The Horse Cock on Sun Jul 19, 2009 at 06:51:46 PM EST




\\\
  \ \        ^.^._______  This comment brought to you by the penis-nosed fox!
    \\______/_________|_)
    / /    \ \
    \_\_    \ \

This post depicts the decadance of k5 (none / 0) (#63)
by spiros on Fri Jul 24, 2009 at 05:42:44 PM EST

An opinion is like a nose... Everybody has one, but some have very ugly ones....

Opera (none / 0) (#68)
by k31 on Sat Aug 15, 2009 at 11:14:39 PM EST

I like opera.

It is also the most commercial of the browsers.

When you get something for free,
you often get the level of quality you paid for.

Since Opera is sold to mobile platforms, it has to be faster, less of a memory hog... cell phone may end up saving us all....


Your dollar is you only Word, the wrath of it your only fear. He who has an EAR to hear....

Some Questions & Comments About Firefox 3.5 | 68 comments (55 topical, 13 editorial, 0 hidden)
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